Just for referencial purposes:
PLEASE, keep me out of all politics. My comments were done from a strict end-user perspective, and has no connection with any authority or politics at all. I really don't see that fit in the discussion. I am just pointing out, that whatever decision the VFO team makes, it will bear some kind of consequences for either side of the counter. And, that what seem to be the case one place, will differ strongly the other place. If they were simply dealing with their home-market, things would have been quite easy. They could have done what they want, and everyone will have to comply. Going cross the boarder, they will face a few other challenges, which might call for slightly modified decisions. That goes for VFO, that goes for the Danish Lego-toys, that goes for the chinese electronics. Without knowing all the many laws and regulations, all we could do is to spiculate. And as already pointed out, that won't bring us anything further. My whole hope was just to bring in some new perspectives to the discussion, instead of chiming in with all that already has been repeated a hundred times. Besides, I attempted to show you, that just pulling the plug might not be the easiest way out, for an International company. The merging of two companies, or actually three when we include the AISquared along with GW and VFO, it all will take a load of time and decision-making. as such, I would not be surprised if things still may take a number of weeks. All I wish, along with the rest of you, is that they had been more open about what challenges they are sorting out, and what they hope to get out of it all. For those who want to discuss politics, or even specific persons, I do believe there would be enough other forums to do so. Let's t to keep this list open for everyone, so that all can express themselves, without being drawn into opinions they don't want to meddle with. Again, all my intention was to add some extra thoughts to the discussion, for a wider perspective. Please. ry David On 11/23/2016 8:34 PM, Vaughan Dodd wrote: > I like this angle. > > To add: and at the risk of playing politics - if President Elect Trump > follows through dismantling free trade agreements, perhaps it is timely to > discuss the impact on availability of adaptive technology? If contributors > are correct regarding dismissal of dealers, all sorts of bad practices and > barriers to overseas customers could emerge. > > Vaughan. > > > > Please telephone the Regional Disability and Health Team prior to emailing or > faxing any new referrals. > > Vaughan Dodd, Regional Disability Advisor. > > Desk2desk: 97187. > Email: [email protected]. > For referrals: email [email protected]. > > Our up-to-date desk file is located at: > http://doogle.ssi.govt.nz/resources/publications/reports-research/regional/auckland/auckland-health-disability-resources.html > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Talk > [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of David via Talk > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2016 12:21 a.m. > To: Sky Mundell; 'Grant Metcalf'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > Subject: Re: Response to Dve about WindowEyes and and the Shark > > Might be so, at least in certain places around the globe. I only could talk > from locale perspectives. > > The Jaws screen reader has for long been a headache for the paying > authorities, due to its strictness in copyright and licensing. Besides, one > official told me - and note that this is a few years old info, that Jaws was > way overpriced locally. At the time, I think Jaws was just about 1000 > dollars, in the USA. Locally here, the price without further explanation was > near 6000 dollars. Like he expressed it: "Somewhere across the Atlantic, that > price multiplies nearly by six." > > Since the licensing policy of GW was not yet as strict, and though pricing is > a bit higher here than in the States, still Window-Eyes turns out the cheaper > alternative, it has been the prioritized screen reader of several officials > locally. > > One valid question of course now is, what VFO will do with all the dealers. > As it stands, one dealer sold Window-Eyes and SuperNova, the other sold Jaws. > Are they both going to be in business outperforming each other? Or, will the > one have to leave, and the other be the only alternative on the locale > market? If the latter alternative will happen, people will not be able to > even make a personal choice, since screen reader manufacturers do not sell > directly to end-users outside their home-market. That would definitely force > a number of people to leave Windows machines, simply just to get an > alternative. > > I do not know conditions all over the globe, of course I don't, and I am not > arguing anything of what you said. But I am ready to claim that business > might differ a bit from one part of the world to the other. And the "We are > the only ones" idea, might not necessarily be the one that leads to the > highest market-share. For many people and local faculties, the end-question > is a matter of economy. That, at least, will stay the same all over the > planet. What has happened in the past, with several manufacturers, and a > number of products to choose from, cannot necessarily be transfered into a > situation with one huge actor, and some small ones. It might be smarter to > phase things out over a period of time, than to simply just pull the plug. > Given enough time, the market might adjust more smoothly. And I am by no > means the one to predict what kind of business model will be the one chosen > by VFO, or any other actor. I am just making a few observations, doing a bit > of general reasoni ng, and letting you all know that things might have more than one perspective. What seems to be the case from your local perspective, might seem totally different from another perspective. > > For instance, you claim that they sued the State Agencies, if they did not > buy their product? That will work in the States, maybe. Doubt they could get > much far with that approach in Europe. There is even laws that are meant to > prevent such business activities. Besides, Europe has had their own screen > reader manufacturers up through the years, and so is the case with hardware > like Braille displays and speech synthesizers. > Once