It's designed to burst. That gives us a relatively low monthly cost with really fast service.

So we pay based on usage.  But it can, and does, burst very high.

Marlon
(509) 982-2181                                   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)                    Consulting services
42846865 (icq)                                    And I run my own wisp!
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Broadwick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2006 10:09 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] bits per mbps


Are you paying extra for bursting, or just the overall bandwidth used?

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2006 1:06 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] bits per mbps


Marlon
(509) 982-2181                                   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)                    Consulting services
42846865 (icq)                                    And I run my own wisp!
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



----- Original Message -----
From: "George Rogato" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 2:38 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] bits per mbps


But a cahing server if you can't afford the bandwidth.
Seriously, your model, the old model, is about dead and buried.

Cache serves are great. When I used to use one it saved me about 25% on my bandwidth costs. We tried to do this with the MT routers, but they actually

seemed to slow things down.  I know that they (and Butch) claimed it was
really faster.  However, the look and feel was noticably slower, and
perception sometimes trumps reality. I've been thinking of putting some in
again.


How much does it cost to watch a movie across the net using your system?

No idea.  But it's an up and coming reality.  I see it as having an even
bigger impact on the network than Napster did. And this time, there's cool
new technology anyone's going to be able to move to to help deal with the
usage issues. AND bandwidth costs don't seem to be sliding down much, if at

all, these days. The last 12 to 18 months seem to have stablized things, at

least around here.



  Just be glad you aren't a  competitor of mine.

Wrong answer, It should be the other way around. Because we don't bit
charge, we manage our network to accomadate our users needs.
I would imagine that if you were here telling your subs that they had to
pay more, they would be coming this way.

Yeppers. They can and they will. But not all of them. Only the bandwidth
hogs.

Look at it like this, choke a customer to 512k instead of 2000k.  Is that
customer going to do any less on the network? Nope. He's gonna do what he
wanted to do all alone.  It'll just take him longer.

I've got almost 400 broadband users on my network.  At 512k that means I'd
need 200ish mbps to take care of them if they all used it all the time.
Instead, we're actually averaging about 1.5 in, .5 out on the main site. .8

in and .2 out here in Odessa.  So my 400 broadband users are averaging 2.5
megs in and 1 out. That's a LOT better than even the 10 megs you'll need if

my top ten users move to your service.....

AND when selling speed, you are in direct competion with the companies that
own the bulk of the network.  Who wants to try to compete agains the telco
or the cable co?  Yikes.

Just for kicks, lets look at the last 7 days here on my network:
Odessa:
     Max In:  3.18 Mb  Average In:  1.22 Mb  Current In:  1.02 Mb
     Max Out:  737.05 Kb  Average Out:  275.54 Kb  Current Out:  172.59 Kb


Ephrata:
     Max In:  6.53 Mb  Average In:  1.69 Mb  Current In:  2.04 Mb
     Max Out:  2.35 Mb  Average Out:  479.40 Kb  Current Out:  823.21 Kb


So, even at this rate, I'm still on track for a max usage of 400 users vs.
your 20 users at 512k.

AND I don't HAVE to try to provide that 512k for all of my users. Sure they

expect that today, heck, many get mad when they don't see the 2000k they
usually do.  I can honestly tell them that I'm not selling speed.  I'm
selling capacity.  For me, adding speed is fairly cheap.  Adding capacity
costs too much.


I'm not scared of my subs usage, I've been building out specifically for
their future high usage needs.

You should be scared of this.  At some point you'll have to put a limit on
them.  Ever figured out how many 128k users it takes to tie up a $500 per
month t-1???  At $30 to $40 per month the numbers just don't work.

Now, don't go telling me about your amazing $20 per mbps bandwith deal.
Cause we BOTH know that it's not really costing you that.  There are also
transport fees etc. that have to be figured in to get an apples to apples
comparison.  Sure I pay $200 per meg of usage here in Odessa.  But I also
pay $800 per month for the circuit that'll carry those megs!


Bottom line, you need to get over the hump of not having enough subs to
pay for the extra bandwidth where you can get a much better per meg rate.

Get more subs!

Grin.  working on it!


