you twist things bill! to suit your own thoughts..so you are always the right one...dangerous thinking..and you will not grow and evolve under that mind set... merle not merlin
Merle, No, I don't think violence is the answer. I'm not sure there is an answer to the 'nationalistic' problem other than dropping your attachments. But I guess that would be too easy, wouldn't it? Anyway, you're the one with the magic sword! What would you do? How do you 'solve' this? ...Bill! --- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@...> wrote: > > > >  so must that mean violence is the answer?,,,merle..not merlin... > > >  > Merle! Merle! > > I don't know. Your post below suggested you thought just 'throwing up your > hands' was not adequate...Bill! > > --- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> wrote: > > > > > > > >  bill! bill!..would i take up arms?..merle > >  > > Merle, > > > > So what would you suggest? We complain, and then stage violent protests > > including self-immolation, then take up arms against the 'oppressor'? > > > > "Come all ye young rebels, and list while I sing, > > For the love of one's country is a terrible thing. > > It banishes fear with the speed of a flame, > > And it makes us all part of the patriot game." - Dominic Behan > > > > ...Bill! > > > > --- In [email protected], Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >  just because the social system of tibet is backward does not > > > give the chinese the right to set in...the tibetian people can do the > > > reforming..china is about invasion and expansion...i do not believe they > > > are concerned about helping reform... that is secondary and the han > > > people will breed and take over what was once a unique culture... yes it > > > is an old story...the invasion and the rule by force of those who are in > > > their own country and too weak to fight back...but that does not make it > > > right and just..and do we throw our hands up in the air and gaze into > > > space thinking "oh well,..such is life".... ????? merle > > >  > > > Israel is the result of invasion by Jewish people into the land of Arabs. > > > Is it justified? Should the Kurds get an independent country? > > > Furthermore, how about Australian aborigines and American Indians? Based > > > on language and ethnicity, Indonesia should be broken up into a hundred > > > countries. We had better let politics run their courses. > > > > > > Discussion makes little sense here, unless we find real atrocities > > > committed. You can say the horrible crimes of the Tibetan theocracy is > > > Chinese propaganda, because you don't see them. I don't see them either, > > > however, the social system ruled by previous Dalais were rather backward, > > > which is almost certain. It is more wholesome to discuss whether the > > > Tibetan Tantra is part of Buddhism. > > >  > > > While I keep an open mind, I have found the following facts conspicuous: > > >  > > > - The Tibetan sex yoga, against Sakymuni's teaching that sex is a drag on > > > advancement toward enlighenment. That is not saying it should be banned > > > for lay people. > > >  > > > - The reincarnation practice that leads to Dalais, Panchens, > > > Karmapas etc to be discovered as the reincarnates of their predecessors, > > > to be worshipped like gods. Some go to the length of drinking their urine > > > and bathwater (not for the Dalai's test). > > >  > > > - Visualization and worship of all kinds of horrifying deities, in > > > contrast to the original Buddhism, which recognizes the their existence, > > > but claims they have their limitations. > > >  > > > etc. > > >  > > > Anthony > > > From: Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> > > > To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > > > Sent: Monday, 17 September 2012, 19:14 > > > Subject: [Zen] invasion > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > >  mike i am with you 100%....merle > > >  > > > Wow, haven't been on the net for a few days and too many posts to catch > > > up on, so I've skim read thru them. My apologies if I don't immediately > > > respond to posts specifically addressed to me. I'd like to address this > > > post tho. > > > > > > > > > Bill!. I notice you've always had this almost pathological hatred of the > > > Dalai lama and I've never understood why. Your view of him is completely > > > at odds with mine, and considering we usually hold similar views, I'm > > > baffled as to why. I see a man who says there shouldn't be hatred > > > directed at the colonising Chinese, that he's not calling for an > > > independent Tibet, but that it should have some autonomy, and who exudes > > > Happiness even tho he's seen his land, people and culture decimated by > > > outside political forces (remembering too that the west did nothing about > > > the invasion of Tibet for decades). What's not to like about the man? > > > > > > Also, I think there's a big difference regarding views on nationalism if > > > you're from a powerful state compared to one which is politically and/or > > > culturally threatened by a more powerful neighbour. Should we in Wales > > > just "accept" that our language and traditions our being eroded by > > > English dominance? Should Native Americans