Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
You are right about all of that, but the original post (and the original QST letter to which it referred) appeared to be talking about copying a single signal, rather than the complex process of discriminating between two signals close to each other, and it implied some near-universal psychoacoustic preference for the single frequency of 432 Hz. Not 430, not 435, but 432! This supposed preference is what I rejected as junk science. The next thing you know, someone somewhere is going to claim that Elecraft radios soldered with 63/37 solder sound superior to those soldered with a different blend. Al W6LX [who listens at about a D-flat] I'll inject some science into the discussion based on my profession of electroacoustics. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net/ Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
I prefer the Golden Ratio for my solder, but 63/37 is often the best I can find. Sadly. wunder K6WRU On Oct 19, 2013, at 11:22 PM, Al Lorona wrote: You are right about all of that, but the original post (and the original QST letter to which it referred) appeared to be talking about copying a single signal, rather than the complex process of discriminating between two signals close to each other, and it implied some near-universal psychoacoustic preference for the single frequency of 432 Hz. Not 430, not 435, but 432! This supposed preference is what I rejected as junk science. The next thing you know, someone somewhere is going to claim that Elecraft radios soldered with 63/37 solder sound superior to those soldered with a different blend. Al W6LX [who listens at about a D-flat] I'll inject some science into the discussion based on my profession of electroacoustics. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net/ Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Walter Underwood wun...@wunderwood.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
I don't have perfect pitch, but I have pretty good pitch. For example, I can tune in a RTTY signal without any tuning aids. As a high speed CW guy, I once experimented with various base frequencies to see if it affected my upper speed limit. My hypothesis was since square waves are odd harmonic multiples, perhaps I could push up the speed where dits started to blend together by using a lower frequency. This would allow me to hear the 7th, 9th, 11th, etc. harmonics better and put a sharper edge on the waveform. It didn't work. Personally, I prefer in the 550-600 Hz range. When I was a kid, I used to listen to 750 Hz or so. Barry W2UP -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/CW-Pitch-Resolution-tp7579837p7580030.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
Unless you're using APF, in which case a few Hz might make a difference. Like others, I don't buy the musical CW pitch theory either. However, the pitch of a CW note IS important, and there may be different optimum pitches for various different reception conditions (assuming your hearing response is not limited to a single narrow range). It would be very useful to be able to adjust this pitch in an interactive way. That is a feature I wish the K3 had... Say if you have tweaked a signal to optimum in a narrow filter: it would be nice to then simply adjust its pitch for optimum readability. Unfortunatey. if you do this by changing the VFO/RIT, the signal is moved off center or out of the passband entirely. You could use the PITCH control: however, when it is engaged you can't actually hear the particular signal you are trying to optimize, only the loud sidetone. It is a bit of a guessing game, switching PITCH on and off to find the best tone for the signal. It would be a bit like having the signal muted every time you try to adjust the af gain. Not very useful. 73, Drew AF2Z On Sat, 19 Oct 2013 14:36:37 -0700 (PDT), Al W6LX wrote: A few Hertz either way in the CW pitch not only doesn't make a lot of psychoacoustical difference, but is hardly perceptible unless you have near-perfect pitch, and even then isn't necessarily a problem. Changing the pitch probably has more to do with the self-resonant frequencies of your speaker enclosures or headphones, and room. Choose a Spot pitch that you like and be done with it. When I was a kid 750 Hz was the most popular sidetone frequency. I have noticed a steady decrease in the consensus spot frequency over these 40 years. I don't know why. Maybe it has to do with hearing loss. Too many 'The Who' concerts. The letter published in QST about this was bordering on junk science. To single out 432 Hz as some magical sidetone frequency is very like the New Age videos on YouTube claiming that listening to certain magical frequencies can heal your mind and give you holistic peace. It's simply nonsense. Al W6LX __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
