Thanks Brian,
I haven't really gotten into the Devices side of things as of late, and hand't considered that angle, but I can accept what you've outlined below. I was just curious as i see a constant "you gotta go XHTML" but we aren't following through with some sort of rewards? either technology wise or "coool factors".
The sad part is, while i enjoy backward compatibility as it saves your butt more times then none, it can sadly sufficate good / new concepts to death as people keep ignoring the new and stick with the old. I will say that the user of Object tag was a new one for me.. is there any compatibility issues out there for using it that you know off?
Regards Scott Barnes
Brian Cummiskey wrote:
Scott Barnes wrote:
Q. I've been on the List for a while now, and while i love the webstandards concept, i'm finding it hard to believe that the web will adjust itself to suite extensions like XHTML? The reason i say this is if we were to make a concious decision to move forward, it would be years 5+ before we would even see a shift in its coding standards alone, not to mention implementing STRICT. If this IS the case, what benefits are we getting as developers for taking on extra headaches in making it W3C compliant (who by the way aren't an international elected body - more of a group that have taken liberty to makeup standards).
the most important to me, is search engine rankings. css-driven compliant code are read much easier by the bots. but more so, its for blind and other handicapped folks as well. governnment related sites here in the states are REQUIRED by US law to meet 508 accesibility standards. And even more so, the internet is changing. more and more folks are using palms, cell phones, and other devices to hit the web. that is only gowing each and every day. try throwing a table-based image layout to a text browser on a phone, and your site is worthless. have a full xhtml, or even wap, and mobile devices can read the text. it might not look pretty- but the fact remains that it can STILL be read.
To me, tags like iframe are being used and quite a lot and do do away with them, is in many ways the kiss of death for movements like this, as you will be faught all the way. Even though the tag is a wrapper (defined in DTD) in many ways for the HTML Object it still leaves me wondering why tags like iframe aren't valid? to me they seemed harmless along with tags like B to STRONG so forth.
they aren't valid because, again, devices as above can't handel them. I hate i frames. i see zero purpse to them. In my opinion, an iframe serves as a hack-job approach to dynamic content. its simply the wrong tool for the job.
Not to mention the web is looking to shift away from browsers, and move more to native XML packets to run its presentation layer on applications (ie MXML, AXML, XFORMS etc). It just seems lately to be a futile battle, and extensive one and yet no real gains? why would a developer go out of his/her way to learn XHTML?
I shoudl have read ths hwole thing before replying :) seems like we're on the same megahurtz :)
the problem with learnign xhtml 1.0 is that, theres next to nothing to leran from html 4.01. all lowercase tags, and a couple properties missing....
but really, XHTML 1.1 is where it becomes a learning process- its the modularization that the whole web is slowly moving to.
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11/
I personally use strict XHTML as its the only real DTD that fixes the Box Model bug in both IE & Mozilla (consistencey). Its got added pain, but i'm used to it now.. but others well they'd go "too hard pile"
take a look here: http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=BoxModelHack http://css.maxdesign.com.au/listamatic/about-boxmodel.htm ***************************************************** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help *****************************************************
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