Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[lee]

Kevin Monceaux  writes:

> On Wed, Dec 07, 2016 at 06:42:21PM -0500, Alan Grimes wrote:
>  
>> -> Updating weekly, as I used to do is a Good Idea, Agreed.
>
> Sounds like a good idea.  I update anywhere from daily to a few times a
> week.  Every once in a while I loose track of the time and go a week or so
> between updates.  A "long time" between updates for me would be a couple of
> weeks.

Updating once every three months is a short time between updates.
Updating Gentoo is always extremely painful, time consuming and prone to
break something.

Just look at how many posts about update problems there are on this
list, and there are probably many more that never are being posted
about.

Spending 80 or 90% of your time at the computer with trying to update
the system wasn't necessary 20 years ago and shouldn't be nowadays.  If
updating took about 5 minutes and could be expected to go without
problems, I might be able to do it monthly.

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[lee]

Grant Edwards  writes:

> On 2016-12-08, Kevin Monceaux  wrote:
>> On Wed, Dec 07, 2016 at 06:42:21PM -0500, Alan Grimes wrote:
>>
>>> --> X11 would probably need to be shut down two which is equivalent to a
>>> reboot on a desktop system anyway.
>>
>> Shutting down X11 doesn't appear to be equivalent to a reboot on my desktop.
>> If I shut down X11, my uptime still keeps accumulating.  
>
> I think he meant that from a "desktop productivity" standpoint, the
> two are the same: you have to close every single program you are using
> and then start over.

It's an annoyance factor.

When I have to shut down the X11 session, I can as well reboot.  There's
enough software that can not reasonably be run within tmux.

It's like having to entirely clear out your fridge and/or freezer every
couple days because it needs to be rebooted, and then putting everything
back in.  Who would put up with that?

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Walter Dnes]

On Fri, Dec 09, 2016 at 10:42:51PM -0600, Kevin Monceaux wrote
> 
> I'm old fashioned.  I use text based apps as much as possible.
> I'm using mutt and vim to compose this e-mail, for example.  They're
> running under screen, which is running in an rxvt-unicode terminal
> under dwm.  I could detach my screen session, exit rxvt-unicode and
> bounce dwm without having to exit vim or mutt.  I also have music
> playing via moc in another screen session.  Thanks to screen I could
> bounce my window manager without missing a beat.  :-)

  Years ago, I used to run mutt and newsreaders in separate text tty's.
Then the developers "in their infinite wisdom" switched from VGA text
mode drivers to framebuffer drivers. (mumble grumble mutter mutter)
It's basically impossible to come up with an 80-column text screen.
You'd need 24-pixel-wide text fonts to get 80 columns on a
1920-pixel-wide monitor.  I'd settle for 12-pixel-wide text fonts, and
doing a split-screen.

  Back then, my answer to "screen" was to push the system to 9 text
tty's.  tty10 and tty11 were reserved for X, and tty12 for system
messages.  Here's a fragment from my /etc/inittab

c1:12345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty1 linux
c2:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty2 linux
c3:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty3 linux
c4:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty4 linux
c5:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty5 linux
c6:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty6 linux
c7:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty7 linux
c8:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty8 linux
c9:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 38400 tty9 linux

  Mutt (mail in general) is one thing I have no problem with stopping
and starting.  However, newsgroups have been replaced by webboards
(bleagh).  I have over 20 profiles for my browser.  This allows me to
bring up a specific forum in a specific workspace.  I also have multiple
spreadsheets continuously open for daily updates, as a hobby.  Browsers
and spreadsheets don't restore.  Browsers are supposed to restore after
being killed, but they don't always restore to the exact same point in
the forum.

-- 
Walter Dnes 
I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications

[gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Grant Edwards]

On 2016-12-10, Kevin Monceaux  wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 09, 2016 at 07:41:51PM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
>  
>> I think he meant that from a "desktop productivity" standpoint, the
>> two are the same: you have to close every single program you are using
>> and then start over.
>
> I'm old fashioned.  I use text based apps as much as possible.  I'm using
> mutt and vim to compose this e-mail, for example.