There is a study from 1992 that tested recognition rate vs pitch frequency. Unfortunately only a few tones were tested, but at least one can infer that a low tone is preferrable. This is in Montnemery, Peter, Bengt Almqvist, and Sten Harris. Recognition of telegraphy signs at different listening levels and frequencies. Scandinavian Audiology 21.4 (1992): 255-260. The abstract is: The recognition of telegraphy masked by noise at 40 and 80 signs/min telegraphy speed was studied in 10 normal-hearing subjects at different sound pressure levels (25–85 dB SPL in steps of 5 dB) as well as at different test frequencies (2000, 1000, 800, 630, 500 and 250 Hz). The ability to recognize the signs varied with varying SPL. Recognition for most of the subjects was best at an SPL close to 70 dB. All subjects improved their recognition as the frequency was lowered to 500 Hz, some even at 250 Hz. These facts should be taken into consideration when training telegraphy operators as well as in the construction of radio receivers to permit listening at low frequencies. Furthermore, the critical ratio was calculated at the different test frequencies. Read More: http://informahealthcare.com/doi/abs/10.3109/01050399209046009; Based on this result, it would be interesting to zoom in on the frequencies between 250 and 500 Hz for further testing, also higher speeds would be interesting to test as 40 and 80 is the same as 8 and 16 wpm. Peter Montnemery is by the way SM7CMY. - Sverre, LA3ZA K2 #2198, K3 #3391, LA3ZA Blog: http://la3za.blogspot.com, LA3ZA Unofficial Guide to K2 modifications: http://la3za.blogspot.com/p/la3za-unofficial-guide-to-elecraft-k2.html -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/CW-Pitch-Resolution-tp7579837p7580032.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
Are you saying they don't? On 10/19/2013 11:22 PM, Al Lorona wrote: The next thing you know, someone somewhere is going to claim that Elecraft radios soldered with 63/37 solder sound superior to those soldered with a different blend. Al W6LX [who listens at about a D-flat] __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] Proset-K2 For Sale
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Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
I think I'll replace all my K3 wiring with Monster Cable and replace the speaker with a Bose Wave system Shouldn't be needed, however.. *G..r..i..n.. * Rich NU6T On 10/19/2013 11:22 PM, Al Lorona wrote: You are right about all of that, but the original post (and the original QST letter to which it referred) appeared to be talking about copying a single signal, rather than the complex process of discriminating between two signals close to each other, and it implied some near-universal psychoacoustic preference for the single frequency of 432 Hz. Not 430, not 435, but 432! This supposed preference is what I rejected as junk science. The next thing you know, someone somewhere is going to claim that Elecraft radios soldered with 63/37 solder sound superior to those soldered with a different blend. Al W6LX [who listens at about a D-flat] I'll inject some science into the discussion based on my profession of electroacoustics. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net/ Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] Proset-K2 For Sale
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Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
Hi Jim, My only gripe is that the K3 choice range doesn't go down to 400 Hz. I'd like to use 440, a pure standard A. 73, Oliver W6ODJ On 19 Jan. 2013, at 22:30 PM, Jim Brown j...@audiosystemsgroup.com wrote: On 10/19/2013 2:36 PM, Al Lorona wrote: When I was a kid 750 Hz was the most popular sidetone frequency. I have noticed a steady decrease in the consensus spot frequency over these 40 years. I don't know why. I'll inject some science into the discussion based on my profession of electroacoustics. Human perception of sound is logarithmic, both with respect to amplitude and frequency (pitch). Another way of saying it is that our ability to separate two notes is a function of their percentage difference. For the same bandwidth in Hz, we have better discrimination between two note a lower frequency, because the difference is a higher percentage of the frequency. So it's easier to discriminate a 100 Hz difference at 450 Hz than at 750 Hz. That's one good reason to use a lower pitch. Another is that for most (but not all) of us, hearing loss is greatest at higher frequencies, so we old farts tend to have somewhat better hearing at 450 Hz than at 1 kHz. That's not universal though -- those of us who were exposed to noise (usually at work) that's much louder at some frequency(ies) tend to develop notches in our hearing at those frequencies. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
Oliver, My K3 goes down to 300Hz! 73 Stephen G4SJP On 20 October 2013 18:43, Oliver Johns ojo...@metacosmos.org wrote: Hi Jim, My only gripe is that the K3 choice range doesn't go down to 400 Hz. I'd like to use 440, a pure standard A. 73, Oliver W6ODJ On 19 Jan. 2013, at 22:30 PM, Jim Brown j...@audiosystemsgroup.com wrote: On 10/19/2013 2:36 PM, Al Lorona wrote: When I was a kid 750 Hz was the most popular sidetone frequency. I have noticed a steady decrease in the consensus spot frequency over these 40 years. I don't know why. I'll inject some science into the discussion based on my profession of electroacoustics. Human perception of sound is logarithmic, both with respect to amplitude and frequency (pitch). Another way of saying it is that our ability to separate two notes is a function of their percentage difference. For the same bandwidth in Hz, we have better discrimination between two note a lower frequency, because the difference is a higher percentage of the frequency. So it's easier to discriminate a 100 Hz difference at 450 Hz than at 750 Hz. That's one good reason to use a lower pitch. Another is that for most (but not all) of us, hearing loss is greatest at higher frequencies, so we old farts tend to have somewhat better hearing at 450 Hz than at 1 kHz. That's not universal though -- those of us who were exposed to noise (usually at work) that's much louder at some frequency(ies) tend to develop notches in our hearing at those frequencies. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
