[Zope-dev] Re: Options replacing DateTime with datetime!?
Andreas Jung wrote: snip / Just for the logs: I gave up my work on an inplace DateTime migration.. too compliated, too much cruft would have to remain for backward compatibility. Let's see how we can address the issue in a reasonable way :-) To enable an evolutionary approach DateTime - datetime conversions must be made round-tripable. This is currently difficult as DateTimes have a resolution of milliseconds and datetimes a resolution of microseconds. I propose: * Increase the resolution of DateTimes to microseconds * Modify the DateTime constructor to handle datetime objects * add an asdatetime method which will return a datetime object (avoiding any issues with floating point conversions). If there is support for this I will supply a patch. Laurence ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Options replacing DateTime with datetime!?
--On 26. September 2007 11:08:23 +0100 Laurence Rowe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Andreas Jung wrote: snip / Just for the logs: I gave up my work on an inplace DateTime migration.. too compliated, too much cruft would have to remain for backward compatibility. Let's see how we can address the issue in a reasonable way :-) To enable an evolutionary approach DateTime - datetime conversions must be made round-tripable. This is currently difficult as DateTimes have a resolution of milliseconds and datetimes a resolution of microseconds. I propose: * Increase the resolution of DateTimes to microseconds * Modify the DateTime constructor to handle datetime objects * add an asdatetime method which will return a datetime object (avoiding any issues with floating point conversions). The migration project is dead (for me)..too complex in order to do it right. -aj pgpcKDoEWebXV.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
[Zope-dev] Zope Tests: 4 OK, 1 Failed
Summary of messages to the zope-tests list. Period Tue Sep 25 12:00:00 2007 UTC to Wed Sep 26 12:00:00 2007 UTC. There were 5 messages: 5 from Zope Unit Tests. Test failures - Subject: FAILED (failures=1) : Zope-2.10 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Sep 25 20:54:02 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-September/008399.html Tests passed OK --- Subject: OK : Zope-2.7 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Sep 25 20:49:31 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-September/008396.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.8 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Sep 25 20:51:01 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-September/008397.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.9 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Sep 25 20:52:32 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-September/008398.html Subject: OK : Zope-trunk Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Sep 25 20:55:32 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-September/008400.html ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Options replacing DateTime with datetime!?
Laurence Rowe wrote at 2007-9-26 11:08 +0100: ... To enable an evolutionary approach DateTime - datetime conversions must be made round-tripable. This is currently difficult as DateTimes have a resolution of milliseconds and datetimes a resolution of microseconds. I propose: * Increase the resolution of DateTimes to microseconds * Modify the DateTime constructor to handle datetime objects * add an asdatetime method which will return a datetime object (avoiding any issues with floating point conversions). If there is support for this I will supply a patch. Sounds as a good first step. Why do you need a microsecond resolution? -- Dieter ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Options replacing DateTime with datetime!?
Previously Dieter Maurer wrote: Laurence Rowe wrote at 2007-9-26 11:08 +0100: ... To enable an evolutionary approach DateTime - datetime conversions must be made round-tripable. This is currently difficult as DateTimes have a resolution of milliseconds and datetimes a resolution of microseconds. I propose: * Increase the resolution of DateTimes to microseconds * Modify the DateTime constructor to handle datetime objects * add an asdatetime method which will return a datetime object (avoiding any issues with floating point conversions). If there is support for this I will supply a patch. Sounds as a good first step. Why do you need a microsecond resolution? Performance benchmarks, small timeouts. Wichert. -- Wichert Akkerman [EMAIL PROTECTED]It is simple to make things. http://www.wiggy.net/ It is hard to make things simple. ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Moving the Zope (2) collector to launchpad.
