Fair enough. I've been pretty quiet on the forum recently, but felt I had to 
respond to DP's assertion that atheists were "gloating" over scoring higher in 
questionaire on religion. As an atheist myself I couldn't let that pass. My 
responses were pretty much designed to goad a reaction from a glassy-eyed 
fundamentalist, but to DP's credit he is much more reasonable, intelligent and 
moderate than that (my apologys to DP for the assumption). To take the matter 
back to things Zen. I don't put Zen in the same category as religion, in the 
sense of the monotheitic traditions, because Zen doesn't rely on words or 
scripture and the outwardly ceremonial aspects can easily be dismissed (they're 
just representative of a cultural overlay, anyway). I think there's a huge 
difference between Jesus' exhortation to "Follow me (or else)" and Buddha's "Ba 
a lamp unto yourself". I'm much more in the Sam Harris camp (an atheist and a 
scientist) than the Dawkins/Hitchens camp. Harris sees the danger of religion 
mixing with politics, but doesn't dismiss the mystical/'spiritual' aspect of 
human experience, although he does dimiss the religious overlay that is usually 
put onto these experiences (in other words, peak/transcendant experiences occur 
in all cultures and is a universal, human experience - not divine). Having had 
such an experience myself, I can't dismiss them as easily as Dawkins et al. 
that puts things back on topic : )


From: Maria Lopez <>
To: Zen Forum <>
Sent: Thu, 7 October, 2010 3:26:17
Subject: [Zen] Note

Hello all:
Whatever them has always welcome in this forum.  And that has made from this 
forum a nice one to participate on.  However, it has been noticeable to me  
the forum is getting less zen and more chatting and religious, politics 
That is gaining strenght and overtaking all the essence and energy of just rare 
zen postings.  And this is kind of sad.  Discussions of all kinds plus chatting 
are ok but if those discussions away of zen wave overtake the forum, then what 
is left for the practicioners to share or even to participate on it as the 
posting gets swallow by all the rest non zen posting?.  There are religious 
boards for every religion, why not to become a member there and do the posting 
over there?.  Just a thought.


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