on 8/6/01 9:24 PM, "Christopher Cain" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Totally OT, bandwidth-wasting, irrelevant musings P.S. ...
>
> Where did that Paulo Gaspar cat go? That guy was always interesting in a flame
> war, especially with Jon involved. Man ... dude did NOT like Jon, but he sure
> loved Velocity. I wonder he went ... I really miss those days, back when we
> were all so young and innocent ... it was a simpler time ;-)
>
> Anyway, Jon, I always thought that you should have used some of those flame
> posts from Gaspar for some really sweet Velocity advocacy, maybe in your mag
> articles and web site and stuff. I can hardly think of a more compelling
> advertisement for Velocity than one of those, "Jon is in insufferable ass, but
> I wouldn't use any other solution than Velocity." That speaks volumes.
>
> I really do miss that Gaspar guy though ... we liked him :-)
>
> - Christopher
He is over on the Velocity lists being a pain in the ass still. :-)
I just love him.
Our last flame war was about me wanting to get rid of the dynamic logging in
Velocity and just make a dependency on Log4J. Eventually, I think he just
gave up. Now that Ceki has the 25k .jar file, it is no contest.
:-)
p.s. Below is a recent privately sent email that I got about the JDJ article
I wrote...name/company removed to protect this fine enlightened individual.
:-)
-jon
> Dear Jon,
>
> I have just finished reading your article evaluating JSP in the July issue
> of Java Developers Journal. Thank you for your very thoughtful analysis of
> JSP and the use of alternatives. My company does not use Velocity, but we
> could have written this article years ago. Our team consists of four
> people who are all Java programmers. Three years ago when everybody else
> was just doing out.print lines from servlets, we saw the need for a
> template based approached to embedding reusable code elements in HTML
> pages. So we wrote a template parsing engine that takes in an HTML page,
> parses out tags that look like {%PAGE_VAL namedThis%} and outputs a
> page. The servlet code handles everything a web application ever needs
> such as database connections, SQL, math, array handling, user objects,
> caching, etc. and the templates themselves act in a consequence free
> environment where all errors are caught and simply explained back to the
> designer or user. When a client's project demands custom code, we simple
> extend the basic tag parsing engine and code the processing of the custom
> tag elements.
>
> We built this architecture for convenience and because there was nothing
> like available at at the time. But throughout the emergence of JSP 1.1, we
> have looked to migrate away from our home grown solution to move to a more
> industry standard solution for our clients. The problem is the closer we
> get to developing in JSP, the more we started to really hate it. We hate it
> for all of the reasons you describe in your article. I think one of your
> best points is how JSP is really only a solution for Java
> programmers. That being said, we are a team of all Java programmers, and
> we are still running screaming away from it. As much as we enjoy writing
> code, we don't want a line of it inside our HTML pages.
>
> Thank you very much for thinking outside the JSP box, and helping us
> justify the techniques we believe are best for ourselves and our clients.
