Brian, There are some reasonably close approximations for most of the legacy elements - and I've only ever looked at the task from the perspective of moving legacy applications into an environment like Vis�ge, because in the process you would cull much of the 'dead wood' that inhabits systems that have evolved in a granular manner over a long period of time
As you say, trying to make this happen for a system that hasn't been developed with some thought to structure would be "difficult", and as you suggest for many legacy systems would rapidly become a bigger task than re-designing the entire system, with little or no obvious/immediate payback Ross Ferris Stamina Software Visage - an Evolution in Software Development >-----Original Message----- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On >Behalf Of Brian Leach >Sent: Monday, 8 March 2004 8:33 PM >To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' >Subject: RE: Eclipse > >Ross, > >That sounds like an interesting project ! > >I agree with you over the commercial aspect. The only way it could be done >reasonably would be as an open source project - and frankly I doubt it >would >get the contributors. > >I can see how using UML to model a new system could work, so long as you >restricted the design to include only those elements that can be sensibly >handled by the UML. > >But what about that dreaded 'legacy' element for which there is no formal >notation: for example, Q pointers, select lists, single and multiple level >data files, USING clauses and global dictionaries, horrible hetrogenous >values generated from SB+: not to mention the obvious virtual fields... > >I would think that representing an existing system could be a nightmare. > > > >Brian >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ross Ferris >> Sent: 07 March 2004 10:04 >> To: U2 Users Discussion List >> Subject: RE: Eclipse >> >> UML can be used for this, though it's been around 5 years >> since we have done anything serious. >> >> At the time we were a Rational Rose Partner, and were >> following the work of "BoldSoft", who had developed a round >> trip model driven development environment that generated >> applications in Delphi. We had developed an SQL Schema >> generator as a plug-in, but had an MV version as well (which >> was never commercially sold) >> >> Suffice to say that Rational came out with there own inbuilt >> schema generator, and BoldSoft was acquired by Delphi. >> >> Anyway, Rose was "nice" because at the end of the day you >> could save/load a UML document as an "ordinary" (structured) >> text file, which was easy to read, generate & process on the >> "pick" side of the equation. >> >> I haven't looked at Rose in recent years, but I would imagine >> that there is now an XML output option, and support for XML >> Data Structures, which map quite nicely to mv Data. >> >> But somehow I don't think that any money spent on a code >> generation module out the back end of Rose is going to see a return >> >> >> >> Ross Ferris >> Stamina Software >> Visage - an Evolution in Software Development >> >> >-----Original Message----- >> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >On Behalf Of Brian Leach >> >Sent: Friday, 5 March 2004 8:42 PM >> >To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' >> >Subject: RE: Eclipse >> > >> > >> >Chuck >> > >> >- Flame, flame, flame ! >> > >> ><grin> >> > >> >UML could be a useful tool for us all - if it were capable of >> >representing MV constructs. >> >And if they dropped those 'actors' for the Use Case phase - am I the >> >only person who finds that notation irritating? It looks >> pre-schoolish >> >- and anyway a system event is not a person. (You can shout >> at it and >> >it rarely shouts back). >> > >> >Pity - it would be nice to have a formal way of defining MV systems >> >that the rest of the world could recognize. >> >In fact, it would be nice to have a formal way of defining >> MV systems - >> >period. >> > >> >I know there are products that do it (including our own!) >> but I want a >> >method, not a product. Then certain sectors might take us >> more seriously. >> > >> > >> >Brian "Not so Rational this morning" Leach >> > >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Results >> >> Sent: 05 March 2004 01:29 >> >> To: U2 Users Discussion List >> >> Subject: Re: Eclipse >> >> >> >> Ross, >> >> [Warning: Let the flames begin] I don't see UML as a >> step that >> >> has value. There are many ways to shape a project that reflect >> >> practical considerations. My experience of UML is that it >> is a method >> >> for separating projects from common sense and practical results. >> >> >> >> - Charles "Rational Rationale" Barouch >> >> >> >> Ross Ferris wrote: >> >> >> > >> > >> >_____________________________________________________________ >> __________ >> >_ This email was checked on leaving Microgen for viruses, similar >> >malicious code and inappropriate content by MessageLabs SkyScan. >> > >> >DISCLAIMER >> > >> >This email and any attachments are confidential and may also be >> >privileged. >> > >> >If you are not the named recipient, please notify the sender >> >immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other >> person, use >> >it for any purpose, or store or copy the information. >> > >> >In the event of any technical difficulty with this email, please >> >contact the sender or [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > >> >Microgen Information Management Solutions http://www.microgen.co.uk >> >-- >> >u2-users mailing list >> >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users >> > >> > >> >--- >> >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >> >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >> >Version: 6.0.613 / Virus Database: 392 - Release Date: 4/03/2004 >> > >> >> --- >> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >> Version: 6.0.613 / Virus Database: 392 - Release Date: 4/03/2004 >> >> -- >> u2-users mailing list >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users >> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> __________ >> This email was checked by MessageLabs SkyScan before entering >> Microgen. > > >________________________________________________________________________ >This email was checked on leaving Microgen for viruses, similar >malicious code and inappropriate content by MessageLabs SkyScan. > >DISCLAIMER > >This email and any attachments are confidential and may also be >privileged. > >If you are not the named recipient, please notify the sender >immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other >person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information. > >In the event of any technical difficulty with this email, please >contact the sender or [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Microgen Information Management Solutions >http://www.microgen.co.uk >-- >u2-users mailing list >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > >--- >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.614 / Virus Database: 393 - Release Date: 5/03/2004 > --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. 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