My only gripe is that the K3 choice range doesn't go down to 400 Hz. It certainly does - it goes down to 300 Hz. However, I find A4 a bit low for my taste - I'm satisfied with a 3.88 Hz error on B4 or 3.25 Hz error on C5. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 10/20/2013 1:43 PM, Oliver Johns wrote: Hi Jim, My only gripe is that the K3 choice range doesn't go down to 400 Hz. I'd like to use 440, a pure standard A. 73, Oliver W6ODJ On 19 Jan. 2013, at 22:30 PM, Jim Brown j...@audiosystemsgroup.com wrote: On 10/19/2013 2:36 PM, Al Lorona wrote: When I was a kid 750 Hz was the most popular sidetone frequency. I have noticed a steady decrease in the consensus spot frequency over these 40 years. I don't know why. I'll inject some science into the discussion based on my profession of electroacoustics. Human perception of sound is logarithmic, both with respect to amplitude and frequency (pitch). Another way of saying it is that our ability to separate two notes is a function of their percentage difference. For the same bandwidth in Hz, we have better discrimination between two note a lower frequency, because the difference is a higher percentage of the frequency. So it's easier to discriminate a 100 Hz difference at 450 Hz than at 750 Hz. That's one good reason to use a lower pitch. Another is that for most (but not all) of us, hearing loss is greatest at higher frequencies, so we old farts tend to have somewhat better hearing at 450 Hz than at 1 kHz. That's not universal though -- those of us who were exposed to noise (usually at work) that's much louder at some frequency(ies) tend to develop notches in our hearing at those frequencies. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
Oliver, I've used my K3 on 440 for several years. 73 Don K5AQ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] RFTB Tonight!
Tonight is the October 2013 edition of the Run For The Bacon. That friendly lil' ol' QRP Sprint sponsored by your friends at the Flying Pigs QRP Amateur Radio Club International. Join us for a spell to have some fun and to say Hi to friends, old and new. The time is the same as always: East coast - 9:00 to 11:00 PM local time Midwest - 8:00 to 10:00 PM local time Rockies - 7:00 to 9:00 PM local time West coast - 6:00 to 8:00 PM local time The rules are at: http://fpqrp.org/pigrun/ 73 de Larry W2LJ FP# 612 QRP ARCI# 4488 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
I'm using 1.69 beta firmware that stops at 400 Hz. I'm just happy that the 1 kHz sidetone that was almost standard for many years is no longer popular. All of my radio licensing CW tests at the FCC offices used 1 kHz. That made my brain ache, not to mention the tendency for it to echo when using a speaker. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- On 10/20/2013 1:43 PM, Oliver Johns wrote: Hi Jim, My only gripe is that the K3 choice range doesn't go down to 400 Hz. I'd like to use 440, a pure standard A. 73, Oliver W6ODJ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
What 1.69 beta firmware? Current/Latest Production release is 4.67 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 10/20/2013 3:22 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: I'm using 1.69 beta firmware that stops at 400 Hz. I'm just happy that the 1 kHz sidetone that was almost standard for many years is no longer popular. All of my radio licensing CW tests at the FCC offices used 1 kHz. That made my brain ache, not to mention the tendency for it to echo when using a speaker. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- On 10/20/2013 1:43 PM, Oliver Johns wrote: Hi Jim, My only gripe is that the K3 choice range doesn't go down to 400 Hz. I'd like to use 440, a pure standard A. 73, Oliver W6ODJ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
I assume you are talking about the KX3 beta firmware. This discussion has been about the K3 sidetone pitch. Production firmware level for the K3 is 4.67. Bruce N1RX I'm using 1.69 beta firmware that stops at 400 Hz. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
On Sun, Oct 20, 2013 at 12:43 PM, Oliver Johns ojo...@metacosmos.orgwrote: ...440, a pure standard A... Gee, maybe it's a good thing radio wasn't invented back in the days when A was 415. Tony KT0NY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
