Joe, It must be hard for you being so good and perfect!!!!!!!
The rest of us just have to muddle along in our boring old pick jobs. Oh well, time to go home and dream about all those lucky people working on big boy systems. But then again............ Les "over paid, under worked and happy" Hewkin -----Original Message----- From: Joe Eugene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 30 March 2004 16:34 To: U2 Users Discussion List Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing Damn it... Don't you anything something better to do! Moderator Stopped this Thread! > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of Dennis Bartlett > Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 8:45 AM > To: 'U2 Users Discussion List' > Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing > > Joe, GET A LIFE. > > We're pickies, we don't need to understand XML, or whatever, > so long as > we can do what's required of us. Yeah, we could learn XML, > if required. > I guarantee I could write a proggie to do just about > anything, interface > with anything, natively "bond" with any database... With > Pick-style > products. > > Yes, Oracle can do things fast - only it takes yonks to > develop, has to > live within limitations, costs a bomb, requires big process > power. > > Hell, even AS400 can do things, that's why they were built. > > It's just that mine can do ANY thing, no limitations, very > little > processing power (R83 on a single 286), costs? What costs? > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of Joe Eugene > Sent: 29 March 2004 06:27 > To: U2 Users Discussion List > Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing > > > > We have UV doing everything on the BackEnd, we also have > MSSQL Server to > Support Data Warehousing... Why 2 Databases Systems? > Cause UV Cant support Data Warehousing? > Doesn't this eventually introduce Disparate Systems? > > > U2, for example, has support for Java connectivity, XML, > and I believe > > > they either have or are working on Web Services support > > Its funny you say the above, UV/PICK Guys in our Team didn't > even > understand the basics of XML.. leave alone XPath, XQuery > etc. These > Technologies are NATIVELY Supported in ORACLE/DB2 Etc. > > e.g. We pull XML Reports from our Vendors Real Time. I have > to parse > through the XML and give UV/PICK Guys a FLAT TEXT File... > cause either > UV Cannot handle the storage and Retrival of XML Data Using > XPath/XQuery > Techniques. > > Yes, we use DataStage to pull data out of UV Into MSSQL > SERVER... For > what? Why cant UV handle of the DB Job? > > As for Performance...UV Does NOT Perform Well in a OLTP > Environment, > SIMPLE: > IF UV did Perform Well...Today's Fortune 500 would depend on > UV and > UV/PICK would have been in the TOP 3 OF DataBases. > > Joe Eugene > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On > > Behalf Of David T. Meeks > > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:37 AM > > To: U2 Users Discussion List > > Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing > > > > While one could make the argument that Pick has not > embraced emerging > > technologies as rapidly as the 'Big Three', it HAS done > so. > > > > U2, for example, has support for Java connectivity, XML, > and I believe > > > they either have or are working on Web Services support (I > know, for > example, > > that > > the DSEngine in DataStage has support for Web Services). > > > > One could argue the need or purpose of supporting certain > technologies, > > and > > the level of support currently within the products, but to > say that > there > > is > > "little/no" support is a bit uninformed. > > > > The U2 products ARE supported in certain "Integration" > software. I > > wouldn't typically consider SAP/PeopleSoft "integration" > software. > > They are Enterprise > > Software Suites, but not geared particularly at > 'integration'. > > > > However, given that SAP and PeopleSoft OEM the DataStage > product sets > > for both of their "integration" products (SAP's BW, > PeopleSoft's EPM, > > JDEdwards stuff as well), and given DataStage works very > well with > both U2 > > products, this point is actually wrong. People who have > SAP or > PeopleSoft > > solutions CAN, very easily, integrate their U2 data > to/from those > > environments. > > > > As to 'efficiency', one can measure that in a variety of > different > > dimensions. From a memory/disk > space/footprint/administrative > > overhead > dimensions, > > the > > U2 database products are VERY efficient. > > > > Finally, as to being "slow", again this depends on the > measurement > > criteria being used. From the perspective of concurrent > user access > > and the performance > > of application style DB usage (largely input/output, > multiple > concurrent > > users, etc..), > > the U2 products stand up very well to the mainstream guys. > For > support of > > VLDB, > > highly transactional query-based usage models, and the > like, it does > not. > > > > Trying to make the U2 products into what they are not is > wrong. They > are > > not the > > panacea for every database requirement. However, for > certain > problems, > > especially > > those for which it was designed (embedded database for > application > > development), it is very efficient. > > > > Dave > > > > At 10:24 PM 3/28/2004 -0500, you wrote: > > >PICK is LEGACY Technology and does NOT Support alot of > advanced level > > > >computing we have today. I belive PICK is Similiar to > Legacy > DB2 > > >that used ISAM type of DataBases Access. Even IBM has > moved DB2 (Now > UDB) > > >to a completly relational architecture. > > > > > >I belive some of the below are good reasons to Migrate to > MainStream > > >(Top 3 - DB2/Oracle/MSSQL etc) Databases. > > > > > >1. UV has Little/NO support for Emerging > Technologies(XML/XQuery/XSLT/WML > > etc) > > >2. UV is Not supported in Most Integration Enterprise > Software > > >(SAP/PeopleSoft) > > >3. UV is Not efficient compared to highly evolved > databases(DB2/Oracle) > > >4. UV Folks seem to use PICK, which is Not Compatible > with many of > > > of the Current Advanced Technologies and Techniques. > > >5. UV is very SLOW, TOO Procedural and Not the right tool > for > > > an OLTP Environment. > > > > > >It