It's slrn and emacs for me.

> They're running under screen, which is running in an rxvt-unicode
> terminal under dwm.  I could detach my screen session, exit
> rxvt-unicode and bounce dwm without having to exit vim or mutt.  I
> also have music playing via moc in another screen session.  Thanks
> to screen I could bounce my window manager without missing a beat.
> :-)

Yep, there are long-running things that I run in screen so that I can
restart X, or continue using them from a different location or
whatever.  But, that's pretty far removed from what most people (even
Linux users) do with a "desktop".

--
Grant

[gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Kevin Monceaux]

On Fri, Dec 09, 2016 at 07:41:51PM +, Grant Edwards wrote:
 
> I think he meant that from a "desktop productivity" standpoint, the
> two are the same: you have to close every single program you are using
> and then start over.

I'm old fashioned.  I use text based apps as much as possible.  I'm using
mutt and vim to compose this e-mail, for example.  They're running under
screen, which is running in an rxvt-unicode terminal under dwm.  I could
detach my screen session, exit rxvt-unicode and bounce dwm without having to
exit vim or mutt.  I also have music playing via moc in another screen
session.  Thanks to screen I could bounce my window manager without missing
a beat.  :-)



-- 

Kevin
http://www.RawFedDogs.net
http://www.Lassie.xyz
http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
Bruceville, TX

What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works!
Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum.

[gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Grant Edwards]

On 2016-12-08, Kevin Monceaux  wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 07, 2016 at 06:42:21PM -0500, Alan Grimes wrote:
>
>> --> X11 would probably need to be shut down two which is equivalent to a
>> reboot on a desktop system anyway.
>
> Shutting down X11 doesn't appear to be equivalent to a reboot on my desktop.
> If I shut down X11, my uptime still keeps accumulating.  

I think he meant that from a "desktop productivity" standpoint, the
two are the same: you have to close every single program you are using
and then start over.

-- 
Grant Edwards   grant.b.edwardsYow! VICARIOUSLY experience
  at   some reason to LIVE!!
  gmail.com

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Alan Grimes]

Kevin Monceaux wrote:
> Shutting down X11 doesn't appear to be equivalent to a reboot on my
> desktop.
> If I shut down X11, my uptime still keeps accumulating.  
>
> I'm way overdue for a reboot to switch to a newer kernel.  It's been 83 days
> since my last reboot.  I've built a couple of new kernels that I haven't
> tested yet.  

64 days here. I have been creeped out by the sudden change in kernel
announce policy, declaring old versions obsolete, and I'm constantly
seeing complaint threads about recent kernels, so therefore I'm on a
version freeze at 4.6.7 until further notice. =|


-- 
Strange Game.
The only winning move is not to play. 

Powers are not rights.

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Kevin Monceaux]

On Wed, Dec 07, 2016 at 06:42:21PM -0500, Alan Grimes wrote:
 
> -> Updating weekly, as I used to do is a Good Idea, Agreed.

Sounds like a good idea.  I update anywhere from daily to a few times a
week.  Every once in a while I loose track of the time and go a week or so
between updates.  A "long time" between updates for me would be a couple of
weeks.

> --> X11 would probably need to be shut down two which is equivalent to a
> reboot on a desktop system anyway.

Shutting down X11 doesn't appear to be equivalent to a reboot on my desktop.
If I shut down X11, my uptime still keeps accumulating.  

I'm way overdue for a reboot to switch to a newer kernel.  It's been 83 days
since my last reboot.  I've built a couple of new kernels that I haven't
tested yet.  

-- 

Kevin
http://www.RawFedDogs.net
http://www.Lassie.xyz
http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
Bruceville, TX

What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works!
Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum.

