Roman Milner wrote:

> For zope, you will just have to
> "know zope" - employers will see "zope" and a language just like
> parents see "understanding computers" as knowing how to fix their windows
> boxes :)

I feel like I "know zope", but I don't have a deep understanding of
python, or a comprehensive grasp of how it handles SQL.  Indeed, I'm not
particularly fond of relational databases- but I think that's a phobia,
and I'll get over it soon enough.

> We have a lot of former perl coders here and they won't be able to
> resist the new fancy perl methods.  And within a short while we will
> have a body code dung.

A body code dung?  I can't possibly see how Perl Methods are going to
lead to some imagined core source corruption.  If a method is availiable
in perl, so what?

I mean, all of these "Methods" are going to have to talk the same way to
the zope machinery.  If you want to leave a Perl Method as a black box,
then nothing should stop you.  The very nature of Methods means that
no-one is going to write PerlOffice in a single method.

If someone has a substantial investment in Perl, and they want to keep
that as an External Method in order transition to Zope, then they should
be able to.  It has been a barrier to the adoption of Zope more than
once, I would imagine.

One of the big stumbling blocks for me, in my adoption of zope, is that
it "forced" me to do it with python or not at all.

> Perhaps this is a disadvantage to the DC company-owned open-source
> project model.  They will make bad decisions based on potential
> profit.

This is a complete slam, and totally unjustified.  ZOPE means "The Z
Object Publishing System".  publishing Perl methods as objects is just
as valid as publishing any other kind of object.
It is an open source project, with all the benifits thereof.  If you
really feel that it needs to be "OPOPS", the Only Python Object
Publishing System, and that any non-python object is anathema, go right

> I don't buy this bit about being able to access 1000's of wonderful
> perl modules.  Most people that I know who have made the switched at
> how much better the python library is the perl's.

So fine.  Be confident in your language, and assume that people will
transition to python as they move in to using zope.

> Sorry for being a tad emotional here.  I'm sure I will calm down -
> it's just that yesterday I was one of the most adamant Zope evangelist
> around.  Today...

Today you're taking one of the logical consequences in the development
of an object publishing system and turning it into something that it's
really not.  The reality of web publishing is that people use a variety
of tools and languages to accomplish their goals, and any object
publishing system that wants to be worthy of the name needs to play
nicely with as many as possible.

opinions-are-mine-ly yours,

ethan mindlace fremen
Zopista Community Liason

Zope maillist  -  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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