would be nice if IBM provided a Package to convert all > UV Stuff to > > > >IBM DB2 and perhaps provide some kinda code converter to > convert all > > >pick stuff to DB2 Stored Procs or Java Native Compiled > Procedures. > > >I belive this would be ideal and would help corportations > intergrate > > >systems easily. > > > > > >Joe Eugene > > > > > > > > > > > >________________________________ > > > > > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Phil > Walker > > >Sent: Sun 3/28/2004 7:59 PM > > >To: U2 Users Discussion List > > >Subject: RE: The lists are closing > > > > > > > > > > > >David, > > > > > >As the list is closing this is probably not off topic - > so I will > > comment. > > > > > >I believe PICK has been around since the mid to late > 1960's, whereas > > Oracle > > >and the SQL relation model has been around only since the > mid to late > > 1970's > > >early 1980's if you are talking about Oracle etc. > > > > > >I may be wrong. > > > > > >Phil Walker > > >+64 21 336294 > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >infocusp limited > > >\\ PO Box 77032, Auckland New Zealand \ > www.infocusp.co.nz > > >DISCLAIMER: This electronic message together with any > attachments is > > > >confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, do > not copy, > > disclose > > >or use the contents in any way. Please also advise us by > return > e-mail > > that > > >you have received the message and then please destroy. > infocusp > limited > > is > > >not responsible for any changes made to this message and > / or any > > >attachments after sending by infocusp limited. We use > virus scanning > > >software but exclude all liability for viruses or > anything similar in > > this > > >email or any attachment > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >Behalf Of Logan, David (SST - Adelaide) > > >Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 12:36 PM > > >To: U2 Users Discussion List > > >Subject: RE: The lists are closing > > > > > >Best of luck Jeff, however I will point out the obvious, > what is your > > > >definition of modern? I would have thought the good old > "relational > > >databases" have been around since before pick anyway? 8-) > > > > > >Regards > > > > > >David Logan > > >Database Administrator > > >HP Managed Services > > >139 Frome Street, > > >Adelaide 5000 > > >Australia > > > > > >+61 8 8408 4273 > > >+61 417 268 665 > > > > > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >On Behalf Of Jeff Ritchie > > >Sent: Monday, 29 March 2004 8:03 AM > > >To: U2 Users Discussion List > > >Subject: RE: The lists are closing > > > > > > > > >Thanks for the memories Cliff :) > > > > > >Sorry to hear the lists are closing, but what the heck > time and tide, > > > >work committments etc. > > > > > >As some one who is shortly to be ex mv, and moving into > the more > modern > > >technologies l will decline the offer to join, but wish > the site all > the > > >best. > > > > > >Cheers, > > >Jeff > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: Moderator [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >Sent: Saturday, 27 March 2004 7:14 PM > > >To: U2 Users Discussion List; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >Subject: The lists are closing > > > > > > > > >Dear Friends: > > > > > >After 10+ years of either hosting or supporting the > info-prime, > > >info-unidata, info-vmark, info-informix, and u2-users etc > lists, I > have > > >decided to shut down the list server. > > > > > >u2-users and u2-community will cease to exist as of 1 > April 2004. IBM > is > > > > > >officially supporting the efforts of the new U2UG.org > group. (Yes. I > am > > >a member of the establishing Board of that group. So this > is not a > > >"coup" or Sour Grapes!) If you check out the forums that > have been > set > > >up, I think you will will see that they cover everything > anyone has > > >asked for over the years in this group. > > > > > >I *really* want to encourage ALL of you to come over the > the > > >www.u2ug.org site and support this effort. This is > *exactly* what > many > > >of you on this list have wanted over the years. If Not > Now, When? > > > > > >Almost ten years on my Watch. How many years before that > on Mike > > >O'Rear's Watch? In the Net World, this has been a Hell of > a good run. > (I > > > > > >just couldn't resist tripping the Net Nanny filters one > last time > <very > > >evil grin>) > > > > > >I'll see all of you on the other media, ok? > > > > > >-- > > > > > >Regards, > > > > > >Clif > > > > > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > >W. Clifton Oliver, CCP > > >CLIFTON OLIVER & ASSOCIATES > > >Tel: +1 619 460 5678 Web: www.oliver.com > > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > > >-- > > >u2-users mailing list > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > >-- > > >u2-users mailing list > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > >-- > > >u2-users mailing list > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > > > > > > > >-- > > >u2-users mailing list > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > > > > > > > > > > >-- > > >u2-users mailing list > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > > > > ============================================================ > ============ > > David T. Meeks || "All my life I'm > taken by > surprise > > Architect, Technology Office || I'm someone's waste > of time > > Ascential Software || Now I walk a > balanced line > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] || and step into > tomorrow" - IQ > > > ============================================================ > ============ > > -- > > u2-users mailing list > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > > -- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > > > -- > u2-users mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- u2-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.oliver.com/mailman/listinfo/u2-users This e-mail and any attachments are confidential and intended solely for the use of the addressee only. If you have received this message in error, you must not copy, distribute or disclose the contents; please notify the sender immediately and delete the message. 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