Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[MDK]

Matt, I commend your thoughts, and how you chose to write them.   I always 
admire people who speak clearly, but from the heart. 

I would like to add something, or perhaps just explain why I think this 
industry will never become the domain of a few large players.   Our industry 
requires a dedication to individual service.   Many in the beginning wanted a 
box to plant on the desk, so that NO interaction with the customer was needed.  
 Instead, we serve each customer individually.   Our deployments require that 
we learn and plot our coverage and service in place, on the ground, interacting 
with local people.  

There is no large company that can do that.We CARE about our own business, 
because it IS our own business, and thus, we CARE about our customers, 
something you cannot ever pay someone to do.   The employee who  can be paid to 
care, is indeed...rare.   Thus, we have entered an industry with a model based 
upon the highest ideal of business - that of true service.   The flakes will 
fail, the greedy will fail, only those with a true concern for doing what needs 
to be done, in return for a modest paycheck will be successful.   Some can 
instill or find that kind of employee to hire, but no HR department will 
accomplish it.  

I don't call us heroes... Certainly I am not anyone's hero.  I'm a villain, 
when the power fails at 8 pm on a school night, and everyone's connection dies. 
 But I do my best, and I really, DO care that someone needs and I have the 
means of meeting it, and so I get up and go out, missing my dinner, to get 
things back up and going. 

Any of you on this list who won't do that, you're the exception, not the rule.  
 I can with confidence that you have a passion to do things for other people... 
 And found a way to earn that paycheck... and meet the need.   I believe very 
few of you are in this, solely for the money.   

And I disagree about our image...  It should be a nameless, faceless guy, 
working out of his truck, doing the job for his neighbor, on a handshake.   
That's who we are, more than anything else.   It's who we should sell ourselves 
as, and in doing so, gain our customer's loyalty, as we're loyal to them. Our  
business operations, and our treatment of customers should reflect that, as 
well.  

I don't have the answer for the problems in DC.   I don't have the answer for 
how to get Congress and agencies to allow us to do what we know how to do, and 
have the answers for.   I just think we should be on the offensive, not the 
defensive, and seek to change the nature of the game.  

BTW, I read your site from time to time, it's quite good.   Keep it up.  



++
Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy
541-969-8200  509-386-4589
++


From: Matt Larsen - Lists 
Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 11:16 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


Scottie (and all other non-WISPA members on this list)

I would like to repost something that I put on the WISPA Members list and on my 
blog at Wirelesscowboys.com - the WISP Manifesto.

I am advocating that we should change our strategies to put together our own 
numbers, fight government programs that harm our businesses with taxpayer money 
and show the world that we are heroes to our communities.   I would really 
enjoy commentary from anyone on the list.   ML


(This email started out as a response to Brian Webster's email and went WAY off 
on a tangent, so I'm changing the subject - sorry!) 


Brian, I'm going to disagree with you on a couple of points here.   

 I think that you are mostly right, but you are accepting the framing of the 
issues as the telcos and politicians want them to be framed.   That there is no 
way that we can win a toe-to-toe slugging match for spectrum, but this is not 
about a full on, frontal attack.This is guerilla warfare, and the game is 
played by a completely different set of rules.

 Think of it from the wisp operator's point of view..

 1) We've been given essentially no spectrum (the junk bands that we 
use were around long before WISPs were), 

2)We get no government subsidies, despite the existence of stimulus and 
rural development programs for broadband deployment, which actually..

3)Pours billions of taxpayer dollars into our competition, the same 
competition that has either delivered low grade broadband or none at all.

4)The USF program allows telcos to impose additional "taxes" on their 
services to go into a giant government enabled slush fund that goes right back 
into their systems.  

5)RUS only lends to ILECs and will not work with multiple entities in 
an area 

6)We are asked to turn over highly detailed information about our 
subscriber bases, tower sites and anchor tenants as part of the broadband 
mapping programs - informa

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

You should read a bit more.  Their presentation Thursday (maybe Wednesday?)
would have been a real eye opener for you.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 11:58 PM, Scottie Arnett wrote:

>  All this bickering reminds me why I have NOT joined WISPA yet. Do not get
> me wrong, I DO agree with the bickering going on from KY and OH about
> Connect "whatever state inserted here"!  Same as what is happening in TN!
>
> In my own opinion, WISPA is trying to play Big boy, with a front for big
> boy!  I have been on the general list for a long time following the steps
> that WISPA has taken. IN the last few years, my perception is they want to
> BOW DOWN to the FCC on issues that the Big Boys decide on most issues. They
> are playing second fiddle to what most of us actually want. We want someone
> to standup at the FCC and say, "HEY, there are other ISP's besides cable and
> telephone co's! We are serving as much or more of the digitally divided ppl
> than the telco's are cable co's ever thought about!
>
> Of course we can all pay our $250 or whatever to WISPA and it will all go
> to Steve Coran! He loves us all for fighting this. The bigger fight, the
> more he gets paid, whether we win or not. How about funding the Steve that
> used to be a WISP and later became a  lawyer. He knows what we are and what
> we stand for?
>
> Side step from my bitching about WISPA, I am tired of competing against
> money that you, I, and everyone else in the USA has paid in on taxes. Just
> take a look at my area and what I have to compete against,  I could give
> WISPA $100,000 and probably still not survive!
>
> Twin Lakes Telephone Cooperative... got a total of $36 million in BIP/BTOP
> funding for FTTH, North Central Telephone Cooperative...gota total of $50
> million for FTTH in many areas that we were already covering and they were
> covering with FTTH. Windstream in KY got a total of $26 million to expand
> their coverage to everyone else outside of the city limits,
>
> What it comes down too, is how much a$$ you can kiss, and how much you can
> afford to pay! I may join Wispa tomorrow just in case they can take my $250
> and do something useful in my favor for once? It is typical politics, the
> ones that can pay the most, get their way. Why do you think the go has
> auctioned off the good freq that most of us COULD have competed against the
> BIG guys, but could not afford?
>
> Yea, classify me the same a bedfast, I am at that point, prove me
> different, and I will join him in a counter!
>
> Scott
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -
>
> *From:* Chuck Hogg 
> *To:* WISPA General List 
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 15, 2011 4:02 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules
>
> I didn't say that, but it is well known.
>
> Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
> Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
> be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
> think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
> Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
> my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
> CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
> them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
>  They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I
> didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product,
> satellite service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for
> Kentucky.  The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as
> soon as their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky
> Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.
>  Guess what happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do
> THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.
>
> I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
> promised were made by them.
>
> None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
> the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.
>
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:
>
>> Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front
>> for the Bells."
>> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this
>> list.  However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Scottie Arnett]

 I did my coverage with Connected TN about a year ago and have not heard from 
them since except for a revise.

Scott
  - Original Message - 
  From: Chuck Hogg 
  To: WISPA General List 
  Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 4:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


  I didn't say that, but it is well known.


  Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect 
Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to be 
listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly think I 
can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue, Bellsouth 
(AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in my area 
called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with CK, went 
to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed them how to 
use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.  They knew I had 
that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I didn't pay them the 
money, they referred them to an inferior product, satellite service.  They were 
provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.  The maps they did were 
immediately removed and taken offline as soon as their funding ran out.  It was 
done in spite of the Kentucky Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and 
they stole it from us all.  Guess what happened another year later?  Another 
company was hired to do THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got 
MILLIONS again.


  I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended 
promised were made by them.


  None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around the 
US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.

  Regards,

  Chuck



  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:

Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for 
the Bells."  

I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.  
However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for independent 
companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in general - they 
don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have some very 
knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much with them, 
you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.  

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC 




 
On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein  
wrote:

  At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
  >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
  >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
  >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
  >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
  >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
  >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.


  I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
  public forum, not official correspondence.

  It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
  Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
  independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
  them, because it hit home.

  Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
  list.  Not everything has to be somber.


  >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
  > wrote:
  > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
  > makes WISPA look.
  > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
  > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.


   --
   Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
   ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
   +1 617 795 2701




  

  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
  


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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Scottie Arnett]

All this bickering reminds me why I have NOT joined WISPA yet. Do not get me 
wrong, I DO agree with the bickering going on from KY and OH about Connect 
"whatever state inserted here"!  Same as what is happening in TN!

In my own opinion, WISPA is trying to play Big boy, with a front for big boy!  
I have been on the general list for a long time following the steps that WISPA 
has taken. IN the last few years, my perception is they want to BOW DOWN to the 
FCC on issues that the Big Boys decide on most issues. They are playing second 
fiddle to what most of us actually want. We want someone to standup at the FCC 
and say, "HEY, there are other ISP's besides cable and telephone co's! We are 
serving as much or more of the digitally divided ppl than the telco's are cable 
co's ever thought about!

