DAVEH: You are suggesting Jesus was a different person to those who
did not accept his message, compared to those who did accept the
gospel? Hmmmm....that seems a bit odd to me, Judy. Was Jesus Savior
to all the world? Did he only come for the believers? IMHO, Jesus
died for all people. Whether he is accepted by them or not....he is
the same Lord, yesterday, today and forever.
Judy Taylor wrote:
No. They weren't all focused on the same
Jesus DaveH. Some heard Him and others did not. It wasn't his physical
presence that was so important, it was His teaching. The selection
process goes like this. The ones who heard His Word were of God and the
others were of their father the devil.
(see John 8:47).
DAVEH: Easy, Kevin. Jesus walked the Holy Land and was seen
much differently by many people. Some recognized him as their Saviour
and King, while others viewed him as a major threat. Even though they
each had their differences of opinion as to where he came from, what he
was doing during his ministry, and what his relationship to
deity.....wouldn't you agree they were all focused on the same Jesus.
When Jesus hung on the cross, there was not a question of which Jesus
hung on the cross. The only question was who's view more accurately
represented the real Jesus.
Do you suppose that after the tomb was sealed that all of Jesus'
followers continued to believe he was the Messiah, that he was God who
could not be defeated by his enemies? Or....do you think there may have
been more than a few who might have been thinking their view of Jesus
might have been wrong? If you think there was no doubt.....go back and
read the accounts of those who first saw Jesus after he arose.
The point being.....no matter what the perspective of those who saw
Jesus hanging on that cross.....he was still the same
person.....Jesus.
And FTR, I will repeat this again so there is no mistake on your
part or any other TTer. The Jesus I believe in is the same Jesus who
hung on the cross by his enemies, and 3 days later arose in a
resurrected state of exaltation. That is my Jesus, and I believe he
is your Jesus. That we may have different perspective of some of the
details about his attributes does not mean that we are not talking
about the same Jesus that hung on the cross as explained in the Bible.
Kevin Deegan wrote:
How can your Jesus have different attributes than my
Jesus and still be the same person?
Amos 3:3 Can two walk together,
except they be agreed?
Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
DAVEH:
Logically, the onus is not upon me to define the Jesus I believe in,
but rather it is on the person who suggests I don't believe in Jesus.
FTR....I have not said that the Jesus Kevin, you Perry or any other
TTer believes in is a false Jesus.
Lance Muir wrote:
DaveH says "Kevin, I believe
in Jesus." IFF we are going to engage in a conversation that entails
reality, then we have to continue to build upon that which has been
said previously.According to you THE JESUS TO BE BELIEVED IN IS MOST
FULLY AND ACCURATELY DESCRIBED WITHIN MORMON TEACHING. Is this so? The
Jesus believed in by Kevin, Perry, Lance et al is a false Jesus. Is
this not also so? (unwieldy but, you get my point)What, IYO, are the
eternal consequenses for non-Mormons?
Mr. Moderator:Please grant
DaveH the opportunity of fully answering and, explaining.
-----
Original Message -----
Sent:
June 19, 2005 23:02
Subject:
Re: [TruthTalk] Belief
DAVEH: FTR Kevin, I believe in Jesus. Therefore can we conclude that
you've made the judgment rather than God?
Kevin Deegan wrote:
He will!
He Has!
JN 3:18 He that
believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is
condemned already
DAVEH:
I fully understand that, Perry. But I'd feel more comfortable
letting God make that judgment than you.
Charles Perry Locke wrote:
> David,
>
> Romans 10:9,10 : That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the
Lord
> Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him
from
> the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth
unto
> righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto
salvation.
>
> But, as I have stated before, the right jesus and right god must
be
> at the center of one's faith. I am not just harassing you, Dave, I
> honestly do believe that the mormons worship false gods.
>
> Perry
>
>> From: Dave Hansen
>> Reply-To: [email protected]
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: [TruthTalk] Belief
>> Date: Sun, 19 Jun 2005 00:16:42 -0700
>>
>> DAVEH: Yeah........Pretty quiet on TT tonight..
>>
>> Do you believe that those who believe in Jesus are saved, as
I've
>> heard many Christians proclaim? If belief is inadequate, what
else
>> is needed, Perry?
>>
>> Charles Perry Locke wrote:
>>
>>> Dave, this is great. Midnight, just me and you on TT, mano
y mano,
>>> so to speak :-)
>>>
>>> I guess I am biased in that way, because both you and
Blaine admit
>>> to following the christ and jesus of mormonism, so it is
my opinion
>>> that you are lost since I believe that they are false
gods. If I
>>> thought that you guys were saved in spite of the teachings
of the
>>> mormon church I would not be spending so much time
exposing the
>>> false nature of the mormon church to you.
>>>
>>> But, the bottom line is that God makes that ultimate
decision, not I.
>>>
>>> Perry
>>>
>>
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dave Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.langlitz.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
If you wish to receive
things I find interesting,
I maintain six email lists...
JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,
STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dave Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.langlitz.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
If you wish to receive
things I find interesting,
I maintain six email lists...
JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS,
STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.
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