and Australians just > > > "accept" their position brought about by colonising powers? > > > > > > > > > Personally, I think a lot of the criticism directed to the Dalai Lama > > > comes from western cynicism and is not a true reflection of the man > > > himself. > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > Ps I lived in Yangzhou (between Shanghai and Nanjing) for several months > > > teaching English. I liked China and the Chinese, but I don't understand > > > how you could say that Tibet is China. It's like saying the Aborigines in > > > Western Australia (who didn't see a white man for another 50 years) > > > automatically became British subjects in the act of planting a Union Flag > > > on the Sydney foreshore. > > > > > > > > > From: Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> > > > To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > > > Sent: Monday, 17 September 2012, 10:41 > > > Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: THE BASIC TEACHING OF BUDDHA > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > >  I disagree...merle > > > > > > > > >  > > > Merle, > > > > > > If you've been to China you've been to Tibet. Tibet is part of > > > China...Bill! > > > > > > --- In mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com, Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ anthony ... i am estonian...i know the ropes > > > > ÃÆ'‚ the tibetans want to rule their own section... so > > > > what...?.... why cannot they?...there are many minorities in china... > > > > ÃÆ'‚ been to china anthony?ÃÆ'‚ > > > > been to tibet? > > > > merle > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > Merle, > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > No way China will give up the strategically important Tibet. Estonians > > > > are a completely different race than Russians. But Tibetans are from > > > > the same language family as the Han Chinese. What they do is only > > > > simplify the pronunciation fromÃÆ'‚ 'rdzogt tschen' to > > > > 'dzog chen'. > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > Anthony > > > > > > > > From: Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@> > > > > To: "mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com"; > > > > <mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com> > > > > Sent: Sunday, 16 September 2012, 15:23 > > > > Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: THE BASIC TEACHING OF BUDDHA > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ have you been to china bill!..i have been 3 > > > > times...the han chinese are the majority > > > > > > > > .. why are you attacking the Dalai lama?///// i know about tibet and > > > > the oppressive feudal regime...however i think you'd have to actually > > > > go to tibet to witness what is going on...the han chinese are flooding > > > > tibet...is that good?...estonia my home country was > > > invaded by the russians in world war 2 and thanks to the allies the > > > russians were "given " the baltic states...so estonia was governed by the > > > kremlin and the russians flooded into estonia... since independence it is > > > madatory that one can speak estonian in order to claim estonian > > > citizenship( the russians would not learn the language..and the official > > > language when the russians were in power was russian...it's not fun > > > bill!..being overlorded by another country...so i say if the tibet wish > > > to run their own country...then they should do so and change to modernise > > > through that not have it imposed upon them by the han chinese... merle > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > Bill!, > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > Your remarks and quotes will make the great zombie lying in Tiananmen > > > > Square happy. But he would say, 'not enough, what I did dwarfs them'. > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > Anthony > > > > > > > > From: Bill! <BillSmart@> > > > > To: mailto:Zen_Forum%40yahoogroups.com > > > > Sent: Saturday, 15 September 2012, 10:00 > > > > Subject: [Zen] Re: THE BASIC TEACHING OF BUDDHA > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > WOMAN LIKE CATTLE (and a lot of other information) > > > > > > > > "Tibetan Buddhism has a legacy of violence, hypocrisy, sexism, > > > > institutional sexual abuse, homophobia and religious rule by a dictator > > > > said to be a living god (the Dalai Lama) - all so the idle monk > > > > lifestyle could be supported by a feudal system of peasants who gave > > > > over half their labor/possessions. Although Chinese rule has been > > > > oppressive for the ruling Lamaist class and its defenders, is there ANY > > > > evidence to suggest that going back to rule of a feudal God-King would > > > > be better than the current system? Has ANY dictator ever ruled to the > > > > benefit of "his" people?" > > > > Source > > > > > > -ÃÆ'‚ http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2003/12/277073.shtmlÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > I hope these will suffice as 'evidence' of my opinions. > > > > ÃÆ'‚ There are lots and lots of other sites and you can > > > > find them yourself by Binging orÃÆ'‚ Goggling. > > > > > > > > ...Bill! > > > > > > > > > >
