wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger
wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Could be deteriorating hardware. Try a USB wireless dongle and disable the built-in wireless. See if the exact same issues persist with the new hardware (everything else is the same). A On Fri, February 20, 2009 11:09, Roger Searle wrote: Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Personally I found that connecting to wireless was alot more reliable in ubuntu 8.10 :) On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Andrew Errington a.erring...@lancaster.ac.uk wrote: Could be deteriorating hardware. Try a USB wireless dongle and disable the built-in wireless. See if the exact same issues persist with the new hardware (everything else is the same). A On Fri, February 20, 2009 11:09, Roger Searle wrote: Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Yes network manager has improved, but I find now that I am asked for my encyption password each time I log on (or is it reboot?) whereas on 8.04 it joined up to the wireless on login. Anyone know how to get back the old behaviour? On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:48 AM, Caleb Sawtell gamingg...@gmail.com wrote: Personally I found that connecting to wireless was alot more reliable in ubuntu 8.10 :) On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Andrew Errington a.erring...@lancaster.ac.uk wrote: Could be deteriorating hardware. Try a USB wireless dongle and disable the built-in wireless. See if the exact same issues persist with the new hardware (everything else is the same). A On Fri, February 20, 2009 11:09, Roger Searle wrote: Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger
RE: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Could be a timeout issue with the security or the session??? -Original Message- From: Roger Searle [mailto:w...@paradise.net.nz] Sent: Friday, 20 February 2009 11:10 am To: linux-users@it.canterbury.ac.nz Subject: wireless connecting - network manager problem? Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger ** This electronic email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. The views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the Christchurch City Council. If you are not the correct recipient of this email please advise the sender and delete. Christchurch City Council http://www.ccc.govt.nz **
RE: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Anything in the logs? And what is the wireless card on the laptop? -Original Message- From: Nick Rout [mailto:nick.r...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, 20 February 2009 11:53 am To: linux-users@it.canterbury.ac.nz Subject: Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem? Yes network manager has improved, but I find now that I am asked for my encyption password each time I log on (or is it reboot?) whereas on 8.04 it joined up to the wireless on login. Anyone know how to get back the old behaviour? On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:48 AM, Caleb Sawtell gamingg...@gmail.com wrote: Personally I found that connecting to wireless was alot more reliable in ubuntu 8.10 :) On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Andrew Errington a.erring...@lancaster.ac.uk wrote: Could be deteriorating hardware. Try a USB wireless dongle and disable the built-in wireless. See if the exact same issues persist with the new hardware (everything else is the same). A On Fri, February 20, 2009 11:09, Roger Searle wrote: Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger ** This electronic email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. The views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of the Christchurch City Council. If you are not the correct recipient of this email please advise the sender and delete. Christchurch City Council http://www.ccc.govt.nz **
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
On 20/02/09 Roger Searle wrote: Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Same thing here, but not limited to GNOME. I have now had to revert to GNOME completely because KDE4.2 is completely failing to bring up network connections. GNOME is bad but can actually do it if I retry long enough. I have 75% signal. My OLPC shows only 2 other wifi nodes nearby, my Linux laptop does not see them as it is closer to ground level :) Vik :v)
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 12:25 PM, Vik Olliver v...@olliver.family.gen.nz wrote: On 20/02/09 Roger Searle wrote: Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Same thing here, but not limited to GNOME. I have now had to revert to GNOME completely because KDE4.2 is completely failing to bring up network connections. GNOME is bad but can actually do it if I retry long enough. I have 75% signal. My OLPC shows only 2 other wifi nodes nearby, my Linux laptop does not see them as it is closer to ground level :) Vik :v) This is IMHO the problem when operating system tasks (networking) are handed off to some desktop app.
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
This is also the experience I'm having with 8.04 - so is not limited to 8.10. Unfortunately this could end up being a show stopper if it gets worse, not sure I can have ethernet cables across the lounge for too long (waf), hopefully jaunty has it sorted. btw are others seeing list weirdness today? my original post (and one I consequently sent a second time) haven't come through, nor has Vik's reply . . . Nick Rout wrote: Yes network manager has improved, but I find now that I am asked for my encyption password each time I log on (or is it reboot?) whereas on 8.04 it joined up to the wireless on login.
