This was a pretty good explanation by tflan. I'm a 12.7 index, but my home course handi is a 15. About 5 years ago for our league we started to use "official" Golf Association of Michigan handicaps. Some guys were up in arms as their handis all of a sudden dropped 5 strokes and they weren't thumping everybody like they used to. On the flip side, others benefited as they started getting more strokes and they were starting to win a few matches. There is still some sandbagging and vanity caps, but not nearly as bad now that we are all using an actual system and everyone's weekly scores (at least for league) are getting entered. I think it has made the league much more enjoyable overall.
An interesting thing is that a few years ago our course was re-rated by the USGA as we are looking to host more regional events. They (as in, the university) had a couple surveying classes resurvey the course using a couple methods (laser, gps, traditional surveying), so our yardages are very accurate. When the USGA came through, they not only changed the slope and course rating a bit (rated higher now), but they also reordered the holes. For the most part I agree with the new ratings, but for some reason the hole that everyone thinks is the second hardest on the course is now rated the second easiest, and one of the easiest holes on the course is rated as the second hardest. Not sure how that determination was made, but it does hose up where you get/give strokes for sure. ---- Tom Flanagan <[email protected]> wrote: > > Golfers don't have a handicap per se. They have a GHIN - a golf handicap > index number. The course handicap is derived by applying the index against > the published slope chart of the course. The index is derived from a formula > that uses the lowest ten of the past 20 scores. A "temporary handicap" is > calculated with 5 posted scores. I can provide the formula if you'd like but > its really not necessary for purposes of this discussion. > > So a "10" isn't a 10 at every course. Suppose a golfer's index is 8.6 - 9.4. > He's a 10 handicapper at a course with a slope of 124. But suppose he plays a > course with a slope of 112. He's a 9 there. Or if he plays at a course sloped > at 142 he's a 12. > > In order to control to some extent, baggers, maximum scores allowed are part > of the system. For example, golfers with handcaps from 10 through 19 may post > no more than a 7 on any hole. So if a guy makes a 10 on a hole in > competition, the score is counted for the tournament but no more than 7 is > posted for handicap purposes. The process is called "ESC" or Equitable Stroke > Control. > > There's no doubt that guys can and will cheat and that's a shame. But you > argument about slopes is and handicap is totally incorrect. And by the way > "course rating" has nothing to do with handicap. A course rated at 72 say, is > meaningless to the handicap system. That's just the number that a > theorectical scratch golfer with shoot on a theoretical "perfect" day. > > As for courses maturing - USGA or affiliated associations re-rate courses on > request. Our course here has be re-rated a couple times over the past dozen > years. > > You may want to take a look at USGA's site, or SCGA or NCGA or whatever > association you like to learn about what handicapping and rating courses is > all about. You can simply by writing obtain a copy of USGA's "The Handicap > System Reference Guide". It's clearly written and easy to understand. > > TFlan > > Oh and BTW; "handicap" is one word > > Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2009 01:11:33 -0700 > From: [email protected] > Subject: Re: ShopTalk: KZG Gemini driver heads > To: [email protected] > > > > > First of all to all you guys talking about KZG the gemini was a faulty head > from the start. They have no more left so they won't replace it any more. > For any one that care Steve won his unemployment lawsuit with her and all the > crap she spread around trhe industry about him having quit was a load of pure > bull. > > > Now for this handy cap thing. when a course is rated for slope and course > rating it is done at a certain distance. A specified yardage for the course. > the trees are young and not too tall a lot of the times. The rough is young > as well and as developed and narley in a lot of cases. Then the course grow > a little older and the trees mature and cut off corners and the thatch in the > rough get all tangley. Teh course gets tougher to play as it matures. Tehn > you have the guys doing the course setup in the moring putting the red flag > up in fron of the green and for some reason they move the tee box forwaard as > well. Do this on a few holes and you can take several hundred yarsds off the > courses overall distance that the slope and course ratings are based on. > This will have an effect on the handicaps for all that play there on a > regular basis. We have a course here that has an alternative tee box for > one of the par 5s they use once in a while that adds almost 75 yards to the > whole. You think that wouldn't change the slope of the course sure it would. > Or was the course originally sloped with that tee box and now it's playing > easier than the registered slope scewing everyone handi cap on a regular > basis? > > Now add in the human factor of gimmes, mall it agains, pick and place in the > middle of the summer sand baggers and the ones that just don't know the rules > and ground there clubs in hazards as well as other violations like taking a > free drop from a none paved cart path, and what do you really have???? > > A system that is so subjective that it's not worth a dime. > > If I were to play Tiger I would first of not bet more thanI could afford to > loose play him straight up and hope he shoots one of his 78s. If he beats me > which he probably would (unless he hits his driver like he did at the British > Open) He will have beaton me because he deserved too. He works harder at than > I do! (and by the way once you get under par your a + handy cap numbner not > a - number. Just so we don't get people confused.) Basically tournaments > should be broken up by age brackets, Handi caps should be tossed and if you > want to win so badly work at it. I don't care how old you get (too a point) > Put for doe and work on the short game. You will even out with the young > whipper snappers, Hell I hit 50 this year I am feeling it. Handy cap systems > can't be kept with any integrity and should be used. > > Now I know there are some folks out there that actually play by the rules but > they are still subjecdt to course set up errors. I would bet that about 80% > of the handi caps out there are off by 3 to 4 strokes on the low side.try > this the next time you play with some one new. Just for kicks try to get them > to show you their handi cap card. If you play on a course that has a slope > of 118 to 124 a 10 handi capper should play the course at around 12 over. > See what he really shoots. I bet you it would be around 15 to 16 over! > Sincerely, > Robert Devino > 14252 Delano St. > Van Nuys, Ca. 91401 > (818) 908-1691 > > > > > > > From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2009 11:49:19 AM > Subject: Re: ShopTalk: KZG Gemini driver heads > > > > > KZG only thinks of themselves. I stop doing business with them 6 years ago. > Bang is another one that I flushed down the toilet. > > Pat On Target Golf > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Taylor Bruce" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2009 11:51:58 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: Re: ShopTalk: KZG Gemini driver heads > > I had a 355 Gemini 1 break and now I can't get anyone to answer the phone or > replay to an email. They had some great products but I could not deal with > their business model. > > > -bt > > > > > ___________ > Bee Tee Golf > Bruce Taylor > > > > > > > On Aug 4, 2009, at 11:33 AM, Robert Devino wrote: > > > The Gemini 2, all of them broke just about and the witch knew they were going > too and she sold them to you guys any way. Why any one does business with > her I will never know???? > > Sincerely, > Robert Devino > 14252 Delano St. > Van Nuys, Ca. 91401 > (818) 908-1691 > > > > > > > From: Don M <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2009 6:04:14 AM > Subject: ShopTalk: KZG Gemini driver heads > > > Robert or anyone, > Which Gemini 460 driver head was prone to breakage, the "I" or the "II"? > > -Don M > > > -- > Shoptalk ** Sponsored by the new Aldila > Voodoo. > Learn more at http://aldilavoodoo.com/ > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get free photo software from Windows Live > http://www.windowslive.com/online/photos?ocid=PID23393::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:SI_PH_software:082009 -- Shoptalk ** Sponsored by the new Aldila Voodoo. Learn more at http://aldilavoodoo.com/
