Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Zope on Windows - REQUEST for volunteers
[Mark Hammond] ... > I understand I could probably gain committer privileges Send in a contributor form, and that's certain. > but as mentioned, I wouldn't quite know what to do with them if I > did You would use your new powers only for good. If you ran the Zope test suite before checking in changes, what could possibly go wrong ? ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Zope on Windows - REQUEST for volunteers
[Mark Hammond] ... > * All Zope versions are clearly "broken" (as above) in fundamental (but > generally the same) ways on Windows, but the status of my patches as > "features" vs "bugfixes" is unclear - especially given my lack of > understanding of the culture or the Zope world beyond Plone. They're clearly bugfixes to me; that shouldn't be a hangup here. What's missing is a Zope committer who runs on Windows volunteering time to commit the patches in 2.7-land, and to port them to 2.8- and 3.0-land (those require more than just mechanical merge, because things like moving to Python's standard logging module require rewriting code). Alas, Zope in Windowsland attracts about as much volunteer work apart from Mark Hammond as, say, Python 1.5.2 in Windowsland did. Mark understands what that means. Everyone else can read it as "except for building the installer, hard to distinguish from none" <0.7 wink>. ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] RE: Clarification re: Zope X3.1, 2.8
Chris McDonough wrote: Yup, that makes sense. Are these assumed to also be the folks who will try to make sure that new Z3 releases make it in to Z2 via Five? I guess what I'm driving at is that I'd hate to eventually have a very old version of Z3 sitting inside of Zope 2 due to insufficient bandwidth on the part of those developers to keep up with Z3 releases. That will only be an issue when Zope3 has matured so much that new releases do not give people significant benefits to bother upgrading Zope2. ;) But is there and available, so people can begin to plot their own migration paths based on their own situations. Please correct me if I'm wrong here but I get the sense that Five is less of a "migration path" from Z2 to Z3 than a way to integrate Z3 technologies (like views and adapters) into Z2 right now. Obviously allowing Z2 developers to use these things will give them a some needed familiarity with Z3 if they decide to switch but the migration path to "straight Z3" will always be more or less a rewrite, no? Well, what you can do is write Zope2 products that can be easily migrated to zope 3. Is that a migration path? maybe not... ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Zope on Windows - REQUEST for volunteers
* I realize Zope 2.7.x is clearly a "maintenance" branch (from Zope's POV), but also a "trunk" branch from the POV of Plone (and therefore from mine ) At this point we all know that Zope 2.8 will bring *a lot of changes*. There might be quite a few people (including the whole Plone community) who will wait out the first few point releases of 2.8 and stick with 2.7. I currently count myself in that group. It sounds reasonable to me to be a tad less stringent on the "feature vs bug fix" on the Zope-2_7-branch at this point. I have to admit I really don't care about Windows myself, but it's sad that good and reasonable fixes like Mark's Windows patches are languishing. To me they would be good candidates not just for CVS HEAD but also the Zope-2_7-branch. Just my 2 cents from my sysadmin perspective - I'd be hopping mad if I had to administer a system where these fundamental issues that still exist on the Windows port were not solved. jens ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
RE: [Zope-dev] Re: Zope on Windows - REQUEST for volunteers
Andreas: > | there are several open issues in the Zope collector with > | Zope running on Windows. I can't see anyone worrying > | about the Windows platform (I also don't care about > | Windows as UN*X guy). So if you are interested > | in running Zope on Windows in a reasonable way than *you* > | should help to fix the outstanding bugs. A quick search for "windows" doesn't show too many. As far as I can tell, all but 2 (1689 and 1728) are fixed with my patches. I also note that my patches have been sitting there for a number of months now - so I humbly suggest the problem is not simply a lack of appropriate fixes :) > | I heard some remarks (behind my back) > | that Zope is not a stable solution on Windows...possibly. In my experience, that is not true. Zope on Windows is generally as stable as Zope on any platform. Zope on Windows does suffer a form of neglect, but that doesn't make it "unstable" so much as "unsuitable" - things like service error