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Alan McKinnon]

On 08/12/2016 01:59, Alan Grimes wrote:
> Mick wrote:
>> 2. If problems show up, forget the script and use 'emerge -avuND world' as 
>> Mr. 
>> McKinnon suggested.  In most cases this will resolve any conflicts on its 
>> own.  
>> You could add '--backtrack=90' if there are unresolved conflicts to get 
>> portage 
>> to try harder.
> 
> =\
> 
> I do read every word sent my direction, carefully.
> 
> My misery quotient is now 429, Unfortunately, it seems I need to post
> the entire Litany of Pain though it will bloat this e-mail a good deal
> more than I feel comfortable posting.



It's still the problem as before, you have a blocker due to incompatible
USE:


> tortoise ~ # emerge -avuND world<<< copied verbatim, seems
> equivalent to what my script has anyway

[snip]

> [blocks B  ]  (" media-libs/phonon-gstreamer-4.9.0)

You have qtwebkit (version <4.10.4) with USE=gstreamer set, or some
other ebuild wants that. Most likely the former.

You also have, or need, phonon-gstreamer-4.9.0 and that package is not
compatible with your qt-webkit.

Easiest is to remove that USE flag from qtwebkit. Add to package.use:

dev-qt/qtwebkit:4 -gstreamer

This works like a charm. It's what I have




> 
> Total: 429 packages (328 upgrades, 40 new, 3 in new slots, 58
> reinstalls, 1 uninstall), Size of downloads: 2,496,698 KiB
> Conflict: 2 blocks (1 unsatisfied)
> 
> !!! Multiple package instances within a single package slot have been pulled
> !!! into the dependency graph, resulting in a slot conflict:
> 
> media-video/ffmpeg:0
> 
>   (media-video/ffmpeg-2.8.10:0/54.56.56::gentoo, ebuild scheduled for
> merge) pulled in by
> media-video/ffmpeg:0/54.56.56= required by
> (kde-frameworks/kfilemetadata-5.28.0:5/5.28::gentoo, installed)
>  
>   
>  
> 
> (and 4 more with the same problem)
> 
>   (media-video/ffmpeg-3.2.2:0/55.57.57::gentoo, ebuild scheduled for
> merge) pulled in by
> >=media-video/ffmpeg-3.0:0=[vdpau?] required by
> (media-video/mplayer-1.3.0:0/0::gentoo, ebuild scheduled for merge)
> ^^  
> ^^
>   
>
> 
> 
> NOTE: Use the '--verbose-conflicts' option to display parents omitted above
> 
> It may be possible to solve this problem by using package.mask to
> prevent one of those packages from being selected. However, it is also
> possible that conflicting dependencies exist such that they are
> impossible to satisfy simultaneously.  If such a conflict exists in
> the dependencies of two different packages, then those packages can
> not be installed simultaneously. You may want to try a larger value of
> the --backtrack option, such as --backtrack=30, in order to see if
> that will solve this conflict automatically.
> 
> For more information, see MASKED PACKAGES section in the emerge man
> page or refer to the Gentoo Handbook.
> 
> 
>  * Error: The above package list contains packages which cannot be
>  * installed at the same time on the same system.
> 
>   (dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.7:4/4::gentoo, ebuild scheduled for merge) pulled
> in by
> >=dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.5:4 required by
> (kde-apps/kdepim-common-libs-4.14.11_pre20160211:4/4.14::gentoo, installed)
> >=dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.5:4 required by
> (dev-python/PyQt4-4.12_pre1606101416-r1:0/0::gentoo, installed)
> >=dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.5:4 required by
> (kde-apps/plasma-runtime-16.04.3:4/16.04::gentoo, ebuild scheduled for
> merge)
>
> ~dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.7[aqua=,debug=,abi_x86_32(-)?,abi_x86_64(-)?,abi_x86_x32(-)?,abi_mips_n32(-)?,abi_mips_n64(-)?,abi_mips_o32(-)?,abi_ppc_32(-)?,abi_ppc_64(-)?,abi_s390_32(-)?,abi_s390_64(-)?]
> (~dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.7[-aqua,-debug,abi_x86_32(-),abi_x86_64(-)])
> required by (dev-qt/qtdeclarative-4.8.7:4/4::gentoo, installed)
> >=dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.5:4 required by
> (app-cdr/k3b-2.0.3-r3:4/4::gentoo, installed)
> dev-qt/qtwebkit:4[-exceptions,abi_x86_32(-)] required by
> (net-im/skype-4.3.0.37-r6:0/0::gentoo, installed)
>
> ~dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.7[aqua=,debug=,abi_x86_32(-)?,abi_x86_64(-)?,abi_x86_x32(-)?,abi_mips_n32(-)?,abi_mips_n64(-)?,abi_mips_o32(-)?,abi_ppc_32(-)?,abi_ppc_64(-)?,abi_s390_32(-)?,abi_s390_64(-)?]
> (~dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.7[-aqua,-debug,abi_x86_32(-),abi_x86_64(-)])
> required by (dev-qt/designer-4.8.7:4/4::gentoo, installed)
> >=dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.5:4 required by
> (kde-apps/kdebase-kioslaves-16.04.3-r1:4/16.04::gentoo, ebuild scheduled
> for merge)
> >=dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.5:4 required by
> (kde-base/kdelibs-4.14.26:4/4.14::gentoo, installed)
> >=dev-qt/qtwebkit-4.8.5:4 required by
> (kde-base/pykde4-4.14.3-r1:4/4.14::gentoo, ebuild scheduled for merge)
> 
>   (media-libs/phonon-gstreamer-4.9.0:0/0::gentoo, ebuild scheduled for
> 

