The opposite of trolling actually, I hope it is obvious I only mean to share my experiences and ideas on how to get the best possible Houdini ride.
But I won’t insist any more on the “try it” part… jb > On 14 May 2018, at 10:32, Alastair Hearsum <[email protected]> wrote: > > Is this trolling? I'm not sure. But I feel I have to keep shooting this kind > of thing down. Without naming names you know the guy that created a very > complex feather system in ICE here at Glasswork, on the job. We have been > using Houdini as you know for a few years now, so with the combination of a > technically minded artist who operates at a high level exposed to Houdini for > few years who is still tearing his hair out in frustration points to the > issues with Houdini. > They need to seriously look at improving their user interaction. Its not just > about getting used to it. > > On 12/05/2018 16:18, Jordi Bares wrote: >> I would suggest to give it a proper go, if you have used ICE you will see >> how easy it is. >> >> jb >> >> >> >>> On 12 May 2018, at 10:48, Tom Kleinenberg <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >>> This is a really interesting discussion and covers thoughts from all >>> angles. There is an element to the discussion of technical types telling >>> the rest of us we just need to "git gud" which is a bit disheartening >>> though. (It's disheartening not because it's patronising but because the >>> only way to use Houdini is to master it at fairly high technical level >>> which will exclude a number of people, myself included). I understand that >>> there is a technical learning curve to any piece of software but Houdini is >>> a different beast to the other big three (Max, Maya, eXSI). You can drop a >>> Maya artist in XSI and tell them to achieve a task and they'll do it - >>> maybe not the most efficient way, but a way that works. I don't feel that's >>> the same in Houdini. There's too much "well, nobody really models in >>> Houdini" or "you can, but nobody really animates in Houdini". That's not >>> necessarily bad, Zbrush is probably the "best" software on the market in >>> terms of expectations to results but it's clear about it's narrow focus. >>> >>> To put it in a personal way, I've worked to some level in 3DS Max, Maya, >>> Lightwave and XSI. I wouldn't consider myself particularly artistically >>> gifted or technically proficient but I am good at understanding the needs >>> of a non-technical person (eg art-director), drawing up a list of >>> requirements and achieving them, getting support from concept artists are >>> pipeline TD's if needed. XSI was* the software that allowed me to go the >>> furthest independently (*was because I've had to move to Maya). I would >>> love to replace that and Houdini appears to be a good fit but I'm not sure. >>> Maybe the "uber-nodes" you're discussing are anathematic to Houdini's >>> overall workflow but would be streamline the on-boarding process. XSI was >>> excellent at getting people into the software and then allowing you to get >>> into the more complex bits on your own; although ICE was the main weapon in >>> my arsenal, it's possible to work for years without