they are going International, a company will have to deal with totally > different laws and practices from one place to the other. What works in the > US, might not even work in Canada, or in Brazil. That's why I am not sure if > we should do too much of specculations. Let's face the facts, and discuss > them. > > Scene of this world is rapidly changing. In two years, our screen reader has > been sold twice. How long will the new owner keep it? Or, how long will any > screen reader even stay in business? Are you totally sure you really want to > insist on a screen reader with tomorrow's technology? > What if you could have a graphical display - somehow similar to a Braille > display, with pins that came up - which gave you a tactile and correct copy > of the screen contents? You know longer would need a screen reader to do any > interpretation. What you could touch and feel, would be exactly the shape > that formed on the visual screen. Sure, were you to have one pin for each > pixel on the screen, your tactile display would be tremendously huge and > clumsy. But you are already trained to only concentrate on a small part of > the screen, and build a complete picture of it all in your brain. Besides, > even sighted people now aday, love to stare at their tiny cellphone display, > with far less pixels. Imagine you were offered a display, the size of a CD > cover, holding a matrix of something like 50 by 60 pins. It would not amount > up to anything more pins than what is inside a 40-cell Braille display > currently; so the price might not even be all that scarry. The whole unit > might be under a pound, or less than half a kilogram. > > Each pin on the unit, would represent one pixel on the screen. Small buttons > would let you scroll up, down and sideways on the screen; moving the unit > round the screen contents. Since it would make a true copy of the shapes on > the screen, you don't even have to bother learning Braille. You would not be > stopped by undefined graphics, and if the pins could have been raised to > different hights, you might even have a way of simplified color notion. What > you feel, is what they see! Do you still want a screen reader? Still want to > risk that new updates from your software manufacturer will break the screen > reader's functionality? Or having to chance on the fact that next generation > of soft- or hardware will be compatible with the interface and programming > language your screen reader was manufactured under? > > OK, till now, this all has been a dream. One big show-stopper has been the > pricing of Braille cells, or any technology that would resemble such cells. > Recently though, we have heard of the neww Braille displays - which > apparently will sell for a fraction of the traditional ones. That must mean, > that prices on the pins to pop up and down, likely have been greatly reduced. > Or, was there anyone manufacturer out there that highly over-priced their > traditional units? I only can observe that the pricing issue might not be the > biggest issue any longer. Furthermore, I recently read about some interesting > development that is currently going on, which might bring things closer to > realization, than what we have been used to think. And that was even about a > unit that would be the size of a standard PC mouse. > > For those of you, who happen to be familiar with the old-time product named > Optacon, you will have a clue what I am talking about. The rest of you, will > have to think a bit non-traditionally here, but still you might want to > consider if screen readers is the ABSOLUTE answer for tomorrow. > > > On 11/23/2016 8:02 AM, Sky Mundell wrote: > > Hi Grant. Your absolutely right. The reason why JAWS got the government > > agencies was because they sued any state agencies who did not purchase JAWS. > > In other words, they threatened the agencies to either buy JAWS or be > sued > and that scared the agencies so much that they began purchasing only > JAWS. > > As a result, many of the earlier windows screen readers, like Slimware > > Window Bridge, all went out of business. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Talk [mailto:[email protected]] On > > Behalf Of Grant Metcalf via Talk > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 10:42 PM > > To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Subject: Response to Dve about > WindowEyes and and the Shark > > Hi dave, > You have many good points with > respect to business expenses and compotition. > > > > Unfortunately, The Shark got the government involved in purchasing their > > product and so made it difficult for other screen reader programs to be as > > well funded as VFO is. I suspect that because the government is so involved > > with JFW it will be the primary product for VFO dispite our preferences. > > Grandpa DOS will never purchase the Shark, but if I change, it will > probably > be to NVDA or perhaps Narrator should I have the money to spend. > The other > unfortunate thing is that all those who have taxable income will > be paying > for the Shark anyway. To often big business and government work > > hand-in-hand. Weep out loud! > > > > Grandpa DOS > > > > O > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > > > For membership options, visit > > > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/skyt%40shaw.ca > > . > > For subscription options, visit > > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > > List archives can be found at > > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > > > > . > > > > _______________________________________________ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd001%40msd.govt.nz. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > > ------------------------------- > This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential > and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any > use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments > is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the > author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The > Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to > this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. > > ------------------------------- > . > _______________________________________________ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