On Sun, 20 Oct 2013 06:36:00 -0700 (PDT), Sverre Holm (LA3ZA) wrote: Based on this result, it would be interesting to zoom in on the frequencies between 250 and 500 Hz for further testing, also higher speeds would be interesting to test as 40 and 80 is the same as 8 and 16 wpm. Peter Montnemery is by the way SM7CMY. After this thread got going good, I did some testing on my own. First, I moved from my normal 650 down to see how low the rig would go. My KW goes from 300 to 1000 in 50 Hz steps. I found I liked 400 for awhile, but noticed when I went very low at higher speeds, I started losing the resolution between signal and noise. I've settled at 550 for the time being, and liking it so far. Like others, I started decades ago at 750 or even 800, but several years ago went to 700 and stayed there until a year or so ago when I got back active on HF. I'm going to stay at 550 for awhile and see what happens in the long run. All this said, remember if you are detecting tones ELECTRONICALLY (not by ear/brain cooperation), higher frequencies work better. The reason is the same as what makes VHF PL tones work better when they are in the higher end of the chart. There are more AC cycles per millisecond so the decoders can detect them quicker. Gary __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
On 10/20/2013 1:46 PM, mcduf...@ag0n.net wrote: All this said, remember if you are detecting tones ELECTRONICALLY (not by ear/brain cooperation), higher frequencies work better. The reason is the same as what makes VHF PL tones work better when they are in the higher end of the chart. There are more AC cycles per millisecond so the decoders can detect them quicker. The problems are unrelated, so your conclusion doesn't make sense to me. The PL decoders are determining the frequency of the tone, whereas the brain, and a CW decoder, are listening to or looking at the envelope. Moreover, the filtering in front of the decoder will be most effective on the lower frequency tones, again because of the greater percentage bandwidth as compared to the difference in Hz of an interfering signal. FWIW, my CW pitch is usually set around 500-550 Hz unless a guest op changes it. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
Bad assumption. Without a model mentioned I was thinking about the KX3, not the K3. 300 Hz is correct for the K3. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Joe Subich, W4TV Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 1:34 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution What 1.69 beta firmware? Current/Latest Production release is 4.67 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 10/20/2013 3:22 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: I'm using 1.69 beta firmware that stops at 400 Hz. I'm just happy that the 1 kHz sidetone that was almost standard for many years is no longer popular. All of my radio licensing CW tests at the FCC offices used 1 kHz. That made my brain ache, not to mention the tendency for it to echo when using a speaker. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- On 10/20/2013 1:43 PM, Oliver Johns wrote: Hi Jim, My only gripe is that the K3 choice range doesn't go down to 400 Hz. I'd like to use 440, a pure standard A. 73, Oliver W6ODJ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution
To sum up the interesting studies from the early 90's on Morse code recognition and the effects of pitch frequency, signal to noise ratio and code speed I posted the abstracts of some of the Montnemery papers on my blog as well as some key illustrations. See http://la3za.blogspot.no/2013/10/studies-on-morse-code-recognition.html - Sverre, LA3ZA K2 #2198, K3 #3391, LA3ZA Blog: http://la3za.blogspot.com, LA3ZA Unofficial Guide to K2 modifications: http://la3za.blogspot.com/p/la3za-unofficial-guide-to-elecraft-k2.html -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/CW-Pitch-Resolution-tp7579837p7580048.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
I wonder if it would be too difficult to emulate a bug with the KX3 keyer. Something similar to what K1EL does with his K14 keyers (and possibly the WinKeyer). That way, those of us who are SKCC members can take our paddles and use them to emulate a bug when out in the field without having to carry an extra box (a K14 keyer). Maybe this was already mentioned here and I missed it. If so, sorry for bringing it up again. 73, Joel - W4JBB __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] KPA100 problem with SWR bridge - High SWR
I'm building a KPA100 and am having trouble with the SWR bridge adjustment. I'm getting high swr on the lower bands and can't get 1:1 on even the upper bands. 160 9.9:1 809.9:1 409.9:1 309.5:1 206.7:1 175.0:1 154.5:1 124.0:2 103.7:1 (I know 9.9 is the highest it will show and it's probably higher on some) I've checked T4 and it seems to be working properly. The toroid was build by the toroid guy. The diodes all seem to be in the proper orientation and working. Can anyone point me in the next step in figuring this one out? Thanks Stan AE7UT -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KPA100-problem-with-SWR-bridge-High-SWR-tp7580050.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
Wouldn't that sort of defeat the idea of a straight key club which is to encourage using a straight key not pretending to use one? Eric KE6US SKCC 86 On 10/20/2013 4:56 PM, Joel Black wrote: I wonder if it would be too difficult to emulate a bug with the KX3 keyer. Something similar to what K1EL does with his K14 keyers (and possibly the WinKeyer). That way, those of us who are SKCC members can take our paddles and use them to emulate a bug when out in the field without having to carry an extra box (a K14 keyer). Maybe this was already mentioned here and I missed it. If so, sorry for bringing it up again. 73, Joel - W4JBB __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