--On 20. September 2007 10:06:54 -0400 Jim Fulton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm going to start the process of moving the Zope 2 collector today. It will be impossible to submit issues using the existing collector. We'll announce the availability of the launchpad-based collector soon. We are now through with the migration. The migrated Zope 2 collector is now available on Launchpad: https://bugs.launchpad.net/zope2/ The old Zope 2 collector is no longer available. Because the bug trackers on Launchpad are using a different numbering scheme, there is transparent redirection in place that redirects from http://www.zope.org/Collectors/Zope/old issue number to the location of the migrated issue on Launchpad. Many thanks to Jim for working on the export on the zope.org side and the friendly guys at Canonical - especially James Henstridge - for working on the migration. Andreas pgpK8NaGlfLBS.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
[Zope-dev] Zope.org, and thus Zope itself, is in trouble
(This is a slightly edited repost from the zope general mailing list; my apologies to anybody who saw it there.) I have been a Zope developer user for several years. Zope is great and it has had a major impact on my work. All this to say I am an experienced Zope user and supporter. I think Zope is in serious trouble and the Zope.org web site is badly in need of attention. I started using zope in 2001 at Xerox PARC and the helpful and persuasive resources at zope.org were a major factor. Today, zope.org is full of dead links and it very hard to use unless you are already experienced. Consequently, getting started with Zope today is harder now than is was, even though the actual software is better. A key factor is that based on the zope.org web site it is not apparent whether the community is healthy or not, and the general impression is that the project is stalled since so many links are dead and defunct. How can the decay in the key zope web site have gotten so bad? (In fact I am not so sure myself of the zope community health any longer, despite the ongoing zope postings here -- I hope I will find I'm wrong in this regard at least). This has direct and indirect effects including inhibiting the uptake of Zope. In my opinion, making zope.org look healthy and be usable is the MOST important obstacle for the Zope community. I believe this is both a symptom and a cause of disarray in the Zope user/ developer community. (My apologies if you think this comment is unfair, but that's how it looks to me these days.) Zope was always a bit hairy to get into, without saying anything about Plone development or Zope 3. I just want to point out that without a clear simple up-to-date main web site, and a clear story, things are looking really bad. I introduced some zope-based material in an introductory computer science course a few years ago with moderate success, but am starting to doubt it would be appropriate any longer. Also, let's not get distracted by Google and/or all the other places to find zope stuff. The fact is, Zope.org is the de facto primary destination especially for newbies. If it's in bad shape it directly impacts Zope uptake and usage. I won't bother to go on about why Zope it good technically. It is, it's cool, and I suspect anybody of this list knows it. I am not criticizing the people on this list or the other Zope developers: I have enormous appreciation for what has been built, I just would hate to see it dwindle in vitality and use. Greg Appendix (Examples) Specific evidence (these are just examples; lots more can be found trivially): 1) search for something, say user folder on zope.org Pages you get are dated 2001, 2000, 2003, Let's try link 3 for the extensible user folder (one of the formerly more popular and useful items in the first few listed). Click the more info link: dead page (Insufficient Privileges) 2) Click Zope Products on the sidebar. Most of the listed products are old. 3) Resources Sidebar Item. Click Zope Links. - Site Error ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
[Zope] Zope is in trouble
I have been a Zope developer user for several years. Zope is great and it has had a major impact on my work. All this to say I am an experienced Zope user and supporter. I think the Zope is in major trouble and the Zope.org web site is badly in need of attention. I started using zope in 2001 at Xerox PARC and the helpful and persuasive resources at zope.org were a major factor. Today, zope.org is full of dead links and it very hard to use unless you are already experienced. Getting started with Zope today is harder now than is was, even though the actual software is better. A key factor is that from the zope.org web site it is not clear if the community is healthy or not, and the general impression is that the project is stalled since so many links are dead and defunct (and in fact I am not so sure of the zope community health myself any longer, despite the ongoing zope postings here). In my opinion, making zope.org look healthy and be usable is the MOST important obstacle for the Zope community. I believe this is both a symptom and a cause of disarray in the Zope user/developer community. Zope was always a bit hairy to get into, without saying anything about Plone development or Zope 3, I just want to point out that without a clear simple up-to-date main web site, things are looking really bad. I introduced some zope-based material in an introductory computer science course a few years ago with moderate success, but am starting to doubt it would be appropriate any longer. I am not criticizing the people on this list or the other Zope developers: I have enormous appreciation for what has been built, I just would hate to see is dwindle in vitality and use. Greg Appendix (Examples) Specific evidence (these are just examples): 1) search for something, say user folder on zope.org Pages you get are dated 2001, 2000, 2003, Let's try link 3 for the extensible user folder (one of the formerly more popular and useful items in the first few listed). Click the more info link: dead page (Insufficient Privileges) 2) Click Zope Products on the sidebar. Most of the listed products are old. 3) Resources Sidebar Item. Click Zope Links. - Site Error ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Zope is in trouble