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 12:46 PM, Nick Rout nick.r...@gmail.com wrote: This is IMHO the problem when operating system tasks (networking) are handed off to some desktop app. I sort-of agree. I tend to define my most common wireless network in the OS (/etc/network/interfaces under Debian*ix), as I like to have networking available before loading a graphical desktop. However, NetworkManager doesn't play well with that, and declares that my wireless device is unmanaged. So I can't switch to alternative networks easily ... If I comment out the network config in interfaces, I can then punish the network manager applet on the taskbar to take over, by connect to a new hidden wireless network. Of course, it isn't really hidden, so I may have to use 'iwlist scan' to discover the name first. Not ideal, but a reasonable compromise on a laptop. -jim
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 1:21 PM, Jim Cheetham j...@inode.co.nz wrote: On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 12:46 PM, Nick Rout nick.r...@gmail.com wrote: This is IMHO the problem when operating system tasks (networking) are handed off to some desktop app. I sort-of agree. I tend to define my most common wireless network in the OS (/etc/network/interfaces under Debian*ix), as I like to have networking available before loading a graphical desktop. However, NetworkManager doesn't play well with that, and declares that my wireless device is unmanaged. So I can't switch to alternative networks easily ... If I comment out the network config in interfaces, I can then punish the network manager applet on the taskbar to take over, by connect to a new hidden wireless network. Of course, it isn't really hidden, so I may have to use 'iwlist scan' to discover the name first. Not ideal, but a reasonable compromise on a laptop. -jim Its a pain in the backside on a wirelss connected mythtv backend, which really should have networking up much earlier than login to the desktop.
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Wireless hardware: 01:02.0 Network controller: Intel Corporation PRO/Wireless 2200BG Network Connection (rev 05) Nothing that I can see in the logs that help, this being of the closest relevance: dmesg: [ 53.150976] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready [ 53.211164] NET: Registered protocol family 17 [ 54.442580] ieee80211_crypt: registered algorithm 'CCMP' [ 124.569329] eth1: no IPv6 routers present [ 142.547930] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): eth1: link is not ready [ 142.717830] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready [ 142.740940] ieee80211_crypt: registered algorithm 'TKIP' [ 143.351586] eth1: no IPv6 routers present [ 145.828294] eth1: no IPv6 routers present /var/log/messages: eb 20 10:36:46 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.reason Feb 20 10:36:48 acer4150 kernel: [ 53.150976] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready Feb 20 10:36:48 acer4150 kernel: [ 53.211164] NET: Registered protocol family 17 Feb 20 10:41:32 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.reason Feb 20 10:41:32 acer4150 kernel: [ 142.547930] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): eth1: link is not ready Feb 20 10:41:34 acer4150 kernel: [ 142.717830] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.host_name Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.domain_name Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.nis_domain Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.nis_servers Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.interface_mtu Payne, Owen wrote: Anything in the logs? And what is the wireless card on the laptop? -Original Message- From: Nick Rout [mailto:nick.r...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, 20 February 2009 11:53 am To: linux-users@it.canterbury.ac.nz Subject: Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem? Yes network manager has improved, but I find now that I am asked for my encyption password each time I log on (or is it reboot?) whereas on 8.04 it joined up to the wireless on login. Anyone know how to get back the old behaviour? On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:48 AM, Caleb Sawtell gamingg...@gmail.com wrote: Personally I found that connecting to wireless was alot more reliable in ubuntu 8.10 :) On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Andrew Errington a.erring...@lancaster.ac.uk wrote: Could be deteriorating hardware. Try a USB wireless dongle and disable the built-in wireless. See if the exact same issues persist with the new hardware (everything else is the same). A On Fri, February 20, 2009 11:09, Roger Searle wrote: Hi, over the last month or so I have experienced increasing problems getting the wireless connection to connect. This is an ubuntu 8.04 with gnome, network manager 0.6.6. Only changes have been any updates via apt-get update/upgrade. Connections are to 2 separate wrt54gl routers (home, work), set up essentially the same. I know they function OK based on other laptops connecting without issue. Going back a month, connections would just work on logging on to the gnome desktop. Then I would occasionally experience a problem connecting, and manually intervene via network manager. 2 weeks or so ago I began to be prompted for the passphrase and could then successfully connect. Now I am often unable to connect at all, or can connect after 2 or sometimes 3 or 4 times entering the passphrase. Sometimes I'm having to resort to an ethernet cable :-( Turning on and off the wireless switch on the laptop, or disabling then re-enabling wireless via network manager, or a reboot, or resetting the router, have all been tried in an attempt to resolve with any consistency, but generally it's random if it is successful. Removing and recreating the passphrase entry in the Passwords and Encryption Keys tool (where the password is usually shown in what appears to be a hex format) hasn't helped. I'm at a loss to explain what I am describing, so seeking any suggestions on how to resolve this or where to look. Cheers, Roger ** This electronic email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. The views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
