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Hi Fran,
Thanks for your inquiry.
No, I can't honestly say that there is anything that Dennis said or
wrote that was "clear".
I can't imagine how anyone can honestly say that.
If there was, it would sure be the extreme exception.
It is due to Dennis' writing and speaking style.
At best all a person can get is some degree of vagueness of
understanding.
If there was anything clear in his words Peter would not have to have
read it 17 times and did Sedona and what ever else.
Slim would not have to have listened to the tapes 40 times.
I know what you are getting at, you are looking for a misunderstood.
That is a scn principle that is not always practically workable,
especially in TROM .
It is true but not practical.
It is a scn principle that is sometimes true, or almost true.
Or it is a yes and no in this case. .
Dennis was clever enough to lace enough traps and locks on traps into
his words that, there are often several words in a sentence that are
riddles.
He was clever enough to do like one poster wrote, make statements that
cannot be responded to.
It is difficult to accurately describe Dennis' games.
Based on the response I got to my post, I can see that the
respondents range from nut cases to liars and other forms of less
than admirable minds.
None have sufficient intellectual integrity to have a honest
impartial free flowing discussion with.
One or two admitted to some degree of difficulty with the subject.
The energy that comes of this list feels intellectually
challenged, and intellectually dishonest, stupifying, gets you pissed
off and a whole bunch of other things, and yet at the same time
TROM portrays enough possible usefulness to keep some interest.
Like an extremely difficult puzzle.
and also:
Like the hound dog who went for a stroll into the forest looking to
possibly catch a delicious rabbit for lunch but instead had an
encounter with a skunk and a porcupine before he got back home.
So now he is laying under the steps at home sprayed with skunk and a
mouth and muzzle full of quills.
Ok, how about you, do you clearly understand TROM and can do it, or
have done it?
Regards,
David
On 29-Jul-10, at 12:19 PM, Thomas Weber wrote:
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Hi David,
Just curious.
Was there a point that you found TROM comprehensive ?
In other words you "Clearly" understood what Dennis was talking
about ?
If so what was that point ?
Fran
Hi Pete,
I thank you for your less than candid response.
My background is that I have had only a miniscule amount of
Scientology Auditing. Just the Life Repair materials. No Grades
or Clearing or OT. I also had a minuscule amount of auditor
training and ran a couple of auditing sessions back in 1978. I am
just a student with almost zero experience.
And you have had 30 yrs to assimilate scn concepts, which is very
important.
I agree that the book TROM is hard to understand.
Be honest. That is an understatement. It is a whole lot more
than hard to understand.
I read the book 17 times from cover to cover before I was
satisfied I had a good understanding of it.
I then read the Ghost Danse articles twice and the Sedona Method
book twice through and wrote out all of the Sedona Method commands
and began to apply them for a while.
A clearing process that requires that much time and study is
ridiculous. It is not practical. And such time and effort
should be expected of the average person.
The few exceptions to the sorry facts, does not make TROM ( the
way it exists) a practical or workable process.
There is something wrong with something ( a subject ) that takes
more than a few times of reading to understand and do.
Dennis' simplistic claim that anyone can do it is a lie.
Like Hubbard said, a problem that contains a lie cannot be solved.
In regards to TROM it is more than containing a simple or single
lie.
After all that I came back to TROM and found a few things I still
misunderstood there.
As you can see my solution to what I do not understand is to bull
ahead and study everything like it till I get a better
understanding. For this reason I tend to send others on the same
route.
I am now running Level 5.
Good for you.
With all the above study I find that what Dennis wrote in TROM is
correct and workable technology once you have enough experience
with it to understand what the meaning of the words he used is.
Unless you are retired on some sort of pension, or you have your
cost of living some how covered and can apply yourself to TROM and
clearing full time, and at least have some basic scn ( the more
the better) it is highly unlikely that anyone will be able to
do TROM.