George


Right now, we have 9 users over 10 gigs per month.
That means that 5% of my customers are more than, much more than, 5% of
my bw costs.  The average person is using less than 2 gigs.

Worst of all, the OTHER customers on the towers that the highest of the
high end users are calling about bad service.

Soo000, how would you like to be a competitor here, knowing that I'm
gonna give you the highest of the bw hogs? What are YOU gonna do to stay

in business?

laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181                                   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)                    Consulting services
42846865 (icq)                                    And I run my own wisp!
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



----- Original Message ----- From: "George Rogato" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 1:45 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] bits per mbps


Guess it cmes down to what you are selling and what does it cost you to
do business.

First f, you are selling a simle internet conection for a casual user.
If you want you can squeeze them fr every little "bit".

I wonder why you have to charge them more, if you are being billed at
the 95%

My understanding is the 95 percentile is a snap shot at peak time and
the top 5% lobbed of to come up with your usage. What this means to me
is that on wed evening at 8PM when you hit 9.543megs a second which is
your highest usage, could be sunday morning or friday evening for that
matter, they call that the peak and lob off 5% and bill you there.

So on monday morning when you are going 4.5 or 2.2MBPS or sat evening
when you hit 5 or 6 megs, there is no difference in cost to you. t's all

under the peak.

So why bother unless your true goal is to figure out how hard you can
squeeze you sub. Which is not right or wrong, just your business not any

ones elses.

I have a sub that uploads a 250 meg file twice a day to my server and
does this every day.
If he was your sub how much would you charge them?

George


Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote:
Hi All,

OK, so now that we know who our heavy users are I have to come up with
a couple of things.

First, I have to figure out how many kbps a gig of download would be.
Specifically, I've got a couple of customers doing 50 gigs per month.
How many kbps does it take to generate that?

We pay for our internet based on kbps.

Next, what do we do for an overage fee?  Currently it's set as $5 for
the first gig, $10 for the second, $20 for the third etc.  At 25 gigs
the customer has a $5,000,000 bill.  Sure that'll run off the abusers,
but I'd rather find a more reasonable way to bill them.

We have a business customer that legitimately uses 40 to 50 gig per
month. We just moved them from $75 to $350 per month (matched the t-1
price they pay in another town).  They don't feel abused and I feel
more comfortable about their usage.  We bumped them up to 60 gigs
included.

I have another customer that's at 10 gigs now (our included limit is
4). We talked about an appropriate rate of increase.  Under our
standard levels, they'd more than double their bill.  If we hit them
with a couple of hundred in billing they'd go elsewhere.  We would,
however, like to dig a little bit deeper into their back pocket.  I
talked with them a bit about our need to recover costs based on their
usage etc.

They said if we hit $100 to $125 they'd not have a problem with that.

On our end we have two problems.  One, we pay for internet based on
usage. The more they use the more we pay.  Our costs were up 15% last
month.  The other, maybe worse issue, is that we have to increase the
capacity to towers that have heavy users on them.  Possibly to the
point of a dedicated ap to cover just a customer or three.  Now we're
really talking bucks and spectrum issues etc.

My original idea was that if a person went over by a gig or two we'd
ding them a few dollars as a "shot across the bow" kind of thing.
Around 50 of our 400 users are going over the new 4 gig level though.
Some will fix that by getting postini and dropping the spam. Some will

fix that by getting the kids to turn off the file sharing programs.
And some are legitimately using that much data.

In the end, we don't want to run off people if we can help it.  Those
at the 30 to 50 gig level will probably leave us for other services,
but that's gonna be ok.  They mess things up for everyone around them.
Better that my competitors have customers like that than we do.  For
all of the rest, we need to recover our costs, and hopefully make a
little extra money on them.

Soooo, my new idea is, gigs 5 through 10 would be at $5 per month.
Gigs 10 through 20 at $10 per gig. Over 20, call for a price and we'll

work something out that works for all of us.  We really need it to
naturally hit around $350 at the 50 gig level to match what we did with

the first big customer.

Thougths????

Marlon
(509) 982-2181                                   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)                    Consulting services
42846865 (icq)                                    And I run my own
wisp!
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam





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