Up until now, I thought we were all doing a pretty decent job of keeping the personal acrimony out of this discussion. I'll say three things in response to Paul's contribution, though.
1) A big part of the complaint in here was that the managers of the Farmers' Market were, in fact, admitting other groups, such as pro-life and pro-stadium interests, to accost unsuspecting shoppers, while, at the same time attempting to exclude the hated DFL canvassers, whose presence initiated this discussion, as well as other issues-oriented accosters. 2) I'm quite certain that the free speech protections of the Constitution apply equally to paid canvassers as they do to unpaid toadies. 3) As far as "unsuspecting shoppers" are concerned, well. . . if you go out in public during the campaign season of a presidential election year, I think you forfeit the right to be "unsuspecting". Guy Western the West Side > [Original Message] > From: Andy Driscoll <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: St. Paul Discuss <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: 7/6/04 11:34:07 PM > Subject: RE: [StPaul] Farmers Market & free speech > > on 7/6/04 10:58 PM, "Paul Gleeson" wrote: > > > I was doing a little work related research on the Star Tribune website this > > morning and ran across the following job ad: > > > > ACTIVIST Summer Jobs to Defeat Bush Grassroots Campaigns is hiring local > > staff for the DNC's grassroots effort. Help win back the White House! Call > > Sam at 651-641-xxxx $300-$500/week Four leadership positions > > ($1,600-$2,500/MO) email resume: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Here's the link to company's web site: http://grassrootscampaigns.org/ > > > > In order to save you time here's a listing for one of the jobs offered on > > that website: "Canvasser Door-to-door canvassing (fundraising) and voter > > contact." > > > > I have no idea if this is the same company that employs the red t-shirt clad > > solicitors at the Farmer's Market, but if I were a betting > > man................ What's clear is that the DNC is outsourcing it's > > fundraising to a business. Anyone know what percentage of contributions the > > DNC gets from this company? If this is the future of political fundraising > > in the post-telemarketing age, God save us. > > Are you serious? The DNC, the RNC, the GOP and the DFL, among hundreds of > other organizations farm out their canvassing, surveying and fundraising > work to dozens of private entities all across the nation. Why should we care > one way or another? Why should you care, Paul? > > > > Back to the Farmer's Market discussion: I understand that the sensibilities > > of this discussion group are mostly favorable to DNC solicitors at the > > Farmer's Market. Allowing this marauding band of clipboard carrying PAID > > solicitors at the Market is an invitation to any and every public interest > > group to send in their own band of roving professional buttonholers. I > > wonder how charitable Dan and Andy and Charlie and Mary and Eric and others > > would be if the RNC or pro-life groups sent in their toadies to accost > > unsuspecting market-goers? > > If you're REALLY wondering how charitable any one of us defending the > enforcement of First Amendment freedoms at the Farmers Market would be - why > don't you simply ask us, Paul, instead of implying that we would work to > deny those groups their rights to approach shoppers with their message? > > Never mind. I guess we know the answer. You don't want the answer, you want > to imply for our readers this evening that we would, indeed, work against > their rights. Now, I speak only for myself when I say that your implication > is an insult. Anyone who knows me knows I stand more on principle than I do > politics (often to the unending chagrin of colleagues and soulmates) and > that when I'm defending 1st Amendment rights, I'm defending them for > everyone. > > Then again, you don't know me, so your speculation is there only to plant > the phony seed. > > There's a food rule of thumb we in politics have come to trust: if a person, > a political adversary, is prepared to accuse you of something you have never > done or said, it is far more likely he or she is the one more capable of the > transgression for which they are so willing to accuse you. Again, since you > don't know me from Adam, Mr. Gleeson, I can only assume that that shoe fits > your foot as well. > > Now if someone can prove to me that the law allows these exclusions, then > who is prepared to tell Norm Coleman or Mark Dayton or Randy Kelly they > can't politic around the Farmers Market? No one, you can be sure. Including > Mr. Gleeson, I presume. In that light, there can be no selective enforcement > without violating the very premise of Gerten's assertions. > > > > I was at the Farmer's Market on Sunday. A couple of the folks in DNC > > t-shirts were standing right off the curb on the northeast corner of the > > market. Others were across the street on the south side of the market. When > > corn and tomatoes start showing up in the next few weeks, the market will be > > mobbed most of the morning. Having these folks - and others like them - > > hang out on the periphery makes a lot of practical sense - and no one's free > > speech rights are being violated. > > > > Non-issue. Enjoy the summer. > > This would be utterly incorrect. This is no non-issue, especially in an > election year. No, that is not how it's done in the United States, Mr. > Gleeson. Privacy has its limits in public spaces. And practicality is not > the issue. > > Andy Driscoll > Crocus Hill/Ward 2 > ------ > > > _____________________________________________ > To Join: St. Paul Issues Forum Rules Discussion > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > _____________________________________________ > NEW ADDRESS FOR LIST: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul > > Archive Address: > http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/ _____________________________________________ To Join: St. Paul Issues Forum Rules Discussion Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _____________________________________________ NEW ADDRESS FOR LIST: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul Archive Address: http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/