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Alan Grimes]

Mick wrote:
> 2. If problems show up, forget the script and use 'emerge -avuND world' as 
> Mr. 
> McKinnon suggested.  In most cases this will resolve any conflicts on its 
> own.  
> You could add '--backtrack=90' if there are unresolved conflicts to get 
> portage 
> to try harder.

=\

I do read every word sent my direction, carefully.

My misery quotient is now 429, Unfortunately, it seems I need to post
the entire Litany of Pain though it will bloat this e-mail a good deal
more than I feel comfortable posting.




tortoise ~ # emerge -avuND world<<< copied verbatim, seems
equivalent to what my script has anyway

 * IMPORTANT: 1 news items need reading for repository 'gentoo'.
 * Use eselect news read to view new items.


These are the packages that would be merged, in order:

Calculating dependencies... done!
[ebuild  N ] dev-libs/xapian-1.2.24:0/1.2.22::gentoo  USE="brass
chert inmemory -doc -static-libs" CPU_FLAGS_X86="sse sse2" 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/six-1.10.0::gentoo  USE="-doc {-test}"
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3
(-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/pyasn1-0.1.9::gentoo  USE="-doc"
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3
(-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-cpp/glibmm-2.50.0:2::gentoo [2.48.1:2::gentoo]
USE="-debug -doc {-test} (-examples%)" ABI_X86="32 (64) (-x32)" 6,285 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/idna-2.1::gentoo  PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7
python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3 (-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/chardet-2.3.0::gentoo 
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3
(-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/sip-4.18.1:0/11::gentoo  USE="-debug -doc"
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 (-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/pycrypto-2.6.1-r1::gentoo  USE="gmp -doc
{-test}" PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 (-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] virtual/perl-Compress-Raw-Zlib-2.69.0-r1::gentoo
[2.69.0::gentoo] 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/py-1.4.31::gentoo  USE="-doc {-test}"
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3
(-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/markupsafe-0.23::gentoo 
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3
(-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] virtual/perl-libnet-3.80.100_rc::gentoo
[3.80.0::gentoo] 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] virtual/perl-Time-Local-1.230.0-r4::gentoo
[1.230.0-r3::gentoo] 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] virtual/perl-IO-1.360.100_rc::gentoo [1.360.0::gentoo]
0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] virtual/perl-Carp-1.400.0-r1::gentoo [1.400.0::gentoo]
0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] virtual/perl-Digest-MD5-2.540.0-r2::gentoo
[2.540.0-r1::gentoo] 0 KiB
[ebuild  NS] sys-kernel/vanilla-sources-4.8.12:4.8.12::gentoo