handling, lack of log rotation, clean shutdown etc all mean Zope lacks features necessary for serious consideration on Windows, but is not "unstable". So next time you hear those second-hand comments, you can confidently dismiss them as FUD :) [Tres] > I told Alan Runyan at the sprint in Paris that we would be > glad to have Enfold's "Windows stability" patches folded back > into upstream. He was glad to hear it; I hope to see something > from Andy / Alan / Sidnei soon. > > I'd really like to see our "win32all" story cleaned up, per Mark > Hammond's issues, too. In case it isn't well known, I am working for Enfold. Thus, patches from Andy, Alan or Sid are all going to be mine anyway :) All except logfile rotation have been submitted as patches to the collector, and the motivation to submit that is low while the other patches remain outstanding. By way of background, the story behind these patches languishing is: * I enter the scene with no clue about Zope or the Zope culture. I slowly discover Enfold are mainly interested in Plone which is currently stuck at Zope 2.7.x. I've still so much to understand :) * I realize Zope 2.7.x is clearly a "maintenance" branch (from Zope's POV), but also a "trunk" branch from the POV of Plone (and therefore from mine ) * All Zope versions are clearly "broken" (as above) in fundamental (but generally the same) ways on Windows, but the status of my patches as "features" vs "bugfixes" is unclear - especially given my lack of understanding of the culture or the Zope world beyond Plone. * Being part of Enfold, I try and punt all these issues off to poor Sid, who also doesn't care for Windows, so doesn't really know how to handle the issue either. * Enfold continue to release a "frankenstein" version of Zope 2.7.x on Windows :) Occasionally zope-dev sees a bit of noise on Windows issues before all again goes quiet... I understand I could probably gain committer privileges but as mentioned, I wouldn't quite know what to do with them if I did Mark. ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Clarification re: Zope X3.1, 2.8
Andreas, thanks for your efforts Robert ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
Re: [Zope-dev] Clarification re: Zope X3.1, 2.8
--On Samstag, 19. März 2005 18:15 Uhr +0100 Martijn Faassen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: No debate with doing an alpha, though. There are likely to be more kinks to be worked out indeed. I have update the 2.8 wiki with the planned release schedule. I'd prefer a shorter cycle, with an alpha 2 this month, a beta in april, and a release at the latest in may. I would also very much like to have a release date set and committed to. I don't like to hear "hopefully a final version in Q2" and such estimates in relation to Zope releases; it almost *invites* further delays. The latest delays are basically caused by missing contributions from the community. Since 2.8a1 in October 2004 most fixes were made by Tim, Jim, Stefan Holek and myself. We must face that in practice most testing by the wider community will happen *after* the release anyway. I also would like to add that core Plone hackers, core Silva hackers, and core CPS hackers were all at the sprint in Paris and *already* did significant testing. In addition, both Nuxeo and Infrae are using Five in a number of a active development projects at the moment, and Enfold has in fact already been in *production* with Five since last year. This stuff is being tested. You are arguing with the Z3/Five hat on. Having a reliable Zope 2.8 version with MVCC support is much more important to most people than having a perfect Five support. So the primary goal of the Zope 2.8 release is to have a stable successor release for Zope 2.7. I don't expect people will have a lot of time to do extensive testing after the sprint, anyhow. Giving people more time to do testing won't actually encourage them doing anything, as they can always wait until later. Setting release dates is the best bet at getting people to do it. Especially if we show we're committed. I hope everyone is really commited. We'll see how far we can get with this approach. Andreas pgpRCKCJ9HXLy.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
[Zope-dev] [Zope 2.8] release schedule
I have updated the Zope 2.8 wiki to reflect the planned schedule for Zope 2.8: http://www.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/Zope2.8/MilestonePlan Since we are trying to shift towards a fixed-date schedule every Zope 2 contributor should see this schedule as a chance and commitment to make contributions and fixes within this time frame. This schedule implies that all outstanding issues with Zope 2.8 have to be fixed before the final release. Andreas pgpQ8D6oQuQnK.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )
