Bill, Khun jai dee mak. So is JM, except that his 'jai' is more confusing and confused. Anthony
--- On Sun, 17/4/11, Bill! <[email protected]> wrote: From: Bill! <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release To: [email protected] Date: Sunday, 17 April, 2011, 5:33 PM Anthony, my responses are embedded below: --- In [email protected], Anthony Wu <wuasg@...> wrote: > Chakra is a complicated system, which has to be experienced with Tantra and other Hindu technique. [Bill!] My general rule is if things are complicated they're probably maya. When the mind gets to work it makes everything very complicated. Zen is not complicated at all. > Though JM denies, he is still bound by terminology such as heart and mind. Of course, I am too. [Bill!] We're all 'bound by terminology' when we use words; and it especially so in a text-based medium such as this. > I think Sanskrit word 'citta' and Thai 'jai' means 'heart' in the beginning, and extended to refer to 'mind'. Do you think so? > We should always be jai yen, not jai ron/ [Bill!] I'm not sure what 'ciita' means, but I have a good idea what the Tahi word 'jai' means. 'Jai yen' means 'cool heart' or 'composed'; 'jai ron' means 'hot heart' or 'excitiable/angry'. More important to me than having 'jai yen' or 'jai ron' is having 'jai dee' and not 'jai dum'. ...Bill! > --- On Sat, 16/4/11, Bill! BillSmart@... wrote: > > > From: Bill! BillSmart@... > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release > To: [email protected] > Date: Saturday, 16 April, 2011, 9:02 AM > > >  > > > > JMJM, > > JMJM and Anthony, > > I'm not trying to enter this discussion, but what you said below could be extended to say the heart (heart beat) is dependent upon the autonomic nervous system which is located in various parts of the spine. Maybe these have been researched and correspond to 'chakras'. > > I have no idea or interest in this, but it's just a suggestion...Bill! > > --- In [email protected], Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 chan.jmjm@ wrote: > > > > Yes, Anthony, no problem. The heart includes the mind. But the mind > > does not contain the heart. As Daniel said, heart is the "grand central > > station". Forget the Chinese definition, just feel it. :-) JM. > > > > Or, perhaps, think in physiological term. Without the heart pumping > > blood to the brain. The brain is dead. > > > > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can > > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com > > http://www.heartchan.org > > > > > > On 4/15/2011 6:05 AM, Anthony Wu wrote: > > > > > > JMJM, > > > Don't think I am making trouble for you. I am just curious. On your > > > part, you have not 'conquered your terminology' either, because you > > > keep enhancing the 'heart' and disparaging the 'mind'. I am wondering > > > what your teacher says in Chinese referring to 'heart' and 'mind'. As > > > far as I can see from my limited knowledge, both are referred to in > > > Chinese by 'xin'. In general, they are the same, but sometimes they > > > may mean different things. That is why I keep asking. My question is > > > not about terminology, but you say you have different experiences with > > > regard to the mind and the heart. Can you elaborate? > > > Anthony > > > > > > --- On *Fri, 15/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 > > > /chan.jmjm@/* wrote: > > > > > > > > > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 chan.jmjm@ > > > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release > > > To: [email protected] > > > Date: Friday, 15 April, 2011, 7:53 AM > > > > > > Hi Anthony, > > > > > > I understand that you trying to discuss from a logic or definition > > > of words. I am not saying whether I am correct or wrong. At the > > > beginning of my journey I am like you. I struggle with these > > > terms as well. As I said, it took me six year to conquer my > > > terminology. > > > > > > Actually, all my posts are from my experience. My experience like > > > Daniel's youtube is center in the heart and not in the brain. It > > > is a whole body experience. And this experience coincide more and > > > more with my Teacher's teaching as time passes. > > > > > > Don't mean to confuse you. I also like to say, in my states, > > > there is no mind and no heart, just chi, electricity and lights. > > > The key point IMO, is that state of kensho, satori, or even just > > > Jhana can not sustained without chi, which is labeled as vital > > > energy by Daniel. > > > > > > Of course, my experience could also be labeled as maya by Bill. :-) > > > > > > It is not important what I say or experience. It is only > > > important what you experience. As you well know, Buddha said > > > clearly in Diamond sutra that He said NO dharma. > > > > > > Best, JM > > > > > > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can > > > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com <http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com/> > > > http://www.heartchan.org <http://www.heartchan.org/> > > > > > > > > > On 4/14/2011 4:10 PM, Anthony Wu wrote: > > >> JM, > > >> What is 'mind'? What is 'heart'? What is the difference between > > >> 'mind' and 'heart'? > > >> Anthony > > >> > > >> --- On *Fri, 15/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 > > >> /chan.jmjm@ > > >> <http://sg.mc774.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=chan.jmjm@/* > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >> > > >> From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 chan.jmjm@ > > >> <http://sg.mc774.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=chan.jmjm@ > > >> Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release > > >> To: [email protected] > > >> <http://sg.mc774.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] > > >> Date: Friday, 15 April, 2011, 3:36 AM > > >> > > >> Wow, Thank you ED. I have watched the first one. > > >> > > >> HuangDi Neijing said it very clearly for 2,000 years, "Our > > >> Shen, or inner divine, requires the support of Qi or Chi." > > >> > > >> Personally, having a high tech BG, it took me 6 years to wake > > >> up to the fact that our Teaching is not about our mind. It > > >> is about our entire being. And at the center of it, is our > > >> heart. > > >> > > >> That's my witness. Now there is someone else too. Thank you > > >> again, ED. Lovely day today. > > >> :-) > > >> JM > > >> > > >> BTW, I was just informed that our version of Diamond Sutra is > > >> on youtube with English subtitle. > > >> http://www.youtube.com/joycedaolian#p/u/4/ROkmtB1fB8I > > >> > > >> Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can > > >> http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com <http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com/> > > >> http://www.heartchan.org <http://www.heartchan.org/> > > >> > > >> > > >> On 4/14/2011 10:25 AM, ED wrote: > > >>> Mike, two more tapes by Empty_Grace. I experience this guy > > >>> as knowing what he is talking about. JM, he has good things > > >>> to say about the Heart. --ED > > >>> The Three Dimensions of Release > > >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejQsIFDrb4M&NR=1 > > >>> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejQsIFDrb4M&NR=1> Part 1 > > >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-4Vw54Dabw&feature=related > > >>> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-4Vw54Dabw&feature=related> Part > > >>> 2 > > >> > > > > > >
