Judy writes > Then I would ask - What does this
participation look like in a person's every day life?
A right kind of obedience comes to mind. The truth is, Judy, you and certain others have mischaracterized our
position so many times that you are now actually believing your own
disinformation. I do not say that obedience is unimportant;
neither have I ever; nor do I remember any of the other Trinitarians having said this.
jt: That's interesting - now we are "trinitarians
and non trinitarians?" Note - I do believe in the Godhead... How have
I/we mischaracterized your position Bill?
We do not dwell on sin, and we do not boast about our
accomplishments -- but that does not mean that we do not care about
obedience. Indeed we are called to obedience, and the commandments are
the same, whether we are reading them and applying them or you
are.
jt: Do you perceive others of us as dwelling on sin
and boasting in accomplishments?
The difference I see between obedience from our
perspective and that of yours, is thus not one of action nearly so much as it is one of motive. And I happen to believe that in our way of thinking, one comes much closer to a proper
motivation for obedience than does one from yours. It is not
fear of hell that moves us, or simply because "we're supposed to do it" that
we obey -- and it is certainly not because we must do what Christ
cannot. In fact, woe for even suggesting
so!
jt: Why the woe? God won't force his
people to do his will and the Church planned before the foundation of
the world will not be a nation of puppets. I would say Bill
that you mischaracterize my position every bit as much as you claim
that I mischaracterize yours although you will need to show me how I do
this.
Talk about calling lightning bolts down from
heaven! No, we have a seat at the Lord's table because he
has placed us there. To quote a mutual friend of John, Lance and
myself, "The real motive for obedience is grounded in relationship
(emphasis mine).
jt: So you are all sitting at the Lord's table are
you?
Obedience is the natural fruit of our relationship with our Father.
When we come to really know him, we come to see that he loves us more than
we love ourselves, and that he wants only what's best for us, and that he
longs for our fulfillment with a greater passion than our own." Hence in
participation with our Lord, we begin to see that obedience is not only
right and loving, it is the only thing that makes good sense.
Bill
jt: Sorry Bill but obedience is not natural to the
natural man even in the presence of one who loves us more than
we
love ourselves and it only makes sense until his
will conflicts with our will in some area of our life. Now the
New
Creation in Christ is a different
matter.
Do you believe that you must be born again
Bill? I've never seen you discuss this. jt