Gregory Dudek wrote at 2007-9-26 10:45 -0400: ... I am not criticizing the people on this list or the other Zope developers: I have enormous appreciation for what has been built, I just would hate to see is dwindle in vitality and use. Thank you for your suggestions! I do not belong to those who can fix the problem you have described (I am a pure backend developper) but nevertheless I appreciate that you have spoken up. If you do not get further responses, you may try again on [EMAIL PROTECTED]. I am not sure that the core team is around on this list. -- Dieter ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] z3c.offlinepack
I wrote a small script for packing ZODB storages without running zope complete with buildout support for quick deployment without modifying the system. Attached is the README for more details. I hope this is useful for some. Also, I can't seem to get the ReStructuredText in the long_description on the pypi page to display as ReStructuredText instead of just displaying as test. Anyone got any pointers? http://cheeseshop.python.org/pypi/z3c.offlinepack Ross == Pack ZODBs Offline == Pack a ZODB storage without running any part of the Zope application server. Only an appropriate version of ZODB3 for the ZODB storage is required. Apply only to copies of ZODB storages, not ZODB storages currently in use. Install the distribution:: $ python setup.py install Then use the offlinepack script to pack a copy of your ZODB:: $ offlinepack /path/to/Data-copy.fs zc.buildout --- A buildout.cfg is included that will install the offlinepack script to the buildout. The buildout makes it possible to quickly use the offlinepack script without modifying the system python installation:: $ svn co svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/z3c.offlinepack/trunk z3c.offlinepack $ cd z3c.offlinepack $ python bootsrtap/bootsrtap.py -v $ bin/buildout -v $ bin/offlinepack /path/to/Data-copy.fs The buildout.cfg file can also be modified to use a specific version of ZODB3. This is uesful if you need to use offlinepack without migrating the ZODB to a newer version of ZODB3. Add the version specifier to the offlinepack section of buildout.cfg. For example, to use offlinepack with Zope 2.9, use the following offlinepack section. [offlinepack] recipe = zc.recipe.egg:scripts eggs = z3c.offlinepack ZODB33.7-dev ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] z3c.offlinepack
I wrote a small script for packing ZODB storages without running zope complete with buildout support for quick deployment without modifying the system. Attached is the README for more details. I hope this is useful for some. Also, I can't seem to get the ReStructuredText in the long_description on the pypi page to display as ReStructuredText instead of just displaying as test. Anyone got any pointers? http://cheeseshop.python.org/pypi/z3c.offlinepack Ross == Pack ZODBs Offline == Pack a ZODB storage without running any part of the Zope application server. Only an appropriate version of ZODB3 for the ZODB storage is required. Apply only to copies of ZODB storages, not ZODB storages currently in use. Install the distribution:: $ python setup.py install Then use the offlinepack script to pack a copy of your ZODB:: $ offlinepack /path/to/Data-copy.fs zc.buildout --- A buildout.cfg is included that will install the offlinepack script to the buildout. The buildout makes it possible to quickly use the offlinepack script without modifying the system python installation:: $ svn co svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/z3c.offlinepack/trunk z3c.offlinepack $ cd z3c.offlinepack $ python bootsrtap/bootsrtap.py -v $ bin/buildout -v $ bin/offlinepack /path/to/Data-copy.fs The buildout.cfg file can also be modified to use a specific version of ZODB3. This is uesful if you need to use offlinepack without migrating the ZODB to a newer version of ZODB3. Add the version specifier to the offlinepack section of buildout.cfg. For example, to use offlinepack with Zope 2.9, use the following offlinepack section. [offlinepack] recipe = zc.recipe.egg:scripts eggs = z3c.offlinepack ZODB33.7-dev ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Zope is in trouble