Good point, but I have found that a lot of SKCC members enjoy using their bugs *instead* of a 'straight key', so I can understand the interest. SKCC might better be called the MKCC for Manual Key Century Club. I have run into a lot of bugs on Straight Key Night sponsored by the ARRL too. 73 Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of EricJ Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 5:21 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request Wouldn't that sort of defeat the idea of a straight key club which is to encourage using a straight key not pretending to use one? Eric KE6US SKCC 86 On 10/20/2013 4:56 PM, Joel Black wrote: I wonder if it would be too difficult to emulate a bug with the KX3 keyer. Something similar to what K1EL does with his K14 keyers (and possibly the WinKeyer). That way, those of us who are SKCC members can take our paddles and use them to emulate a bug when out in the field without having to carry an extra box (a K14 keyer). Maybe this was already mentioned here and I missed it. If so, sorry for bringing it up again. 73, Joel - W4JBB __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
I have never found electronic bug modes to be satisfactory for me. With a mechanical bug, there is positive feedback to the keying that is important to me - that is entirely missing from an electronic keyer set to bug mode. It may be my shortcoming, but I just cannot get the hang of it. BTW, because of habits I formed with a bug, I cannot do Iambic keying with dual lever paddles either. If I were to request an additional K3 keying mode, it would be Ultimatic - that makes sense to me for dual levers, but all my paddles are single lever now, so it does not make a big difference. 73, Don W3FPR On 10/20/2013 10:37 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Good point, but I have found that a lot of SKCC members enjoy using their bugs *instead* of a 'straight key', so I can understand the interest. SKCC might better be called the MKCC for Manual Key Century Club. I have run into a lot of bugs on Straight Key Night sponsored by the ARRL too. 73 Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of EricJ Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 5:21 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request Wouldn't that sort of defeat the idea of a straight key club which is to encourage using a straight key not pretending to use one? Eric KE6US SKCC 86 On 10/20/2013 4:56 PM, Joel Black wrote: I wonder if it would be too difficult to emulate a bug with the KX3 keyer. Something similar to what K1EL does with his K14 keyers (and possibly the WinKeyer). That way, those of us who are SKCC members can take our paddles and use them to emulate a bug when out in the field without having to carry an extra box (a K14 keyer). Maybe this was already mentioned here and I missed it. If so, sorry for bringing it up again. 73, Joel - W4JBB __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
On 10/20/2013 8:10 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: I have never found electronic bug modes to be satisfactory for me. With a mechanical bug, there is positive feedback to the keying that is important to me - that is entirely missing from an electronic keyer set to bug mode. It may be my shortcoming, but I just cannot get the hang of it. I built my first electronic keyer in 1956 ... ~10 dual triodes, weighed about a brick. Self-completing elements but that was it. Reworked my Lionel J-36 to bring out both left and right, and lost my bug fist almost overnight. Never got it back and I've never gotten to the iambic thing either. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014 - www.cqp.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
But he wouldn't be using a bug. He'd be using the electronic keyer in the KX3. Dots would be electronically generated even if dashes weren't. Straight keys, bugs and cooties (I use all three) explicitly meet the SKCC rules because they are mechanical keys. An electronic keyer probably isn't appropriate even if only one side of it is used. I wonder how another SKCC member working him would feel about the contact. It doesn't matter to me. I give out my number and often listen on the calling frequencies, but don't really pursue their awards or anything, and don't log the numbers for myself. Eric KE6US SKCC 86 On 10/20/2013 7:37 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Good point, but I have found that a lot of SKCC members enjoy using their bugs *instead* of a 'straight key', so I can understand the interest. SKCC might better be called the MKCC for Manual Key Century Club. I have run into a lot of bugs on Straight Key Night sponsored by the ARRL too. 73 Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of EricJ Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 5:21 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request Wouldn't that sort of defeat the idea of a straight key club which is to encourage using a straight key not pretending to use one? Eric KE6US SKCC 86 On 10/20/2013 4:56 PM, Joel Black wrote: I wonder if it would be too difficult to emulate a bug with the KX3 keyer. Something similar to what K1EL does with his K14 keyers (and possibly the WinKeyer). That way, those of us who are SKCC members can take our paddles and use them to emulate a bug when out in the field without having to carry an extra box (a K14 keyer). Maybe this was already mentioned here and I missed it. If so, sorry for bringing it up again. 73, Joel - W4JBB __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
