Joe, Lineage in Zen Buddhism to me just refers to some teaching style and of course is used to validate the teacher. I think it's the same as most religions. Most religions are based on the teaching of some 'founder'. His/her teaching is usually (or at least thought to be) original or have some important differences to the prevailing thought. If enough people adopt it, it's a religion. Sects are sub-sets of religions.
I guess if you're asking me to put all this into some kind of rational hierarchy in the case of Zen Buddhist lineages it would be: 1. Buddhism 2. Mahayana 3. Zen 4. Nation/Culture 5. Lineage That's my immediate thoughts on 'lineage'. And...by the way my thoughts on a hierarchy like this in zen (lower-case 'z' is just: 0. Buddha Nature ...and nothing else...Bill! --- In [email protected], "Joe" <desert_woodworker@...> wrote: > > Bill!, > > There's something we've been entirely neglecting. We've treated in our many > considerations the matters of "Buddhism", and Zen Buddhism, and then Zen as > practice without any ism-atudes outstanding. > > Now, I'll put to you a large issue, but just by way of opening a matter for > consideration. Leaving aside the issues of Buddhism, and Zen Buddhism, > and... let's say even leaving aside the issue of "Zen", as a practice, and as > a "state". Let me then, or now ask: > > What about the issue of "Lineage"? > > To me it seems a Human thing. > > People in lineages talk about "Bloodlines". > > They talk, too, about lineage-holders. > > The Scriptures don't go into lineage. I don't believe it's either Dharma, or > doctrine, or dogma, "officially". It's particular to sects, though: Tibetan > schools; Ch'an schools; Zen schools; Son Schools; Thine schools. > > What is lineage to you. Is it something you've thought about before? Is > there anything that sticks or has stuck to your ribs about it? > > I've had "goes" with it, and at it, at times, and have now been quiet about > it inside for a long time. And I haven't asked anyone about it in a long > time. How's by you, then, when it comes to lineage? I wonder what comes to > mind. > > Thanks considering this. > > --Joe > > > "Bill!" <BillSmart@> wrote: > > > > Joe, > > > > I checked out my dictionary references and couldn't really discover the > > difference between 'doctrine' and 'dogma'. My sense of the two words is > > that 'doctrine' is at a higher level - like mission or strategy, and > > 'dogma' is a lower level like tasks or tactics. I think that pretty much > > corresponds with your thoughts below. > > > > Anyway when you talk about the Ch'an sect or Zen sect you're still talking > > about a sect (sub-set) of Buddhism with that nasty little > > '-ism' still intact. > > > > Now if you want to talk about 'zen' (lower case 'z') as I do, then okay; > > but 'zen' as I've experienced and practice does not have either doctrine > > nor dogma - only Just THIS! > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