[4.7.2:4.7.2::gentoo] USE="-build -symlink" 237 KiB
[ebuild U  ] media-libs/audiofile-0.3.6-r2:0/1::gentoo
[0.3.6-r1:0/1::gentoo] USE="flac -static-libs {-test}" ABI_X86="32 (64)
(-x32)" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] sys-fs/lvm2-2.02.166::gentoo [2.02.145-r2::gentoo]
USE="readline thin udev -clvm -cman -corosync -device-mapper-only -lvm1
-lvm2create_initrd -openais (-selinux) -static -static-libs -systemd"
2,098 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-libs/jansson-2.9::gentoo [2.7::gentoo] USE="-doc
-static-libs" ABI_X86="32%* (64%*) (-x32)" 474 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-python/PySocks-1.6.4::gentoo [1.5.6::gentoo]
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3%
(-python3_3%)" 17 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/enum34-1.1.6::gentoo  USE="-doc"
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 -pypy -pypy3 (-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-db/sqlcipher-3.4.0::gentoo [3.3.0::gentoo]
USE="readline -libressl% -static-libs -tcl {-test}" ABI_X86="32 (64)
(-x32)" 13,283 KiB
[ebuild U  ] net-libs/libmicrohttpd-0.9.52:0/12::gentoo
[0.9.51:0/12::gentoo] USE="ssl -epoll -messages -static-libs {-test}"
1,216 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-python/simplejson-3.10.0::gentoo [3.8.2::gentoo]
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3
(-python3_3%)" 77 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-lang/lua-5.1.5-r4::gentoo [5.1.5-r3::gentoo]
USE="deprecated readline -emacs -static" ABI_X86="32 (64) (-x32)" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] net-libs/libpcap-1.8.1::gentoo [1.8.0::gentoo]
USE="dbus usb%* -bluetooth -netlink -static-libs (-canusb%)" ABI_X86="32
(64) (-x32)" 736 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-libs/libevdev-1.5.5::gentoo [1.5.4::gentoo]
USE="-static-libs" ABI_X86="32 (64) (-x32)" 397 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/pycurl-7.43.0::gentoo  USE="ssl -examples
{-test}" CURL_SSL="openssl -gnutls -libressl -nss"
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 (-python3_3%)" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-libs/libatasmart-0.19-r2:0/4::gentoo
[0.19-r1:0/0::gentoo] USE="-static-libs" 0 KiB
[ebuild U  ] dev-qt/qtpaths-5.6.2:5/5.6::gentoo
[5.6.1:5/5.6::gentoo] USE="-debug {-test}" 0 KiB
[ebuild   R] dev-python/pyyaml-3.12::gentoo  USE="-examples
-libyaml" PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7 python3_4 python3_5 -pypy -pypy3
(-python3_3%)" 0 KiB

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Alan Grimes]

Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2016-12-07, Alan McKinnon  wrote:
>
>> Your problem is that the box seems to have not been updated in a
>> long while. That is always tricky.
> That's putting it mildly.  Gentoo works far, far better if you update
> frequently.  On most systems I update a couple times a week. Those
> systems have been mostly trouble free for many, many years.

Problem:

-> Updating weekly, as I used to do is a Good Idea, Agreed.

-> Updating frequently pulls in Nvidia Drivers.

-> Nvidia Drivers is seldom compatible with stale kernel versions.

