Gary F.
I don't doubt your sincerity, only your California style dharma. You might
find Dan Leighton's Compassionate Faces more useful than Dogen; I don't know
how you got from Dogen to here. In any case, Leighton precedes you in the
New Age applied bodhisattva conception by noting several recent
inductees/nominees, among them Mother Theresa, Bobby Dylan, Gloria Steinem,
Muhammad Ali, and Thich Nhat Hanh.
Best,
Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
Bill,
I'm on this list because i read Peirce and take him seriously as a
writer whose concepts have some bearing on the conduct of a life -- any
life -- and my working assumption is that others are here for similar
reasons. Likewise, my interest in the bodhisattva concept arises from my
reading of texts which represent it in a context relevant to the actual
conduct of a life (or a sentient being, to use the Buddhist term). These
texts include the Lotus Sutra and a broad range of Buddhist writers and
translators ancient and modern (especially Dogen) who also take the
concept seriously. I don't profess to be a Buddhist, just as i don't
profess to be a scientist or any kind of specialist, because i don't see
such professions as being relevant: i'm here as a reader, and if i'm
going to discuss any concept drawn from my reading, the discussion will
have to be based on the texts in question. In those terms, i don't see
our exchange here as very relevant either, so pardon me if my responses
are abrupt.
Bill [re the Gita]: It is not a politico telling Arjuna what his social
duty is; it is a god telling a human what his duty is to God. I suppose
gods tend to be a bit totalitarian, but that's just the way they are.
gary: Gods do tend to come across that way in the monotheistic Abrahamic
traditions; whether that transcendent alpha-male quality should be read
into the immanent gods of the Vedic tradition is another question.
(Hmmm, now i seem to be the one making an East/West distinction; isn't
that odd? But maybe you also consider the Abrahamic religions as
"Eastern"; that would be reasonable, since their region of origin is
what we now call the "Middle East", but it's not what i thought you had
in mind.)
Bill: ... you gut the doctrine of all its stringencies, as if they were
yours to explain away, and leave only a pale image of Buddhism.
gary: From here, it looks like you're the one who doesn't take the
bodhisattva vow seriously or recognize the stringencies involved in
living by it.
What i am referring to under that name is simply a person who
has taken the bodhisattva vow and is actually living as if he means
it.
Bill: Why don't you try bouncing this conception off a traditional
Buddhist and see if he or she recognizes it.
gary: My conception is drawn directly (with some rewording) from the
likes of Dogen, Thich Nhat Hanh, etc. I'm sure there are many who call
themselves Buddhists and see the concept differently, but if that's what
you mean by a "traditional Buddhist", i don't see their testimony as
relevant. (Likewise i'd rather read Peirce than consult a "traditional
Peircean".) The point here is not at all to describe what the Buddhist
masses believe.
Bill: What if, for example, Buddhist logic is not rooted in the social
principle? Would that affect your claim? Or is it, as I feel, just the
general similarity that you are interested in.
gary: If Buddhist "logic" were so different from Peircean logic as to be
"not rooted in the social principle", then nobody could understand or
use it at all -- including you and me. And yes, it is the general
similarity that i'm interested in; but as Peirce says, you must
"consider that, according to the principle which we are tracing out, a
connection between ideas is itself a general idea, and that a general
idea is a living feeling" (EP1, 330). Starting with a general
similarity, you can always make distinctions, but doing so doesn't
always advance the inquiry.
gary F.
}Once the whole is divided, the parts need names. There are already
enough names. One must know when to stop. [Tao Te Ching 32
(Feng/English)]{
gnoxic studies }{ http://users.vianet.ca/gnox/gnoxic.htm
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