Hi g,
Thanks for calling me an old power editor. I suggest you try to make an
edit to a WIkimedia project of choice (e.g. add a photo to an existing
article) on a desktop, then do the same on a mobile smartphone, and then
report back here.

On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 8:50 AM, ; ) <b...@gmx.at> wrote:

> Hey Jane,
> as  the  desktop  is  sometimes  characterised only as a legacy  input
> device  for  old power editors, while the reading is done from  mobile
> devices,  often  in  the  form  of  mash-ups  and  geo-apps,  why is a
> compromise  so  hard  to achieve?
> One  solution  that  pops  up  would  be to cache the content (as most
> useful  wikipedia  apps do anyway) in a light mobile version, while
> allowing an existing group of useful contributors their little island.
> This  feeling  of  belonging makes those editors do all the dirty jobs
> noone  wants  to do on a regular basis - most of it fact and copyright
> checks that make the content so good it is useful to readers and keeps
> them coming back.
> You   could  create  a  newbie-friendly version with rich text editing
> optimised  for different devices, more customisation in an easy way...
> if  we  are  realistic  that would be the way to go anyway, as you can
> start  out  much  easier  and with less baggage - and would be able to
> target  groups  on  an individual basis in the process, too. When they
> evolve  in the ("bitter-vet") power users and editors, they can switch
> to  the  still  more  useful but less pretty interfaces for large data
> manipulation, that the desktop offers.
> Shouldn't  the focus  be  on the readers that  read  the  content  AND
> the   editors   that  produce interesting content to make readers come
> back?  Gerard  in this regard seems to have a somehow bi-polar view of
> this     process  with   his   us   -   them  characterisation   ("the
> community   that   remains   with   the  WMF  will  lose  all  of  the
> separatists").  They  will  just  no longer do the hard stuff, if they
> feel  that  they  are  not  welcome - and finding such people is hard,
> really hard (speaking as a long-term gutenberg proof-reader).
> cheers,
> g
> Thursday, August 28, 2014, 1:56:38 PM, you wrote:
> > I agree with Gerard, and would add that a good portion of the new
> > readers and "missing female editors" do not own or operate a desktop
> > and are only available on mobile and tablet, so this is not only
> > where the new readers are, but also where the "first edit"
> > experience is for most women (and sadly, a corollary to that is that
> > they don't try again after their first edit failure).
> > Sent from my iPad
> > On Aug 28, 2014, at 4:30 AM, Gerard Meijssen
> > <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Hoi,
> >> Such separate hostings and ownership would not be that much of a risk to
> >> the WMF. The challenges will be first and foremost with the separatists;
> >> then again it is firmly their choice. There will be benefits on both
> sides
> >> as well. The community that remains with the WMF will lose all of the
> >> separatists and they will sadly see some of them go. It will allow for
> the
> >> influx of new people and new ideas. The people that go will get a
> reality
> >> check; they will find out to what extend the things they fought battles
> >> over are actually worth it. I am sure that both communities will
> benefit.
> >>
> >> When the people who talk about going their own way rethink their stance
> and
> >> start considering the other side of the coin it may lead to an
> equilibrium.
> >> However, the Visual Editor is not the only thing that will change the
> look
> >> and feel there is so much more happening and at that, a single community
> >> only considering its own is in effect a cul de sac.
> >>
> >> When numbers of readers are to be our main worry, it should be obvious
> by
> >> now that both for editing and reading they are happening on the mobile,
> the
> >> tablet. This is were our new readers are happening. Maybe not
> necessarily
> >> in Europe but certainly in the global south. They have by definition a
> >> different mode of operandi and consequently much of our current
> bickering
> >> is only distracting from putting our efforts in welcoming our newbies
> and
> >> building a full fledged environment for them.
> >> Thanks,
> >>     GerardM
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