-> It doesn't appear that updating the kernel module on the fly is easy
or possible for a number of reasons.
--> The commands for bumping live kernel modules is obscure and/or
difficult.
--> X11 would probably need to be shut down two which is equivalent to a
reboot on a desktop system anyway.

Solution: Attempt to determine a schedule for updates that is still
acceptably frequent without being annoying. In this case, it was 2 months...

Two Short, Measily, Stinking Months

=|

-- 
Strange Game.
The only winning move is not to play. 

Powers are not rights.

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Andrej Rode]

Hey there,

> 
> IMO, if you only want to update a system once or twice a year, Gentoo
> is not a good choice

What really helps is not to pollute your world file with crap you
installed just for fun or you are not using anymore. A while ago I
started organizing my configuration in various sets in
`/usr/portage/sets/$set_name`. And only the `real` system packages I
need to get my system running are allowed into the world file. And I
make heavy use of the -1 flag to keep portage from writing everything
into world.
I don't know what the current policy on sets is, but if you make use of
it you can easily reinstall whole subsets of your system without having
to spend too much time.

Then, if you run a world-update and you run into trouble you have the
possibility to "bisect" your problem and either update certain sets
seperatly or even unmerge whole sets (of course you still maintain
already existing packages to reduce installation time).
This puts me in the position to upgrade only once in a while. Avoiding
dependency hell software (e.g. KDE) also helps a lot.

And if you want to to a complete reinstall. Just unmerge your additional
sets. Update @world (which has only the most nessecary bare bone system
packages). There you go. A freshly installed Gentoo with your flavour.

Cheers,
Andrej

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Mick]

On Wednesday 07 Dec 2016 21:20:27 Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2016-12-07, Alan McKinnon  wrote:
> > Your problem is that the box seems to have not been updated in a
> > long while. That is always tricky.
> 
> That's putting it mildly.  Gentoo works far, far better if you update
> frequently.  On most systems I update a couple times a week. Those
> systems have been mostly trouble free for many, many years.

Over the last couple of years I only update once a week and a couple of older 
systems I only update every fortnight.  Usually there are no unresolvable 
problems, or breakages.  Occasionally I have to change a USE flag for the odd 
package, but emerge will let me know when this is required.

I think Alan G. can keep using his infamous script and get to keep the pieces, 
after all it is his OS and he's entitled to do as he pleases with it, but I 
would suggest:

1. Use your script once a week, contrary to all advice dispensed in this M/L 
and just because you want to.
2. If problems show up, forget the script and use 'emerge -avuND world' as Mr. 
McKinnon suggested.  In most cases this will resolve any conflicts on its own.  
You could add '--backtrack=90' if there are unresolved conflicts to get portage 
to try harder.
3. If you still get a problem (not with your script, please) report back with 
the error shown and some kind soul will suggest a way forward.

-- 
Regards,
Mick

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[gentoo-user] Re: Well, I went about updating my system again. (day 6)

[Grant Edwards]

On 2016-12-07, Alan McKinnon  wrote:

> Your problem is that the box seems to have not been updated in a
> long while. That is always tricky.

That's putting it mildly.  Gentoo works far, far better if you update
frequently.  On most systems I update a couple times a week. Those
systems have been mostly trouble free for many, many years.

OTOH, there have been a couple systems where I didn't update for 6+
months. That rarely went smoothly, and took _way_ more time than a
fresh install would have.  [But sometimes you head-butt your way
through the wall just to prove you can.]

IMO, if you only want to update a system once or twice a year, Gentoo
is not a good choice -- unless you just want to do a fresh install
each time.  In my experience, a fresh install is usually far less work
than an update after an extended period of time.  But, doing a "fresh
install" as an upgrade takes a bit of planning and orginization.

> The solution is always the copious use of patience and
> understanding.  Your sledgehammer approach is going to result in
> vast amounts of pain.

-- 
Grant Edwards   grant.b.edwardsYow! Gibble, Gobble, we
  at   ACCEPT YOU ...
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