You learn something new every day: D-Bus interface to the ISC DHCP client dhcdbd provides a D-Bus interface to dhclient, the DHCP client from ISC, so applications such as NetworkManager can query and control dhclient. This allows an application-neutral interface for such operations. Whether the messages you are seeing are significant or fatal is unknown to me. FWIW I have seen windows do this too. Spent a frustrating hour or two recently getting a friend's teenager's wireless going. Ended up deleting all the settings and starting from scratch. The same seems to often be the way with network manager. Other alternative? set up a /etc/network/interfaces file for each location and have a script to swap tham over and do /etc/init.d/network restart (PS check those filenames, I am working from alzheimers). On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 1:41 PM, Roger Searle w...@paradise.net.nz wrote: Wireless hardware: 01:02.0 Network controller: Intel Corporation PRO/Wireless 2200BG Network Connection (rev 05) Nothing that I can see in the logs that help, this being of the closest relevance: dmesg: [ 53.150976] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready [ 53.211164] NET: Registered protocol family 17 [ 54.442580] ieee80211_crypt: registered algorithm 'CCMP' [ 124.569329] eth1: no IPv6 routers present [ 142.547930] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): eth1: link is not ready [ 142.717830] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready [ 142.740940] ieee80211_crypt: registered algorithm 'TKIP' [ 143.351586] eth1: no IPv6 routers present [ 145.828294] eth1: no IPv6 routers present /var/log/messages: eb 20 10:36:46 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.reason Feb 20 10:36:48 acer4150 kernel: [ 53.150976] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready Feb 20 10:36:48 acer4150 kernel: [ 53.211164] NET: Registered protocol family 17 Feb 20 10:41:32 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.reason Feb 20 10:41:32 acer4150 kernel: [ 142.547930] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): eth1: link is not ready Feb 20 10:41:34 acer4150 kernel: [ 142.717830] ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth1: link becomes ready Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.host_name Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.domain_name Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.nis_domain Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.nis_servers Feb 20 10:41:48 acer4150 dhcdbd: message_handler: message handler not found under /com/redhat/dhcp/eth1 for sub-path eth1.dbus.get.interface_mtu
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
Nick Rout wrote, On 20/02/09 13:54: (PS check those filenames, I am working from alzheimers). HAH! I read that as I am working from alcatraz and thought has Nick been a naughty boy?! -- Craig Falconer
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
On Fri 20 Feb 2009 12:46:23 NZDT +1300, Nick Rout wrote: This is IMHO the problem when operating system tasks (networking) are handed off to some desktop app. Do you have a better solution? There are many cases where hardware has to be handled with user interaction. The 90s unix ways are no longer adequate. Dito for software - wouldn't an application-based packet filter with user interaction be nice too? On top of, of course, not as replacement. You could also stay with KDE 3.x for as little longer. Volker -- Volker Kuhlmann is list0570 with the domain in header http://volker.dnsalias.net/ Please do not CC list postings to me.
Re: wireless connecting - network manager problem?
On Fri 20 Feb 2009 13:54:09 NZDT +1300, Nick Rout wrote: Other alternative? set up a /etc/network/interfaces file for each location and have a script to swap tham over and do /etc/init.d/network restart No, much better. Use the system's network GUI config tool (even Red Hat has one, PITA but it works) and configure multiple system profiles. Switch profile when moving. Volker -- Volker Kuhlmann is list0570 with the domain in header http://volker.dnsalias.net/ Please do not CC list postings to me.
serious Mozilla design bug
Does anybody else have to put up with Mozilla Firefox deciding that instead of opening a web page in a new tab, you actually, secretly, unbeknown-to-oneself, want to save it? Or when you're trying to read webmail in a new tab, it decides to open it up in a new window? I call that artificial stupidity. Does anyone know how to turn it off, and bury it so deep it can't come back and haunt me? (I am really angry about this - this is a classic design error that I would've expected from Microsoft, not Mozilla - assuming that if something is done once, it will always be done that way, and enforcing it minutely.) The offending Mozilla Firefox is 3.0.6. Wesley Parish Sharpened hands are happy hands. Brim the tinfall with mirthful bands - A Deepness in the Sky, Vernor Vinge I me. Shape middled me. I would come out into hot! I from the spicy that day was overcasked mockingly - it's a symbol of the other horizon. - emacs : meta x dissociated-press