Of course we can all pay our $250 or whatever to WISPA and it will all go to 
Steve Coran! He loves us all for fighting this. The bigger fight, the more he 
gets paid, whether we win or not. How about funding the Steve that used to be a 
WISP and later became a  lawyer. He knows what we are and what we stand for? 

Side step from my bitching about WISPA, I am tired of competing against money 
that you, I, and everyone else in the USA has paid in on taxes. Just take a 
look at my area and what I have to compete against,  I could give WISPA 
$100,000 and probably still not survive!

Twin Lakes Telephone Cooperative... got a total of $36 million in BIP/BTOP 
funding for FTTH, North Central Telephone Cooperative...gota total of $50 
million for FTTH in many areas that we were already covering and they were 
covering with FTTH. Windstream in KY got a total of $26 million to expand their 
coverage to everyone else outside of the city limits,

What it comes down too, is how much a$$ you can kiss, and how much you can 
afford to pay! I may join Wispa tomorrow just in case they can take my $250 and 
do something useful in my favor for once? It is typical politics, the ones that 
can pay the most, get their way. Why do you think the go has auctioned off the 
good freq that most of us COULD have competed against the BIG guys, but could 
not afford?

Yea, classify me the same a bedfast, I am at that point, prove me different, 
and I will join him in a counter!

Scott

 

- Original Message - 
  From: Chuck Hogg 
  To: WISPA General List 
  Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 4:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


  I didn't say that, but it is well known.


  Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect 
Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to be 
listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly think I 
can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue, Bellsouth 
(AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in my area 
called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with CK, went 
to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed them how to 
use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.  They knew I had 
that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I didn't pay them the 
money, they referred them to an inferior product, satellite service.  They were 
provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.  The maps they did were 
immediately removed and taken offline as soon as their funding ran out.  It was 
done in spite of the Kentucky Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and 
they stole it from us all.  Guess what happened another year later?  Another 
company was hired to do THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got 
MILLIONS again.


  I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended 
promised were made by them.


  None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around the 
US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.

  Regards,

  Chuck



  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:

Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for 
the Bells."  

I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.  
However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for independent 
companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in general - they 
don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have some very 
knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much with them, 
you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.  

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC 




 
On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein  
wrote:

  At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
  >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
  >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Ditto here!

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 5:02 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> I didn't say that, but it is well known.
>
> Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
> Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
> be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
> think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
> Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
> my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
> CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
> them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
>  They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I
> didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product,
> satellite service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for
> Kentucky.  The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as
> soon as their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky
> Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.
>  Guess what happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do
> THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.
>
> I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
> promised were made by them.
>
> None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
> the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.
>
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:
>
>> Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front
>> for the Bells."
>> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this
>> list.  However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
>> independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
>> general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
>> some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
>> with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.
>>
>> Dave Hannum
>> New Era Broadband, LLC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>>> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>>> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>>> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>>> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>>> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>>> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>>
>>> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
>>> public forum, not official correspondence.
>>>
>>> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
>>> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
>>> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
>>> them, because it hit home.
>>>
>>> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
>>> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>>>
>>> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
>>> > wrote:
>>> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
>>> > makes WISPA look.
>>> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
>>> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>>
>>>  --
>>>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>>>  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
>>>  +1 617 795 2701
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[David Hannum]

Sorry Chuck - did not mean to attribute to the wrong person.  Fred did say
it.  But none the less, here in Ohio, We've never been asked for a penny
from Connect Ohio other than when we hired Chip Spann via Connected Nation
to do some network design for us early on.  And perhaps CK opperates
different from CO.  I know they've been around a LOT longer.  I guess it's
kinda Fords.  You either love 'em or hate em, depending on your experiences
with them.  My main point is that not everyone has had such a negative
experience with CN, and in some cases, very good success working with them.


Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC




On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 5:25 PM, Fred Goldstein wrote:

>  At 1/15/2011 05:02 PM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>
> I didn't say that, but it is well known.
>
>
> I said it, and I stand by it, noting what Chuck said as an example.  Even
> before the federally-funded mapping projects, CK was operating -- it was the
> prototype for CN -- and it was referring people to BellSouth.  I think at
> the time it was a $20k fee to be listed.  $20k for BellSouth, $20k for a
> tiny local ISP.  Sort of a poll tax model.  Great for the big guys. But it's
> not the big guys who need someone to tell the public who provides service
> where they are.
>
>
> Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
> Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
> be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
> think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
> Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
> my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
> CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
> them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
> They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I didn't
> pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product, satellite
> service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.
> The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as soon as
> their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky Government.
> The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.  Guess what
> happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do THAT EXACT
> SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.
>
> I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
> promised were made by them.
>
> None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
> the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.
>
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:
>  Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front
> for the Bells."
> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.
> However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
> independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
> general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
> some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
> with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.
>
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein 
> wrote:
>  At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>
> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
> public forum, not official correspondence.
>
> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
> them, because it hit home.
>
> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>
> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
> >< j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
> > makes WISPA look.
> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>
>  --
>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>  ionary Consultinghttp://www.ionary.com/
>  +1 617 795 2701
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> --

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Fred Goldstein]

At 1/15/2011 05:02 PM, Chuck Hogg wrote:

I didn't say that, but it is well known.


I said it, and I stand by it, noting what Chuck said as an 
example.  Even before the federally-funded mapping projects, CK was 
operating -- it was the prototype for CN -- and it was referring 
people to BellSouth.  I think at the time it was a $20k fee to be 
listed.  $20k for BellSouth, $20k for a tiny local ISP.  Sort of a 
poll tax model.  Great for the big guys. But it's not the big guys 
who need someone to tell the public who provides service where they are.


Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to 
Connect Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a 
minimum $10k to be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a 
partner.  Do they honestly think I can afford either?  Guess who was 
partners? HughesNet, WildBlue, Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, 
Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in my area called them to 
see about access, even though I fully cooperated with CK, went to 
EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed them 
how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or 
WildBlue.  They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, 
but because I didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an 
inferior product, satellite service.  They were provided with 
MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.  The maps they did were 
immediately removed and taken offline as soon as their funding ran 
out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky Government.  The TAX 
PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.  Guess what 
happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do THAT 
EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.


I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open 
ended promised were made by them.


None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people 
around the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show 
their displeasure.


Regards,

Chuck


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum 
<oujas...@gmail.com> wrote:
Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying 
front for the Bells."
I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this 
list.  However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not 
more, for independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for 
Broadband in general - they don't play favorites at the high 
level.  However, they have some very knowledgible, dedicated 
wireless guys.  And if you work very much with them, you'd see that 
wireles is all those guys are about.


Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC





On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein 
<fgoldst...@ionary.com> wrote:

At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.

I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
public forum, not official correspondence.

It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
them, because it hit home.

Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
list.  Not everything has to be somber.

>On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
><j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
> makes WISPA look.
> > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
> businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.


 --
 Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
 ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
 +1 617 795 2701 


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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Chuck Hogg]

I didn't say that, but it is well known.

Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
 They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I
didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product,
satellite service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for
Kentucky.  The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as
soon as their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky
Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.
 Guess what happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do
THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.

I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
promised were made by them.

None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.

Regards,

Chuck


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:

> Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for
> the Bells."
> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.
> However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
> independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
> general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
> some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
> with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.
>
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein wrote:
>
>> At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>
>> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
>> public forum, not official correspondence.
>>
>> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
>> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
>> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
>> them, because it hit home.
>>
>> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
>> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>>
>> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
>> > wrote:
>> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
>> > makes WISPA look.
>> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
>> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>
>>  --
>>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>>  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
>>  +1 617 795 2701
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
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>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[David Hannum]

Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for
the Bells."
I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.
However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC





On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein wrote:

> At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>
> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
> public forum, not official correspondence.
>
> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
> them, because it hit home.
>
> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>
> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
> > makes WISPA look.
> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>
>  --
>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
>  +1 617 795 2701
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Remember, it was on the general list...

