Sorry. I meant Tom. Sprinklers Save
> On Apr 13, 2015, at 9:39 AM, John Denhardt <[email protected]> > wrote: > > Thanks Travis. Perfect. That is what I remember. > > John > > Sprinklers Save > >> On Apr 13, 2015, at 9:36 AM, Tom Wellen <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Hence, that is the subject of Today’s Technical Update. If you are not >> getting Technical Updates as an AFSA member benefit, sign up. >> >> >> Small Room Design With Residential Sprinklers >> >> "We are doing a NFPA 13 design with residential sprinklers. Section >> 11.3.1.3(2) allows calculating the area of coverage by the provisions of >> either 8.5.2.1 or 8.6.2.1.2. Does 8.6.2.1.2 apply to just pendent >> sprinklers or can it be applied to sidewall sprinklers?" >> >> We have reviewed the 2013 edition of NFPA 13 as the applicable standard. >> Our informal interpretation is that it applies to all types of residential >> sprinklers. >> >> It is understandable that there is some confusion here because Section 8.6 >> is just for pendent sprinklers. By Section 11.3.1.3 saying the provisions >> of 8.6.2.1.2 apply means it is the methodology that is being discussed. >> Keep in mind that this section is referring to the half of the calculation >> where you assign a density of 0.1 gpm/sq. ft. to the residential sprinkler. >> You still have to perform a calculation based on the listing of sprinkler >> that accounts for the needs of the different sprinkler types. This has been >> cleaned up for the 2016 edition (see FR-261) that will say: >> >> (3) In rooms or compartments 800 sq. ft. (74.3 sq. m) or less calculated >> based on delivering a minimum of 0.1 gpm/sq. ft. (4.1 mm/min) over the room >> or the compartment using the area of the room divided by the number of >> sprinklers in the room. >> >> This change emphasizes that it applies only to small rooms of no more than >> 800 sq. ft. (when larger you must use 8.5.2.1) and that it applies to all >> residential sprinklers. >> >> >> >>> On Apr 13, 2015, at 8:27 AM, John Denhardt <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>> This was a lengthy discussion at a recent committee meeting. My position >>> was it does not apply to sidewalls. Many of the committee said it did apply >>> to sidewalls. For 2016, it should be clearer that it does apply to >>> sidewalls. >>> >>> Sprinklers Save >>> >>>> On Apr 13, 2015, at 9:16 AM, Travis Mack <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> That section appears to apply to residential sprinklers in general. The >>>> portion in chapter 11 (2013 edition) points you to a specific section to >>>> describe area per sprinkler for residential sprinklers. I believe 2007 >>>> has the same wording. >>>> >>>> The section in chapter 8 that is referenced is for SSP/SSU. But chapter 11 >>>> specifically points you to the section about area. It is my understanding >>>> that it applies to residential sidewall and pendent. >>>> >>>> Will be interesting to see others opinion on this. >>>> >>>> Travis Mack, SET >>>> MFP Design, LLC >>>> "Follow" us on Facebook: >>>> https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692 >>>> Send large files to MFP Design via: >>>> https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Apr 13, 2015, at 6:00 AM, John Denhardt <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Agree, but in my opinion this rule did not apply to sidewalls. However, >>>>> the 2016 edition might be adding sidewalls specifically. >>>>> >>>>> Do not call about Stephs phoneSprinklers Save >>>>> >>>>>> On Apr 13, 2015, at 8:44 AM, Travis Mack <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Dewayne: >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't have the references in front of me but can get later today if >>>>>> you need. >>>>>> >>>>>> In NFPA 13, if you need the requirements for a small room, you can take >>>>>> the area of the room divided by the number of sprinklers in the room to >>>>>> get the area per sprinkler. >>>>>> >>>>>> You then compare that to the listing of your sprinkler and use whichever >>>>>> is greater. >>>>>> >>>>>> For example, a 600 sq ft room with 4 residential sprinklers is 150 sq ft >>>>>> per sprinkler. At 0.10 you have a minimum of 15 gpm. If sprinklers are >>>>>> 8' off walls and no more than 16 ft apart, the listing for a 4.9k >>>>>> pendent is 13 gpm so you use the 15 gpm from above. >>>>>> >>>>>> If your sprinklers at 9' off walls, then you use 17 gpm because that is >>>>>> the listing for 18' spacing of a 4.9k sprinkler. >>>>>> >>>>>> I can find the exact references later today if you are unable to locate. >>>>>> However, if you find where it says to do 4 sprinkler for residential >>>>>> sprinklers, it is the next line or two down that points you to be the >>>>>> room area method for standard spray that i mentioned above. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Travis Mack, SET >>>>>> MFP Design, LLC >>>>>> "Follow" us on Facebook: >>>>>> https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692 >>>>>> Send large files to MFP Design via: >>>>>> https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Apr 13, 2015, at 5:07 AM, Dewayne Martinez >>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It would but I am using residential pendant sprinklers and the small >>>>>>> room >>>>>>> rule only applies to standard throw sprinklers. >>>>>>> I guess that's the tradeoff I need to deal with for only wanting to >>>>>>> calc 4 >>>>>>> sprinklers and using extended coverage. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: Sprinklerforum >>>>>>> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of >>>>>>> John >>>>>>> Denhardt >>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 13, 2015 6:46 AM >>>>>>> To: <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: NFPA 13 (07ed) apartment obstructions >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Does the small room apply? If so, use .05 x small room rule or listing >>>>>>> whichever is larger. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sprinklers Save >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Apr 13, 2015, at 7:38 AM, Dewayne Martinez >>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks for confirming Jerry. The light is small and It just looks >>>>>>>> weird to have a head so far away from the center of the room where the >>>>>>>> light is located. Of course when I have to offset the sprinkler so >>>>>>>> much it affects my calculations since it is a 13 application. Glad >>>>>>>> the salesman bid it as if there were no lights present :) Thanks, >>>>>>>> Dewayne >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: Sprinklerforum >>>>>>>> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>> Jerry Van Kolken >>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 6:49 PM >>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>> Subject: RE: NFPA 13 (07ed) apartment obstructions >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Looks like your you using the 4x rule . You should only need a single >>>>>>>> head at 36" away. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Jerry Van Kolken >>>>>>>> Millennium Fire Protection >>>>>>>> (760) 722-2722 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: Sprinklerforum >>>>>>>> [mailto:[email protected]] >>>>>>>> On Behalf Of Dewayne Martinez >>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 10:16 AM >>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>> Subject: NFPA 13 (07ed) apartment obstructions >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I am using residential concealed pendant sprinklers in a NFPA 13 >>>>>>>> apartment complex. Many of the rooms have a surface mounted domed >>>>>>>> light which is about 12in in diameter and 5in deep at the center. It >>>>>>>> seems to me that I must maintain at least 36in away from the edge of >>>>>>>> the light per figure >>>>>>>> 8.10.6.2.1.3 or install a sprinkler on both sides correct? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dewayne >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >>>>>>>> er.o >>>>>>>> rg >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >>>>>>>> er.o >>>>>>>> rg >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl >>>>>>>> er.org >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.o >>>>>>> rg >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>>> [email protected] >>>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
