Or serve popcorn at the theater. On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 8:17 AM, Mark Sornsin <mark.sorn...@ulteig.com>wrote:
> Just be careful if you do any work in North Dakota - it's pretty strict > here, though the rules are essentially unwritten: to design fire sprinkler > systems you should be a living being. There's nothing stating you must be > human, but that's sort of implied. > > Now, it you want to cut hair, then it gets crazy - they'll insist you have > a license. > > Mark A. Sornsin, PE| Fire Protection Engineer | Living Being > Ulteig Engineers, Inc.| Fargo, ND > mark.sorn...@ulteig.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto: > sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Bobby Gillett > Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2011 9:48 AM > To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org > Subject: Engineers Stamp vs. Seal > > To all; > > > > This is not a question in reference to NFPA; however a cry for help to the > industry. Does anyone else run into this? > > > > We prepare shop drawings with calculations for every project, and for some > projects seismic design shop drawings with calculations. Here in TN > (although this scenario has happened on projects outside of TN as well) we > have the standard of care, which means there are to be fire protection > intent drawings created by a registered design professional as part of the > original construction documents and when we complete our shop > drawings/calculations that registered design professional shall review them > for acceptance and stamp them. What we run into at random is what we believe > is a misinterpretation of the code (IBC for instance) and it gets put into > the specifications for the project; It is interpreted as our shop drawings > have to be stamped AND SEALED by an engineer and this is getting applied to > the seismic design specifications now as well. The fire protection > contractors that do not catch this or overlook it, as we did years ago, end > up having to hire (at their expense) a registered engineer so they can > provide sealed drawings/calculations, even though there is one already on > record for the project. Then you run into the problem of the need for the > engineer to create the drawings and calculations themselves due to the fact > they cannot seal anything they did not create. Now more time, coordination > and costs are incurred by the fire protection contractor. We have added an > exclusion in our base bid letter for the cost of providing an engineers seal > on our shop drawings and calculations for a couple of years now and just > revised it to exclude that same cost on seismic design and calculations, as > we are seeing this requirement in specifications more frequently. It is our > interpretation that each project shall have a registered design professional > to set the standard for the project and that professional shall review our > shop drawings and calculations for acceptance with a stamp; not a true need > for a SEALED set. Every time we ask the question to the design professionals > for the project they can't tell us where it came from other than this is > what is required per code and will not listen to our argument/explanation. > Somehow, if our interpretation is correct, we need to get this amended to > be clear to all. > > > > Thank you, > > > > Bobby Gillett > > Sr. Project Manager > > Key Fire Protection, Inc. > > (731) 424-0130 office (731) 424-9285 fax > > (731) 267-4853 cell > > <mailto:bobby.gill...@keyfireprotection.com> > bobby.gill...@keyfireprotection.com > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20110824/710401d4/attachment.html > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College 1101 So. Yakima Ave. Tacoma, WA 98405 rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ 253.680.7346 253.576.9700 (cell) Member: ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20110829/bd402b63/attachment.html> _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