And again the more bank one has the more likely a person will not
be able to do TROM. The more a person needs clearing the less
they will be able to do it. It runs on a relative scale, those who
need it the most are least able to do it, and the more those who
are more able to do it , need it the least and least likely to do it.
This is again ridiculous.
You fail to as- is the situation and see the situation in
practical terms.
You fail to as- is the situation that Dennis was a complex,
complicated, clever, cunning, arrogant, conceited , brain fucking
asshole. He also had sufficient intelligence, combined with his
life time in scn and 1000s of hrs of processing ( doing
almost all of the bridge ) to figure out the complex problems of
case . And the strange and contradictory situation here is that
he still died with significant case, some what similar to
Hubbard's situation.
It is written that his wife had the song "The saints go marching
in" played on his funeral. What a lie! The height of
intellectual integrity and perceptual dishonesty.
Only when these facts are honestly and thoroughly as -ised,
assessed, and evaluated , only then will communication get to be
free flowing on this site and in this group.
Many people who desperately need processing are stumped and
confounded in this group and are afraid to express the facts, for
fear of being rebuked, or condemned by some that function like
the radical muslims ( fanatical psychotic lunatics ) who kill
those who say anything bad about their religion and their Allah.
Similar applies to Christians, Jews, Hindus and probably others
that I am not aware of.
Many people on this list who need clearing in the worst possible
way, do not have time to play mind games with Dennis and often the
ability to do play those mind games, which often jam up the brain
worse.
There are many people who need clearing and want to get their
minds fixed, and get on with making a living and making a life, or
living life. They have the better part of their lives of career
and family ahead of them.
Nor is it sensible or practical that a person should spend the
better part of a lifetime in learning to process, processing and
going clear or at least getting sufficiently mentally
functionally to carry on a relatively normal life.
Communication on this site is very restrained and often dishonest.
It is not possible to have an effective or practical clearing
practice that is not honest and fully as- ising in communication.
I like the way one member articulated and expressed the problem:
"making statements that are impossible to respond to".
I call them, brain jammers or in plain english which most clearly
expresses the problem, brain fuckers.
It would be a good idea for a project on this site or better on a
separate page or site by those capable, to break down, dissect,
untangle, and glean the trom book into key most relevant
factors of the clearing process, and non relevant data, and the
mind games, traps and locks, in step by step fashion, especially
the levels, then rewrite each level in clear language on a suitable
gradient . Separate the wheat from the chaff.
Take the principles of TROM a write it in professional clear
language with the novice student in mind who has no experience in
scientology ( that means on practical and easy gradient).
Make an outline first of the levels.
The key principles and goals of each level, then explain them in
lay terms on how to apply them with clear practical and sensible
examples of each step. And encourage personal experiences
( success stories) and ideas for improvement and clarification.
If data from other tech such as the Sedona method is required to
make a workable gradient than do so.
Let's be intelligent and do the intelligent thing, that is use all
useful knowledge of all those that came before us to our advantage
( that is stand on the shoulders of those that came before us and
build a better bridge.
Yours truly,
David
It helps to keep in mind that the terms “must be known” and “must
not be known” and “must know” and “must not know” are like the
letters X and Y in algebra. They are variables into which you can
plug any value. Must Be Known is I am going to create an effect
and impose it on someone else. The term Must Not Know is I am not
going to allow you to cause that effect on me.
Applying these to the sex universe you get.
I am going to fuck you opposed by you are not going to fuck me.
To find the incidents you need to put up these postulates in
opposition and run what turns up.
Or you can pose the question to yourself:
Have I ever wanted to fuck some one who did not want to be fucked.
I tried to write a beginners guide to TROM and while it is not
very good I don’t know how to improve it at the moment. Homer
Smith also tried to write a better explanation of TROM and his
write up is in the Archive.
I would be delighted if someone would write the TROM for Dummies
book. I will buy a copy.
Sincerely
Pete
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