Often when you find a product on zope.org, there's just a link out to another site, so the most recent downloads aren't even available on zope.org. It's often more useful and faster just to google on your zope topics, rather than use zope.org. How can the community help, that's what we need to know? --- Gregory Dudek [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been a Zope developer user for several years. Zope is great and it has had a major impact on my work. All this to say I am an experienced Zope user and supporter. I think the Zope is in major trouble and the Zope.org web site is badly in need of attention. I started using zope in 2001 at Xerox PARC and the helpful and persuasive resources at zope.org were a major factor. Today, zope.org is full of dead links and it very hard to use unless you are already experienced. Getting started with Zope today is harder now than is was, even though the actual software is better. A key factor is that from the zope.org web site it is not clear if the community is healthy or not, and the general impression is that the project is stalled since so many links are dead and defunct (and in fact I am not so sure of the zope community health myself any longer, despite the ongoing zope postings here). In my opinion, making zope.org look healthy and be usable is the MOST important obstacle for the Zope community. I believe this is both a symptom and a cause of disarray in the Zope user/developer community. Zope was always a bit hairy to get into, without saying anything about Plone development or Zope 3, I just want to point out that without a clear simple up-to-date main web site, things are looking really bad. I introduced some zope-based material in an introductory computer science course a few years ago with moderate success, but am starting to doubt it would be appropriate any longer. I am not criticizing the people on this list or the other Zope developers: I have enormous appreciation for what has been built, I just would hate to see is dwindle in vitality and use. Greg Appendix (Examples) Specific evidence (these are just examples): 1) search for something, say user folder on zope.org Pages you get are dated 2001, 2000, 2003, Let's try link 3 for the extensible user folder (one of the formerly more popular and useful items in the first few listed). Click the more info link: dead page (Insufficient Privileges) 2) Click Zope Products on the sidebar. Most of the listed products are old. 3) Resources Sidebar Item. Click Zope Links. - Site Error ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Zope is in trouble
While I agree that the zope resources look a bit stale, I think that zope itself has never been so relevant. I am a new zope developer and I find that zope fits well with many of the new web techniques. I haven't bothered to learn much page templates because my site is almost completely built out of a javascript library (extjs) that provides widgets, so I don't need much more than some simple dtml calls. It is build on REST principals which fits naturally with zope as a back end and it is a web service so I don't need a relational database. (relational databases are of limited value when you are building a new web service that will fit within a SOA). Also, Zope is easy to manage through the web so my users don't need to hire a DBA. I think the problem with zope was that it provided solutions to 2008 web development problems in 2002. If it was a private product I would re-brand it and announce it as the perfect back end for RESTful web services. One suggestion: if only the admin interface was more easily scriptable from command line python scripts. I have seen a few examples but it would be nice to get the whole API in one place in a document or a full featured application. Tim On 9/26/07, baiewola [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Often when you find a product on zope.org, there's just a link out to another site, so the most recent downloads aren't even available on zope.org. It's often more useful and faster just to google on your zope topics, rather than use zope.org. How can the community help, that's what we need to know? --- Gregory Dudek [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been a Zope developer user for several years. Zope is great and it has had a major impact on my work. All this to say I am an experienced Zope user and supporter. I think the Zope is in major trouble and the Zope.org web site is badly in need of attention. I started using zope in 2001 at Xerox PARC and the helpful and persuasive resources at zope.org were a major factor. Today, zope.org is full of dead links and it very hard to use unless you are already experienced. Getting started with Zope today is harder now than is was, even though the actual software is better. A key factor is that from the zope.org web site it is not clear if the community is healthy or not, and the general impression is that the project is stalled since so many links are dead and defunct (and in fact I am not so sure of the zope community health myself any longer, despite the ongoing zope postings here). In my opinion, making zope.org look healthy and be usable is the MOST important obstacle for the Zope community. I believe this is both a symptom and a cause of disarray in the Zope user/developer community. Zope was always a bit hairy to get into, without saying anything about Plone development or Zope 3, I just want to point out that without a clear simple up-to-date main web site, things are looking really bad. I introduced some zope-based material in an introductory computer science course a few years ago with moderate success, but am starting to doubt it would be appropriate any longer. I am not criticizing the people on this list or the other Zope developers: I have enormous appreciation for what has been built, I just would hate to see is dwindle in vitality and use. Greg Appendix (Examples) Specific evidence (these are just examples): 1) search for something, say user folder on zope.org Pages you get are dated 2001, 2000, 2003, Let's try link 3 for the extensible user folder (one of the formerly more popular and useful items in the first few listed). Click the more info link: dead page (Insufficient Privileges) 2) Click Zope Products on the sidebar. Most of the listed products are old. 3) Resources Sidebar Item. Click Zope Links. - Site Error ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce
[Zope] Re: [Zope-dev] Moving the Zope (2) collector to launchpad.