ever touching it. >>> >>> On 12 May 2018 at 09:34, Jordi Bares <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> @Matt, Exactly my thoughts (but clearly better explained) >>> >>> I would certainly advocate to improve things in terms of node functionality >>> or assisting better in certain aspects (blend shape manager, exporting >>> bundles in and out, or adding hierarchical overrides in takes, or adding >>> certain tools we use every single day, or bringing more “uber nodes” to >>> VOPs so we don’t have to be so granular) but always without sacrificing >>> proceduralism or breaking their core design. >>> >>> Jb >>> >>> >>> >>>> On 11 May 2018, at 22:04, Matt Lind <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Given Houdini is a node based system, there is a simple paradox at play >>>> that in order to get the level of cohesiveness Softimage employed, tools >>>> need to share information and work together. A node based system, by >>>> design, requires each node to act independently. To get the Softimage >>>> workflow in Houdini requires either monolithic nodes with enough >>>> intelligence to cover all the bases of a particular task, or the UI needs >>>> to take control and hide the nodes behind the scenes slapping user's >>>> wrists if they attempt to fiddle with the nodes involved. In either case, >>>> it works against a node based system's mantra. >>>> >>>> In short, I don't think it's possible for Houdini to ever become another >>>> Softimage. You'll have to settle for something that has great power but >>>> some degree of cumbersome workflow. >>>> >>>> Matt >>>> >>>> Message: 2 Date: Fri, 11 May 2018 18:44:10 +0100 From: Alastair Hearsum >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> Subject: >>>> Re: Houdini : non VFX jobs? To: [email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>> I think there is real danger in pinning all this grumbling on lack of >>>> familiarity and not acknowledging that there are some fundamental design >>>> issues . The first step to recovery is to admit that there a problem. As >>>> everyone knows there is some fantastic technology in there but its strung >>>> together in an awful way. Its like putting the organs of a 20 year old in >>>> an octagenarian; each organ very capable in its own right but not in the >>>> ideal host to get the best out if it. >>>> >>>> ------ Softimage Mailing List. To unsubscribe, send a mail to >>>> [email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> with “unsubscribe” in the >>>> subject, and reply to confirm. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> ------ >>> Softimage Mailing List. >>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to [email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]> with "unsubscribe" in the >>> subject, and reply to confirm. >>> >>> ------ >>> Softimage Mailing List. >>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to [email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]> with "unsubscribe" in the >>> subject, and reply to confirm. >> >> >> >> ------ >> Softimage Mailing List. >> To unsubscribe, send a mail to [email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]> with "unsubscribe" in the >> subject, and reply to confirm. > > -- > Alastair Hearsum > Creative Director of 3d > > > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2MtqzI-2D2F9k-2D2BWBXKW27XRR1WxPwQSotdeaTQI8WptYwcBKkUcT-2D2FIjt1MdC-2D2BMj2Ij4Jo30z1VWeO7hEur0HeotmiSt52Imrnziiw55sG52DIKtyXdSxCxNgBQyreKDj5yryss91TPwLdOO2lfMt5FJdnz5x-2D2FNuHAwS0uz9jOUfWZWj74-2D2FW7jEGZqssihgwRoDz9hunoY1bsd9enCLD6o7FeopCIZ4T2ynNYTh0uPKx8RcqqBzOXnR2qSXJhzVMOrbiQlUd7R1s6i0Snbnh94nJeMCfdjgG9ueKJDZAzWcMyLcaRcxB-2D2FGrUbyIY4-2D2BoQKfA38xaggl-5FxtAIgyeGUkaFYUSrrLyyFGCT559IxnI2CalBtcQNCt1DSpFhq1LQEnTO3x7mo8JGdicjmV50YWgnwnhkEqzDs-2D2FNGfFg5vP3MEYoDPuYlCFp-2D2FEt1DUWmGmAP3KOfXTGiUD6rkEmtQ8HA0th9hvOv9f64Ssi6-2D2BLtA0IulTDSt-2D2BhqV-2D2F-2D2FFP3P3EsIJF5nUUkDhZcBXJvWQHUxC9KE1uVSLL4ZqrkwdoWmWvmmClLzRgKlU4-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=4je3Q_i7Fu9VCxcYPUT-p1aUj9TbxdR4juJe-Acf4cs&s=Apv0kEvKJyvJQgwUoSGnkQ2QEuL7uG2Kn7ZodUtpnj8&e=> > > 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> > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2MtqzpxQkSLOfTq4HC3Po9JBIUVDhKk8b5yEaENDBscupnkHkaC6EocqgM-2D2FHY1wP6Nk-2D2FZuakOxF-2D2BB2n9NhY2Hc1VJPs0eNid20UtxlrAsYq3yIdzQOKtxizPJQlTSwXPHGullF7H4b6oSZJs1jCR3B6XcQVZtYVD451-2D2Fp1VGf62aSGBYal3MH2JPvnfs2SUMCZg3gZk-2D2FQ6l2RzvqFbmRnTXzt8SJXrE2VeMrSlkeAX5I2CvulC8x-2D2FiB2eSpARFhMstWpEAcDQS7Z1EDDxCOOyB81QyAh5KKWnqt-2D2F0-2D2BDkkFv8Oqhte6Mhkcft32i3-2D2FdURpOj-2D2Bq-5FxtAIgyeGUkaFYUSrrLyyFGCT559IxnI2CalBtcQNCt1DSpFhq1LQEnTO3x7mo8JGEYcyBIhWonjH3uxSbOgUKVetxmg8xGamNDQ-2D2Fp1yqGg77bXM0cmx8yWfegoP-2D2Fty3s23YN3sLgVmvDAsvcq0ltMYOq3pgXJ8CFqcayTvSjupjP1NgO-2D2FZvjqPt0r0nyYKJD6xVxZ-2D2FX6uapQO6aduqpNyBu3Xr-2D2ByRp0kK3etlz-2D2FtAM4-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=4je3Q_i7Fu9VCxcYPUT-p1aUj9TbxdR4juJe-Acf4cs&s=AE4Y0JPGGure793cbwjhid4AR3lZ92m-ksOJ4kYZAXg&e=> > > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2MtqzWpJgDB4I6SxXkhYoec4DoUOxpqnxdeIQ46UcC0aGUIHys3ihSWm6qO5Rw9NwATdiSKknqEbEPiINjymBU6LEFY2ZOLUEHEGj1gSkPmTmmfNMBXIcL18f9EHkxcI2seB-2D2FIlT-2D2BrZTaaaxVmyLwPlnwv2siWwcdXXoZjl-2D2FEmCzvynRT-2D2FDlYtMGnenRfA2Uyw10IrMk8coeXtDhptUFzbvd2VMwGeAjCShA5QK-2D2BTg4aVgjVAlrQ7M9mYp-2D2B9aFLJzk757WpgKSZq93tTYLO8U9aEMX4uxRQCx-2D2BwuNF4Itmr-2D2B69-2D2BsrwlCj03o42mu3frtDlYIs-5FxtAIgyeGUkaFYUSrrLyyFGCT559IxnI2CalBtcQNCt1DSpFhq1LQEnTO3x7mo8JGuxcQYHmFN6achI-2D2FzzItK37JAYgU1lgmMPu3lIsfuuIEcp43mr5-2D2FDgw-2D2F-2D2FC6Iqt-2D2BMnbqOAHNXBMi4Bd2B-2D2F0xwsnSeJqGhTXuDn9goeC57J0iZj3FnusiKy3m3f-2D2FAJ90RQinu78-2D2Fpn8mwwN2VirlkIraxefAsv7Ot0g2mIS18QyBxw-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=4je3Q_i7Fu9VCxcYPUT-p1aUj9TbxdR4juJe-Acf4cs&s=OoZTd9EEFTB_ZeGAO-Yya5gsqRnfO3LAxYQpz6zUg2k&e=> > > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2Mtqz4eMFTv0EHUJxLnXkpQi7s8c4jNSplqncANo7mVILEBEX-2D2BQKTRuQQsXoH7r-2D2BHXgxXSP2VvdVm0YPaoUhTwY0B6Ech0W0cwvQF6cSUXjMDhj1sNDd-2D2Bwruxw9xoAfABUkkrghj6EZUTeNXht5j444tYGOni2r2Pw4-2D2F00vvFsmWSA7kvrOyGe-2D2FzyaOE1RBPI565vbBUM20R962LNSeOOQmM64T1SPnR-2D2B-2D2Fx3aGwVEtAworFHLYGqowsw5rTgEWR9EpR6rg9Gw67S6QonDzUt9OKGeGgcmv4weqAJwYaDN5wtUEvqHJNrIzFnbn5HzOrLlz-2D2Fvn-5FxtAIgyeGUkaFYUSrrLyyFGCT559IxnI2CalBtcQNCt1DSpFhq1LQEnTO3x7mo8JG-2D2BeXtM9L7y7EmmGAbPFqJ7uMWnK9xXBWR-2D2BHqEUEQpYWlZsg6XtSnhb3Amey6qNYOzBdWArZuPv3Xp7kMQvJyrzPtaRXrau-2D2BC9QLZfZLLr7vKauqMFne0hGHVmUmD3YEO1AflOsiTRlK5MsZCV0d1KYB8xKCNMcputHYVjfnaRbzM-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=4je3Q_i7Fu9VCxcYPUT-p1aUj9TbxdR4juJe-Acf4cs&s=SSwYe9rKV8BHTjIOVE56uhTZM2dIZIC5RfVn0CV6bpA&e=> > > See