Minhaaj, I'd be very interested in your detailed definition of "profiteering". I think I may be getting a sense of what you mean, but I think I may be missing even what should be considered profit... or why taken in a different context (yours) why what is going on should be considered profiteering...
Sincerely, Peter On Oct 31, 3:59 am, Minhaaj ur Rehman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dear Alex, > > If you haven't nosed out profiteering in WikiEducator you > probably have a lot to catch up on. Read, read, read :) > > On Oct 30, 5:31 pm, "Alex P. Real" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > Hi Leigh, Minhaaj & All, > > > Thanks for the clarification Leigh, thought you were referring to some > > NZ/Aus specificity I was not aware of! In terms of global edu I couldn't > > agree more, though I think it runs deeper than West/ non-West and it's > > rather about social control & associated political/capitalist interests. > > Sorry for referring to European frameworks; I'd have thought lessons-learnt > > could be useful for copying US/UK models has ruined several national edu > > systems due to their cultural meaninglessness. But I'm rather fed up with > > apologizing for my passport. > > > At the same time, providing access is important to many people in WE and > > several million worldwide; their approach can differ from yours and some may > > prefer to plunge on whatever op. arises for there are not many. Like > > citizenship/residence permits, the goal is to get "papers". No judgment > > here, right? UN is certainly limited but it seems practical to learn, take > > what's good & discard what's not. If WE is wiki and free, what's wrong in > > the coexistence of different perspectives? Sorry if pushy here but have you > > considered your approach could be perceived as an imposition itself? > > Criticism is great, and I mean it, but what alternatives do you suggest? > > Ever thought TQF could ease many lives, e.g. qual recognition abroad, which > > can be a real nightmare? > > > Minhaaj, I guess there's more than your UAE trip, but why are Patricia & > > Randy "destructive profiteers"? Gee, rather strong, so I think we deserve to > > know. Political struggles...lol > > > Cheers, > > > Alex > > > -----Mensaje original----- > > De: wikieducator@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] En > > nombre de Minhaaj ur Rehman > > Enviado el: jueves, 30 de octubre de 2008 10:09 > > Para: WikiEducator > > Asunto: [WikiEducator] Re: !!RE: [WikiEducator] Re: Another Milestone > > > Dear Leigh, i am amazed by your continous bringing up of controversial > > topics in wikieducator like me and i would like to applaud you for > > your tenacity. You can most certainly ignore people like Patricia and > > Randy who are ACTUALLY the destructive profiteers. Thanks for > > highlighting the issues that i am catching up on at the moment. Just > > came back from UAE and now have some time to catch up on politics :) > > > Don't be discouraged by the vultures because an eagle flies far above > > them :) > > > On Oct 30, 1:38 pm, "Leigh Blackall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > That was a fresh and accessible read thanks Peter. I especially liked and > > > found interesting the 5 suggested areas of development research. There was > > a > > > sudden jump in the level of detail, but I hung in there. > > > > BTW, have you heard of this thing called the Delphi > > > Technique<http://www.illinoisloop.org/delphi_battey.html> > > > ? > > > > On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 8:27 PM, Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > Holly Poop! > > > > > This is a thread that is really getting to the nut of the issue. And > > > > an issue that has me thinking, well to be honest, I've always found > > > > myself an anarchist and my trust of western philosophies "imposed" on > > > > others has often got my goat. You know, what right do we have to think > > > > we have it right... So many initiatives started in good faith gone > > > > awry. Look at development efforts over the last 40 years... Can we > > > > actually say they have done more good than disruption? We will never > > > > know cause they were (in general) imposed... enough ranting... For > > > > those so inclined, I believe we can do an incredible amount of > > > > development work from home; > > > >http://www.gg.rhul.ac.uk/ict4d/Research%20at%20home.pdf > > > > And I also believe that work done from your home community provides an > > > > arms length where the "recipients" have greater choice in what they > > > > "consume". Working from home also lessens your environmental impact... > > > > > I honestly believe we need diversity. I do not believe in centralized > > > > control. We need a platform that encourages diversity, not singularity > > > > negotiated. We do not need one place or one piece of OER to fill a > > > > common need. We need the ability to subclass, reuse, alter, and create > > > > multiple versions of OER. Localized yet reference the source... This > > > > would provide diversity and celebrate similarities. I look forward to > > > > the day where we can have multiple versions of the same OER, > > > > localized. > > > > > All this said, any work we do toward the goal of CC-BY-SA OER is good > > > > work... > > > > > Sincerely. > > > > > On Oct 29, 10:51 pm, "Chris Harvey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > Names stand for ideas, so there will be the one and the only