I agree with you and Don. My previous interest in a bug mode was that when I'm not in a position to use my real bug, I'd like to have a keyer that did not make automatic dashes just so I don't lose my bug rhythm. After a few decades of using an Iambic keyer before returning to my old mechanical bug I found that a few minutes on a keyer had me reverting to keyer mode in my head, which messed up my bug fist very badly. I just wanted to avoid that. But, instead, I've given up and drug out the Scotia paddles again - unless I'm on my hand pump (real straight key). 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of EricJ Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 9:04 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request But he wouldn't be using a bug. He'd be using the electronic keyer in the KX3. Dots would be electronically generated even if dashes weren't. Straight keys, bugs and cooties (I use all three) explicitly meet the SKCC rules because they are mechanical keys. An electronic keyer probably isn't appropriate even if only one side of it is used. I wonder how another SKCC member working him would feel about the contact. It doesn't matter to me. I give out my number and often listen on the calling frequencies, but don't really pursue their awards or anything, and don't log the numbers for myself. Eric KE6US SKCC 86 On 10/20/2013 7:37 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Good point, but I have found that a lot of SKCC members enjoy using their bugs *instead* of a 'straight key', so I can understand the interest. SKCC might better be called the MKCC for Manual Key Century Club. I have run into a lot of bugs on Straight Key Night sponsored by the ARRL too. 73 Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of EricJ Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 5:21 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request Wouldn't that sort of defeat the idea of a straight key club which is to encourage using a straight key not pretending to use one? Eric KE6US SKCC 86 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request
My IC746PRO has a Bug Mode where it would emulate a bug using physical paddles. Its sorta neat to play with, but as others have said, using paddles to emulate a bug makes my brain wonky since I go by feel (even at my 10wpm). An option would be nice for both the K3 and KX3 since it makes the rig more versatile, but I'd only end up using it if my itching to send with a bug outweigh my motivation to dig the physical bug out and hook it up. Frank KG6EYC On Sun, Oct 20, 2013 at 10:14 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire r...@cobi.biz wrote: I agree with you and Don. My previous interest in a bug mode was that when I'm not in a position to use my real bug, I'd like to have a keyer that did not make automatic dashes just so I don't lose my bug rhythm. After a few decades of using an Iambic keyer before returning to my old mechanical bug I found that a few minutes on a keyer had me reverting to keyer mode in my head, which messed up my bug fist very badly. I just wanted to avoid that. But, instead, I've given up and drug out the Scotia paddles again - unless I'm on my hand pump (real straight key). 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of EricJ Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 9:04 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request But he wouldn't be using a bug. He'd be using the electronic keyer in the KX3. Dots would be electronically generated even if dashes weren't. Straight keys, bugs and cooties (I use all three) explicitly meet the SKCC rules because they are mechanical keys. An electronic keyer probably isn't appropriate even if only one side of it is used. I wonder how another SKCC member working him would feel about the contact. It doesn't matter to me. I give out my number and often listen on the calling frequencies, but don't really pursue their awards or anything, and don't log the numbers for myself. Eric KE6US SKCC 86 On 10/20/2013 7:37 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Good point, but I have found that a lot of SKCC members enjoy using their bugs *instead* of a 'straight key', so I can understand the interest. SKCC might better be called the MKCC for Manual Key Century Club. I have run into a lot of bugs on Straight Key Night sponsored by the ARRL too. 73 Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of EricJ Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 5:21 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Keyer Possible Feature Request Wouldn't that sort of defeat the idea of a straight key club which is to encourage using a straight key not pretending to use one? Eric KE6US SKCC 86 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- CW: NAQCC #6554 | SKCC #10435 | FISTS #16155 | SOC #1038 | FPQRP #3186 Digital: FHC #4224 | 30MDG #6370 | DMC #5698 Gear: K3 #7164 | KX3 #1787 http://vadept.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
