ATONEMENT in Garden of Gethsemane
"What happened in that garden, was the greatest single act of love in recorded history."
"`It was in Gethsemane that Jesus took on Himself the sins of the world, in Gethsemane that His pain was equivalent to the cumulative burden of all men, in Gethsemane that He descended below all things so that all could repent and come to Him.'"
"`That holy, unselfish act of voluntarily taking on Himself the sins of all other men is called the Atonement'" (President Ezra Taft Benson, LDS Church News, 1 June 1991, p. 14).
BLOOD OF CHRIST does not cover all sin
Christ�s death on the cross offers us exemption from the eternal punishment for most sins. He took upon himself the punishment for the sins of all the world, with the understanding that those who repent and come unto him will be forgiven of their sins and freed from the punishment. � When we think of the great sacrifice of our Lord Jesus Christ and the sufferings he endured for us, we would be ingrates if we did not appreciate it so far as our power made it possible. He suffered and died for us, yet if we do not repent, all his anguish and pain on our account are futile. � Forgiveness of sins is one of the most glorious principles God ever gave to man. Just as repentance is a divine principle, so also is forgiveness. Were it not for this principle, there would be no point in crying repentance. But because of this principle the divine invitation is held out to all�Come, repent of your sins and be forgiven! Spencer W Kimball The Miracle of Forgiveness, pp. 132, 145, 338
Under the section, "Blood Atonement," of the book, Mormon Doctrine, LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie wrote, "...there are some serious sins for which the cleansing of Christ does not operate, and the law of God is that men must then have their own blood shed to atone for their sins," (2nd ed. 1979, p.92).
"Man may commit certain grievous sins... that will place him beyond the reach of the atoning blood of Christ.... If these offenses are committed, then the blood of Christ will not cleanse them from their sins even though they repent. Therefore their only hope is to have their own blood shed to atone... (Doctrine of Salvation, Vol. 1, pp. 133-138)"
TWO FOLD SALVATION
When men are called upon to repent of their sins, the call has reference to their own individual sins, not to Adam�s transgressions. What is called the original sin was atoned for through the death of Christ irrespective of any action on the part of man; also man�s individual sin was atoned for by the same sacrifice, but on condition of his obedience to the Gospel plan of salvation when proclaimed in his hearing. (Wilford Woodruff - Millennial Star, vol. 51, p. 659..)
The atonement of Jesus Christ is of a twofold nature. Because of it, all men are redeemed from mortal death and the grave, and will rise in the resurrection to immortality of the soul. Then again, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the gospel, man will receive remission of individual sins, through the blood of Christ, and will inherit exaltation in the kingdom of God, which is eternal life.
We often hear the word atonement defined as being �at-one-ment� with God. That is a very small part of it. In fact, the great majority of mankind never becomes one with God, although they receive the atonement. �Because straight is the gate and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.� (Matt. 7:14) We do not all become �at one� with God, if we mean that we are brought back again and given the fulness of life which is promised to those who keep the commandments of God and become sons and daughters of God. J F Smith Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, pp. 121-23, 125.
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Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
DAVEH: Kevin.....For me to respond to your below question would cause me to preach Mormonism, so to speak. That in turn will draw the ire of Perry, who will then probably call me a liar again. Nor will responding to your question further my knowledge of what you (and Protestants in general) believe. So, forgive me for giving this one a pass.Kevin Deegan wrote:
Question DaveH, can the blood of Jesus cover the sin of murder?Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Charles Perry Locke wrote:
DaveH,DAVEH: Hmmmmmm.........I'm just trying to answer the questions that are posed to me. Seems like I'm damned if I do, and I'm damned if I don't. Guess I can't make everybody happy, Perry. BTW.....You are one who is asking questions that require me to espouse Mormon Theology. Would you prefer I just stop replying to your questions?I know you say you are not on TT to espouse your Mormon Theology, but isn't that what you are doing with Terry below?
It appears to me that you are using the Socratic methodDAVEH: I'm not sure what that means......but it sounds like you are suggesting it as a negative trait......to bring him in line with your LDS beliefs. (BTW, I have no fear for Terry. I believe him to be well grounded enough not to follow your Socratic leading.)DAVEH: I cringe whenever you use the wrong word (hear) to describe me, Perry! :-(I have no problem with you doing such, David, since that is what TT is all about...but I just cringe when you say (type) that you are not hear to teach LDS theology, then you teach LDS theology.
Please forgive me for being a bit critical. I only did it to poke you in the ribs a bit...... :-)
To be a bit more serious (assuming you've already forgiven me for my childish behavior), I find the Protestant thinking about salvation to be unBiblical, as I read passages like Mt 24:13. My thinking on salvation fits how I understand the Bible, and don't quite see why you (Protestants in general) don't see it the way I do. Rather than quote LDS Scripture to support my beliefs (which makes my argument much easier to present), I've tried to stay within the bounds of the Bible in most of what I post. (And tonight I did go slightly out of bounds by mentioning some NDE stories.) I've tried to acknowledge my LDS biases, but what I've mentioned below I can substantiate from the Bible.
I'm really not sure what you are complaining about though, Perry. I do not say that we can save ourselves. If you review my comments, I clearly have stated that without Jesus' atoning sacrifice and resurrection, there is nothing we could do of ourselves to save ourselves. To me, this simplified view of grace makes much more sense when you look at what the Bible teaches....to learn to become perfect like our Father in heaven. When we learn to walk in obedience to accomplish that, then we will have endured to the end and will find ourselves in heaven.. I think many Christians have it a bit backwards in their understanding of salvation.......Until we reach heaven, it seems to me that we have the promise of salvation.
Perry
From: Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Christian Perfection
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 19:59:27 -0700DAVEH: ...In the LDS realm, grace is the action Jesus did (I don't think I worded it very well) that makes it possible for us to be saved. Had he not atoned for our sins, nor been resurrected so we too can enjoy that gift.....then nothing we could do on our own could bring salvation to ourselves. Therefore.....it is by the grace of Jesus we are saved. That does not mean we do not have to meet certain requirements as many Christians believe. Jesus gave the requirements....and as I see it, many Christians want to minimize the importance and necessity of some of those requirements.
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Dave Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.langlitz.com
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