our latest work here > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2MtqzI-2D2F9k-2D2BWBXKW27XRR1WxPwQSotdeaTQI8WptYwcBKkUcT-2D2FIjt1MdC-2D2BMj2Ij4Jo30z1VWeO7hEur0HeotmiSt52Imrnziiw55sG52DIKtyXdSxCxNgBQyreKDj5yryss91TPwLdOO2lfMt5FJdnz5x-2D2FNuHAwS0uz9jOUfWZWj74-2D2FW7jEGZqssihgwRoDz9hunoY1bsd9enCLD6o7FeopCIZ4T2ynNYTh0uPKx8RcqqBzOXnR2qSXJhzVMOrbiQlUd7R1s6i0Snbnh94nJeMCfdjgG9ueKJDZAzWcMyLcaRcxB-2D2FGrUbyIY4-2D2BoQKfA38xaggl-5FxtAIgyeGUkaFYUSrrLyyFGCT559IxnI2CalBtcQNCt1DSpFhq1LQEnTO3x7mo8JGB7QsaWlORWqO5nMYLqUKpgnSVYE5B7XenmdHwL2n-2D2B4-2D2BP7fubsySc-2D2BJcfx3RBkKdPpyfO4RQ7aatxfjURnJcj3pBG-2D2F0An1HBou1HW7xkI6-2D2F2zcSNm37-2D2BdenXCKosTePBcLzhRGuL-2D2FkiWyJUeXq6MUhOFyLRTB85rap2tio7CFbtY-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=4je3Q_i7Fu9VCxcYPUT-p1aUj9TbxdR4juJe-Acf4cs&s=CMdXlBjyS6T63aoqoXYOcCw0oQ2vS8yGRgSGLbikSAw&e=> > The Penthouse, > 5th Floor, > 87-91 Newman Street > London > W1T 3EY > T +44 (0)20 7434 1182 > glassworks.co.uk > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2MtqzI-2D2F9k-2D2BWBXKW27XRR1WxPwQSotdeaTQI8WptYwcBKkUcT-2D2FIjt1MdC-2D2BMj2Ij4Jo30z1VWeO7hEur0HeotmiSt52Imrnziiw55sG52DIKtyXdSxCxNgBQyreKDj5yryss91TPwLdOO2lfMt5FJdnz5x-2D2FNuHAwS0uz9jOUfWZWj74-2D2FW7jEGZqssihgwRoDz9hunoY1bsd9enCLD6o7FeopCIZ4T2ynNYTh0uPKx8RcqqBzOXnR2qSXJhzVMOrbiQlUd7R1s6i0Snbnh94nJeMCfdjgG9ueKJDZAzWcMyLcaRcxB-2D2FGrUbyIY4-2D2BoQKfA38xaggl-5FxtAIgyeGUkaFYUSrrLyyFGCT559IxnI2CalBtcQNCt1DSpFhq1LQEnTO3x7mo8JGflzhiiyLrWnqvP5qYAnYxFKIuT5j2s3GhbSFlPhVAlxS886z3Ch0WKwUNYq9gB-2D2FU6ghcK9xYfFHsWpTFTsBHpGq7I-2D2B-2D2BOHP3yqkBP65DRultl50UU9NB6jH-2D2F3No0pPHXiXFoapLlByqzETim9Eb-2D2Fl-2D2BBoO314N-2D2BJtMDlV-2D2BKxM9qSI-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=4je3Q_i7Fu9VCxcYPUT-p1aUj9TbxdR4juJe-Acf4cs&s=on_0zfWAHkSRe2L1F36jRkT_bVUOH_22UQkyE7TTQfc&e=> > Glassworks Terms and Conditions of Sale can be found at glassworks.co.uk > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__u7507473.ct.sendgrid.net_wf_click-3Fupn-3D5SmYwFIJXHmC5X9wAP0G6mg4oLGBuQENbeDkYXezg3m6vjHxJcC6rUMd8QE2MtqzI-2D2F9k-2D2BWBXKW27XRR1WxPwQSotdeaTQI8WptYwcBKkUcT-2D2FIjt1MdC-2D2BMj2Ij4Jo30z1VWeO7hEur0HeotmiSt52Imrnziiw55sG52DIKtyXdSxCxNgBQyreKDj5yryss91TPwLdOO2lfMt5FJdnz5x-2D2FNuHAwS0uz9jOUfWZWj74-2D2FW7jEGZqssihgwRoDz9hunoY1bsd9enCLD6o7FeopCIZ4T2ynNYTh0uPKx8RcqqBzOXnR2qSXJhzVMOrbiQlUd7R1s6i0Snbnh94nJeMCfdjgG9ueKJDZAzWcMyLcaRcxB-2D2FGrUbyIY4-2D2BoQKfA38xaggl-5FxtAIgyeGUkaFYUSrrLyyFGCT559IxnI2CalBtcQNCt1DSpFhq1LQEnTO3x7mo8JGouY5B3BAyqIK4fgqEuDy6dZiZ-2D2FzqJdd5N3uI8nD-2D2BSumpAV0kSubEz2wIE8-2D2FEEDSeGLfEi2Y22tu5g9BJ3dUwCVBCJTXqOyaOZqKwr4WYJLXiCMfbEJsko6hN7XTr6SmuMkyOZZi93U-2D2FGo84JvVUmysSjqqpsoPojKcHeTnVyKYE-2D3D&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=4je3Q_i7Fu9VCxcYPUT-p1aUj9TbxdR4juJe-Acf4cs&s=dG0xqVBU-RdifTJqA9jjDaQrL8TRxrCWvOqA3i5YDQo&e=> > (Company registered in 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