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:26 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> WISPA talks to the FCC.  How do you think they respond to us when we ask
> for something knowing we "allow" such actions?
> On Jan 14, 2011 11:50 PM, "RickG"  wrote:
> > Josh, you're comparing apples to oranges. AFAIK, CN is not a competitor
> nor
> > a member.
> >
> > On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> >
> >> WISPA is represented by its members.
> >>
> >> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a
> competitor?
> >>
> >> Josh Luthman
> >> Office: 937-552-2340
> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >> 1100 Wayne St
> >> Suite 1337
> >> Troy, OH 45373
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
> >>
> >>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is
> a
> >>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad
> people
> >>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things.
> Or was
> >>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own
> on
> >>> behalf of the enemy?
> >>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
> >>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a
> better
> >>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
> >>> Just my .02.
> >>>
> >>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>
> >>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
> >>>
>  The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
>  WISPA look.
> 
>  We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and businesses
>  or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>  On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>  http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
>  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
>  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> -RickG
>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>
> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > -RickG
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Fred Goldstein]

At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.

I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the 
public forum, not official correspondence.

It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the 
Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to 
independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let 
them, because it hit home.

Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this 
list.  Not everything has to be somber.

>On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content 
> makes WISPA look.
> > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and 
> businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.

  --
  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
  +1 617 795 2701 




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

I most certainly don't read every post.  Sorry I missed that important one.
On Jan 15, 2011 9:50 AM, "chris cooper"  wrote:
> Ive said good things about CO staff in the past. Check the archives.
> One of the CO staff work for Intelliwave previously. I know for a fact
> that he understands WISPS, wants us to succeed and really cares about
> getting broadband to rural subscribers.
>
> Chris Cooper
> Intelliwave LLC
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 11:38 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules
>
> Were you paid to say that or do you honestly feel that? That would
> definitely be a first praise to my ears.
> On Jan 15, 2011 9:26 AM, "David Hannum"  wrote:
>> Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has
> been.
>> We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here. We've
> had
>> great support for our wireless efforts . . . everything from design
> and
>> engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects
> with.
>> If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
>> independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann
> and Bart
>> Winegar among them. As for the meeting that Robert was refering to,
> here in
>> Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking,
> helps me
>> or any other provider. They are offering training for folks who are
> not
>> versed in the Internet to drive adoption. Then, then in exchange for
>> providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the
> class,
>> they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.
> That's
>> what was presented to Robert. I don't see why he was so offended by
> that
>> proposition.
>>
>> Again, it's all in your perception. All I can say is that we have
> found
>> that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help. Do we take
>> every suggestion or service they offer? No way. But just because we
> can't
>> use something they offer does not make them bad. I can say without
>> hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the
> telcos
>> or big boys at all. They've been very supportive of our efforts here.
>>
>> Dave Hannum
>> New Era Broadband, LLC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg 
> wrote:
>>
>>> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised. However,
>>> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick
> and
>>> I do. After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>>> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>>> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain. Because of the
>>> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>>
>>> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
> 
>>> wrote:
>>> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
> WISPA
>>> look.
>>> > We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and
> businesses
>>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>> >
>>>
>>> --
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
> 
> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>>
> 
> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[chris cooper]

Ive said good things about CO staff in the past.  Check the archives.
One of the CO staff work for Intelliwave previously.  I know for a fact
that he understands WISPS, wants us to succeed and really cares about
getting broadband to rural subscribers.
 
Chris Cooper
Intelliwave LLC
 
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 11:38 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules
 
Were you paid to say that or do you honestly feel that?  That would
definitely be a first praise to my ears.
On Jan 15, 2011 9:26 AM, "David Hannum"  wrote:
> Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has
been.
> We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here. We've
had
> great support for our wireless efforts . . . everything from design
and
> engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects
with.
> If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
> independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann
and Bart
> Winegar among them. As for the meeting that Robert was refering to,
here in
> Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking,
helps me
> or any other provider. They are offering training for folks who are
not
> versed in the Internet to drive adoption. Then, then in exchange for
> providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the
class,
> they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.
That's
> what was presented to Robert. I don't see why he was so offended by
that
> proposition.
> 
> Again, it's all in your perception. All I can say is that we have
found
> that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help. Do we take
> every suggestion or service they offer? No way. But just because we
can't
> use something they offer does not make them bad. I can say without
> hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the
telcos
> or big boys at all. They've been very supportive of our efforts here.
> 
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg 
wrote:
> 
>> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised. However,
>> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick
and
>> I do. After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain. Because of the
>> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>
>> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman

>> wrote:
>> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
WISPA
>> look.
>> > We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and
businesses
>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>


>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>>


>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

Were you paid to say that or do you honestly feel that?  That would
definitely be a first praise to my ears.
On Jan 15, 2011 9:26 AM, "David Hannum"  wrote:
> Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has been.
> We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here. We've had
> great support for our wireless efforts . . . everything from design and
> engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects with.
> If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
> independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann and
Bart
> Winegar among them. As for the meeting that Robert was refering to, here
in
> Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking, helps
me
> or any other provider. They are offering training for folks who are not
> versed in the Internet to drive adoption. Then, then in exchange for
> providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the
class,
> they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.
That's
> what was presented to Robert. I don't see why he was so offended by that
> proposition.
>
> Again, it's all in your perception. All I can say is that we have found
> that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help. Do we take
> every suggestion or service they offer? No way. But just because we can't
> use something they offer does not make them bad. I can say without
> hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the telcos
> or big boys at all. They've been very supportive of our efforts here.
>
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:
>
>> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised. However,
>> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>> I do. After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain. Because of the
>> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>
>> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman 
>> wrote:
>> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
WISPA
>> look.
>> > We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and businesses
>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>

>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>>

>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
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>>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[David Hannum]

Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has been.
We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here.  We've had
great support for our wireless efforts . . .  everything from design and
engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects with.
If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann and Bart
Winegar among them.  As for the meeting that Robert was refering to, here in
Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking, helps me
or any other provider.  They are offering training for folks who are not
versed in the Internet to drive adoption.  Then, then in exchange for
providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the class,
they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.  That's
what was presented to Robert.  I don't see why he was so offended by that
proposition.

Again, it's all in your perception.  All I can say is that we have found
that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help.  Do we take
every suggestion or service they offer?  No way.  But just because we can't
use something they offer does not make them bad.  I can say without
hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the telcos
or big boys at all.  They've been very supportive of our efforts here.

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC







On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
> I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>
> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
> look.
> > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses
> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
> >
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

WISPA talks to the FCC.  How do you think they respond to us when we ask for
something knowing we "allow" such actions?
On Jan 14, 2011 11:50 PM, "RickG"  wrote:
> Josh, you're comparing apples to oranges. AFAIK, CN is not a competitor
nor
> a member.
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman
> wrote:
>
>> WISPA is represented by its members.
>>
>> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
>>
>>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
>>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad
people
>>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or
was
>>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
>>> behalf of the enemy?
>>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
>>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a
better
>>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
>>> Just my .02.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
 The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
 WISPA look.

 We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and businesses
 or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
 On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:






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 http://signup.wispa.org/




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 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> -RickG
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>>

>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>>

>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
> --
> -RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Chuck Hogg]

You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.

On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman  wrote:
> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA look.
> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or 
> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>

-- 
Regards,

Chuck



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Blake Bowers]

Interesting video... Almost as good as the ones of Tower 5 and Tower 6..




Don't take your organs to heaven,
heaven knows we need them down here!
Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.

- Original Message - 
From: "Robert West" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2011 9:15 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


> When WISPA decides to bow down to the wishes of Connected Nation, a
> well-known and well documented anti WISP organization and smack me down 
> with
> parroted words that were told me also by the LATEST Connected Nation CEO
> boy
>
>
>
> We're done.  Please remove me from  the WISPA list and be happy.
>
>
>
> The world is cruel,  this be true.  But Connected Nation  Et tu, 
> Brute?
>
>
>
> Yes.  You.
>
>
>
> I will not be controlled.  I will not bow to the master Telco/Cable BS.
>
>
>
> I will, however, provide broadband internet to whoever and wherever I damn
> well please.
>
>
>
> Big Shot CEO of Connected Nation tonight on the cell phone as I was
> replacing a power supply 90 feet up in the blinding snow...  "Our people
> feel threatened by your video."
>
>
>
> So sad for them.  They are threatened  I bet they are.  I really bet
> they are.
>
>
>
> Waiting for the FCC to show up..  HA!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Robert West
>
> Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
>
> 740-335-7020
>
> Cell 937-903-1286
>
>
>
> Description: cid:image001.png@01CBB357.F6FCF250
>
> "Affordable Internet For Everyone!"
>
>
>
>





>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Very good point.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 1:21 AM, Glenn Kelley  wrote:

> Is Bob a member?
>
> I could be wrong - but I thought this was just on the public list ...
>
> that being said - since Anyone can post - and Anyone can join the public
> list - Perhaps it might be good for WISPA to have a disclaimer @ the Bottom
> of all emails - stating
>
> "This is a public forum provided to the Internet Community at large.   The
> comments and or opinions expressed are not endorsed by WISPA and are the
> sole responsibility of the person making the posting."
>
> :-)
>
>
> Just my 2 cents.
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2011, at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> WISPA is represented by its members.
>
> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
>
>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
>> behalf of the enemy?
>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
>> Just my .02.
>>
>>  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
>>> look.
>>>
>>> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses
>>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -RickG
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
> _
> *Glenn Kelley | Principal | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com *
>   Email: gl...@hostmedic.com
> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to.
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Josh, you're comparing apples to oranges. AFAIK, CN is not a competitor nor
a member.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> WISPA is represented by its members.
>
> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
>
>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
>> behalf of the enemy?
>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
>> Just my .02.
>>
>>  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>>  The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
>>> WISPA look.
>>>
>>> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses
>>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -RickG
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
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>
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>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Glenn Kelley]

Is Bob a member?

I could be wrong - but I thought this was just on the public list ... 

that being said - since Anyone can post - and Anyone can join the public list - 
Perhaps it might be good for WISPA to have a disclaimer @ the Bottom of all 
emails - stating 

"This is a public forum provided to the Internet Community at large.   The 
comments and or opinions expressed are not endorsed by WISPA and are the sole 
responsibility of the person making the posting."

:-)


Just my 2 cents. 



On Jan 15, 2011, at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

> WISPA is represented by its members.
> 
> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> 
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a 
> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people 
> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was 
> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on 
> behalf of the enemy?
> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of one 
> person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better 
> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
> Just my .02.
> 
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman  
> wrote:
> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA look.
> 
> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or 
> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> 
> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> -RickG
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

_
Glenn Kelley | Principal | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com 
  Email: gl...@hostmedic.com
Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to.




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

WISPA is represented by its members.

Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:

> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
> behalf of the enemy?
> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of one
> person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
> Just my .02.
>
>  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>
>>  The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
>> look.
>>
>> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or
>> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
> --
> -RickG
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
behalf of the enemy?
As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of one
person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
Just my .02.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
> look.
>
> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or
> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
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>
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>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
look.

We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or
representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Blair Davis]

  
  
Ok...   What did I miss?

On 1/14/2011 10:15 PM, Robert West wrote:

  
  
  
  
  
When WISPA decides to bow down to the
  wishes of Connected Nation, a well-known and well documented
  anti WISP organization and smack me down with parroted words
  that were told me also by the LATEST Connected Nation CEO
  boy……..
 
We’re done.  Please remove me from  the
  WISPA list and be happy.
 
The world is cruel,  this be true.  But
  Connected Nation  Et tu, Brute?
 
Yes.  You.
 
I will not be controlled.  I will not bow
  to the master Telco/Cable BS.
 
I will, however, provide broadband internet
  to whoever and wherever I damn well please.  
 
Big Shot CEO of Connected Nation tonight on
  the cell phone as I was replacing a power supply 90 feet up in
  the blinding snow…….  “Our people feel threatened by your
  video.”
 
So sad for them.  They are threatened………. 
  I bet they are.  I really bet they are.
 
Waiting for the FCC to show up….  HA!
 
 
 
Robert West
Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
740-335-7020
Cell 937-903-1286
 

“Affordable Internet For Everyone!”
 
  
  




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[WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Robert West]

When WISPA decides to bow down to the wishes of Connected Nation, a
well-known and well documented anti WISP organization and smack me down with
parroted words that were told me also by the LATEST Connected Nation CEO
boy

 

We're done.  Please remove me from  the WISPA list and be happy.

 

The world is cruel,  this be true.  But Connected Nation  Et tu, Brute?

 

Yes.  You.

 

I will not be controlled.  I will not bow to the master Telco/Cable BS.

 

I will, however, provide broadband internet to whoever and wherever I damn
well please.  

 

Big Shot CEO of Connected Nation tonight on the cell phone as I was
replacing a power supply 90 feet up in the blinding snow...  "Our people
feel threatened by your video."

 

So sad for them.  They are threatened  I bet they are.  I really bet
they are.

 

Waiting for the FCC to show up..  HA!

 

 

 

Robert West

Just Micro Digital Services Inc.

740-335-7020

Cell 937-903-1286

 

Description: cid:image001.png@01CBB357.F6FCF250

"Affordable Internet For Everyone!"

 

<>


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