page > > about > > > > > > "constructivism" and "math" and "multiplication" in any wiki. > > > > > > This is wrong, in an encyclopedia or dictionary this may be true. > > > > > > Warm regards > > > > > Chris Harvey > > > > > chris.superuser.com.au > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 3:24 PM, Leigh Blackall > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > >wrote: > > > > > > > Great insight Maria! You are more than close I think. A thing that > > has > > > > > > troubled me very much about the WIkieducator project is this > > one-ness. > > > > We > > > > > > all encourage each other to identify as Wikieductors (up until this > > > > thread), > > > > > > and the Wikipedia article gave me clarity on this concern. Some of > > us > > > > use > > > > > > words like, "Wikieducator family", and "Wikieducator community" and > > > > this > > > > > > spreads a feeling of commitment to the collective and one-ness. > > Stephen > > > > > > Downes' talk about the differences between groups and networks is > > the > > > > best > > > > > > yet articulation of this problem. > > > > > > > Your observtion about wikis is very close to my sense too Maria, but > > I > > > > can > > > > > > think of one very (the most) successful open education resource wiki > > > > that is > > > > > > not - Wikispaces. Wikispaces is first and foremost about the many > > > > different > > > > > > spaces on the platform. The Wikispace platform and business takes a > > > > very > > > > > > back seat in it all, and in the early stages the owners went out of > > > > their > > > > > > way to promote the projects on Wikispaces more than the Wikispace > > > > platform > > > > > > itself. Today, it is clear to see (in comparison to Wikieducator and > > > > > > Wikipedia) that Wikispaces is all about the projects on the > > platform. > > > > > > > To some extent I think Wikiversity is successfully doing this, but > > > > there is > > > > > > plenty of evidence to centrally control the project, and have users > > > > adopt > > > > > > group identity and a sense of one-ness. > > > > > > > Where this gets most unsettling for me is when that sense of > > one-ness > > > > is > > > > > > then represented by a single person, or celebrity. In the case of > > > > Wikipedia, > > > > > > it is of course Jim Wales. > > > > > > > Alex, regarding globalisation. The roots of this is in the very > > > > inception > > > > > > of the Commonwealth. Today it is through the free marketeering speer > > > > headed > > > > > > by the USA, but echoed in the "West". Some wonder just how much > > bodies > > > > like > > > > > > the UN and perhaps COL, inadvertently represent that globalised > > view. > > > > > > > This might be seen as a new form of colonisation, a concept that the > > > > > > Commonwealth again knows all about. The new form of colonisation is > > no > > > > > > different. Its culltural, its educational, its delivered through > > media > > > > and > > > > > > peak bodies, and relies on a sense of one-ness > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 11:21 AM, Maria Droujkova > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > >wrote: > > > > > > >> Some entities involved in this conversation are new to me. From > > this > > > > > >> extreme newbie perspective, this conversation seems to be about > > > > "voting for > > > > > >> the best, the most logical, the most streamlined" vs. having many > > > > different > > > > > >> sorts, kinds and flavors of... curricula, connections, models, > > > > theories. Am > > > > > >> I close? > > > > > > >> Ever since wiki was invented, I've been wondering about this > > question, > > > > > >> though, even if it only relates to this conversation through a > > > > tangent. So I > > > > > >> am going to formulate it again. Wiki uses a "single idea, single > > > > space" > > > > > >> metaphor, hardcoded by allowing one single page by each name. Names > > > > stand > > > > > >> for ideas, so there will be the one and the only page about > > > > "constructivism" > > > > > >> and "math" and "multiplication" in any wiki. This calls up all > > > > territorial > > > > > >> mechanisms of controlling this seemingly limited "land" - and do > > these > > > > > >> necessarily lead to wars? As Leigh said resignedly, in this thread, > > > > "Off to > > > > > >> start an edit war in Wikipedia." > > > > > > >> In general, human groups need a healthy balance between convergence > > > > and > > > > > >> divergence of ideas. It looks like wikis tend to promote > > convergence > > > > (either > > > > > >> synergy-style, or survival-of-the-fittest style) rather than > > > > collections of > > > > > >> multitudes of ideas. So, would wiki ed projects attract people who > > > > work in > > > > > >> "the bestest single curriculum" direction? > > > > > > >> -- > > > > > >> Cheers, > > > > > >> MariaD > > > > > > >> I write, 'In the beginning was the Deed!' - Goethe, Faust > > > > > > >> naturalmath.com: a sketch of a social math site > > > > > >> groups.google.com/group/naturalmath: a mailing list about math > > maker > > > > > >> activities > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > -- > > ... > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "WikiEducator" group. To visit wikieducator: http://www.wikieducator.org To visit the discussion forum: http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator To post to this group, send email to wikieducator@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