--On 20. September 2007 10:06:54 -0400 Jim Fulton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm going to start the process of moving the Zope 2 collector today. It will be impossible to submit issues using the existing collector. We'll announce the availability of the launchpad-based collector soon. We are now through with the migration. The migrated Zope 2 collector is now available on Launchpad: https://bugs.launchpad.net/zope2/ The old Zope 2 collector is no longer available. Because the bug trackers on Launchpad are using a different numbering scheme, there is transparent redirection in place that redirects from http://www.zope.org/Collectors/Zope/old issue number to the location of the migrated issue on Launchpad. Many thanks to Jim for working on the export on the zope.org side and the friendly guys at Canonical - especially James Henstridge - for working on the migration. Andreas pgpQJNMkslgsM.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Zope is in trouble
Basically everything is true. The time of www.zope.org as a software repository has gone. In earlier times zope.org has been the only Zope related site. Nowadays with the growth and Zope and a lot of new projects, projects moved out into different sites. zope.org is an official project of the Zope Foundation and there were some talks on relaunching zope.org - however I don't know about details and the current state. The new site is likely to become a small site representing the Zope platform in the first place. -aj --On 26. September 2007 10:45:57 -0400 Gregory Dudek [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been a Zope developer user for several years. Zope is great and it has had a major impact on my work. All this to say I am an experienced Zope user and supporter. I think the Zope is in major trouble and the Zope.org web site is badly in need of attention. I started using zope in 2001 at Xerox PARC and the helpful and persuasive resources at zope.org were a major factor. Today, zope.org is full of dead links and it very hard to use unless you are already experienced. Getting started with Zope today is harder now than is was, even though the actual software is better. A key factor is that from the zope.org web site it is not clear if the community is healthy or not, and the general impression is that the project is stalled since so many links are dead and defunct (and in fact I am not so sure of the zope community health myself any longer, despite the ongoing zope postings here). In my opinion, making zope.org look healthy and be usable is the MOST important obstacle for the Zope community. I believe this is both a symptom and a cause of disarray in the Zope user/developer community. Zope was always a bit hairy to get into, without saying anything about Plone development or Zope 3, I just want to point out that without a clear simple up-to-date main web site, things are looking really bad. I introduced some zope-based material in an introductory computer science course a few years ago with moderate success, but am starting to doubt it would be appropriate any longer. I am not criticizing the people on this list or the other Zope developers: I have enormous appreciation for what has been built, I just would hate to see is dwindle in vitality and use. Greg Appendix (Examples) Specific evidence (these are just examples): 1) search for something, say user folder on zope.org Pages you get are dated 2001, 2000, 2003, Let's try link 3 for the extensible user folder (one of the formerly more popular and useful items in the first few listed). Click the more info link: dead page (Insufficient Privileges) 2) Click Zope Products on the sidebar. Most of the listed products are old. 3) Resources Sidebar Item. Click Zope Links. - Site Error ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) -- ZOPYX Ltd. Co. KG - Charlottenstr. 37/1 - 72070 Tübingen - Germany Web: www.zopyx.com - Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Phone +49 - 7071 - 793376 Registergericht: Amtsgericht Stuttgart, Handelsregister A 381535 Geschäftsführer/Gesellschafter: ZOPYX Limited, Birmingham, UK E-Publishing, Python, Zope Plone development, Consulting pgp62grOAhp7d.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Zope is in trouble
I don't think the issue is technical, or GUI/UI related. There may be stuff to discuss there, but that wasn't by point. One of the reasons zope.org may be hard to fix is that (a) zope.org is a big complicated site that needs a real commitment, (b) few people can directly work on it, (c) cleaning it up will be painful and probably involve controversial decisions including removal of useful legacy data. (As an aside, Dieter M suggested I move this discussion to zope-dev which I am doing. He is an inestimable assert to the community and anybody who uses Zope owes him a huge debt.) On Sep 26, 2007, at 3:07 PM, Dieter Maurer wrote: Gregory Dudek wrote at 2007-9-26 10:45 -0400: ... I am not criticizing the people on this list or the other Zope developers: I have enormous appreciation for what has been built, I just would hate to see is dwindle in vitality and use. Thank you for your suggestions! I do not belong to those who can fix the problem you have described (I am a pure backend developper) but nevertheless I appreciate that you have spoken up. If you do not get further responses, you may try again on [EMAIL PROTECTED]. I am not sure that the core team is around on this list. -- Dieter ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
