Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Vào lúc 06:17 2020-09-01, Matthew Woehlke đã viết: On a related note: I use service=driveway (for lack of anything better) for access ways to parking lots that don't have parking spaces (hence, not service=parking_aisle). These are likely *not* public right-of-ways (the lots themselves are

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On 31/08/2020 15.56, Kevin Broderick wrote: First, I'd like to point out that this discussion started off with the question of removing "access=private" from Amazon-logistics-mapped driveways. I still maintain that the mechanical edit would be a good thing, because the tagging as added is based

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Vào lúc 07:00 2020-08-30, Greg Troxel đã viết: What is the actual problem with other people's driveways being marked access=private on the map? yes, driving on is usually technically not illegal, but unless you are going there because you were invited for have a reason they'd approve of, it's

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

First, I'd like to point out that this discussion started off with the question of removing "access=private" from Amazon-logistics-mapped driveways. I still maintain that the mechanical edit would be a good thing, because the tagging as added is based on an assumption that service=driveway implies

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

A further issue we haven't talk about: How much detail is ok on residential property, from a privacy viewpoint? Is mapping of "no trespassing signs" going too far? We show structures, and we show driveways. These don't feel invasive given imagery. They are very useful for navigation,

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Matthew Woehlke writes: > On 31/08/2020 11.19, Greg Troxel wrote: >> What I objected to was not "that is your opinion; many others disagree" >> but "that is your opinion but *no one else* sees it that way". If you >> didn't really mean that, sorry for overreacting. > > Fair enough. I probably

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On 31/08/2020 11.19, Greg Troxel wrote: What I objected to was not "that is your opinion; many others disagree" but "that is your opinion but *no one else* sees it that way". If you didn't really mean that, sorry for overreacting. Fair enough. I probably should have said something like "my

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Matthew Woehlke writes: > On 31/08/2020 10.54, Greg Troxel wrote: >> Matthew Woehlke writes: >>> *You* may see it this way. The rest of the community does not. >> >> A declaration that every other member of the community disagrees is >> unreasonable. > > I'm not sure if this is directed at me

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Mike Thompson writes: > On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 7:46 AM Matthew Woehlke > wrote: > >> On 30/08/2020 10.00, Greg Troxel wrote: >> >> > What is the actual problem with other people's driveways being marked >> > access=private on the map? yes, driving on is usually technically not >> > illegal,

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On 31/08/2020 10.54, Greg Troxel wrote: Matthew Woehlke writes: *You* may see it this way. The rest of the community does not. A declaration that every other member of the community disagrees is unreasonable. I'm not sure if this is directed at me or at Mike. If at me, I'll point out that

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On 31/08/2020 10.18, Mike Thompson wrote: On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 7:46 AM Matthew Woehlke wrote: The objection is that access=private currently *has* an understood meaning, and that meaning is *no* access without permission, not what you described above. Sounds like my driveway. If you are

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Matthew Woehlke writes: >> I agree we need a new tag. As I see it >> >>access=yes >> >> legally-enshrined right of access, like a public street. (Also used >> for private conservation land where the landowner invites the >> public, even though technically they could change

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On Mon, Aug 31, 2020 at 7:46 AM Matthew Woehlke wrote: > On 30/08/2020 10.00, Greg Troxel wrote: > > > What is the actual problem with other people's driveways being marked > > access=private on the map? yes, driving on is usually technically not > > illegal, but unless you are going there

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On 30/08/2020 10.00, Greg Troxel wrote: "Alex Weech" writes: Another thing I just thought of over breakfast, in New Hampshire by default private land has public access, and landowners have to post that trespassing is not allowed. It could be that that's a quirk of this part of the world, and

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On Sun, Aug 30, 2020, 9:02 AM Greg Troxel wrote: > On 8/30/20 11:00, Mike Thompson wrote: > > > > > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2020 at 8:04 AM Greg Troxel > > wrote: > > > > > > > >Being on someone's land without permission is trespassing, but > > this is > >

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On 8/30/20 11:00, Mike Thompson wrote: On Sun, Aug 30, 2020 at 8:04 AM Greg Troxel > wrote:   Being on someone's land without permission is trespassing, but this is   not a crime. not a crime, until the land owner asks you leave and you fail to do so,

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On Sun, Aug 30, 2020 at 8:04 AM Greg Troxel wrote: > > > Being on someone's land without permission is trespassing, but this is > not a crime. > not a crime, until the land owner asks you leave and you fail to do so, at least in Colorado. > > >

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

"Alex Weech" writes: > Another thing I just thought of over breakfast, in New Hampshire by > default private land has public access, and landowners have to post > that trespassing is not allowed. It could be that that's a quirk of > this part of the world, and other places don't have a posting

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Vào lúc 11:55 2020-08-22, Volker Schmidt đã viết: On Sat, 22 Aug 2020 at 19:31, > wrote: I've even encountered signs that threaten people who attempt to use their driveway as a U-turn. This seems to be the rule in England, UK. When I

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On Sat, 22 Aug 2020 at 19:31, wrote: > Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2020 10:14:00 -0700 > From: Minh Nguyen > To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org > Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove > access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH > I've > e

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Vào lúc 12:01 2020-08-16, Alex Weech đã viết: Hello all, I'm planning a mechanical edit to remove the access=private tag that Amazon Logistics mappers added in New Hampshire. They originally added the tag without using street-level imagery to look for no trespassing signs, and they made so,

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

> This makes sense; however, on the other hand, I can't think of a > situation where someone grants blanket access to the public to drive on > their home's driveway whenever they want, so access=private seems like > it would be correct for 99% of cases. > > However, I do agree that because of

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

On Mon, 2020-08-17 at 09:14 -0700, stevea wrote: > I believe it correct that access=private tag be removed from > highway=service + service=driveway, as "private" seems too strict to > accurately describe a driveway (that's part subjunctive mood where it > needs doing, part indicative where true

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Kevin Broderick wrote: > > If I understand correctly, all driveways added by Amazon Logistics (before a > certain point in time) have access=private, regardless of the situation on > the ground. If that is the case, I'd strongly advocate removing that tagging; > access=destination *may* be

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

If I understand correctly, all driveways added by Amazon Logistics (before a certain point in time) have access=private, regardless of the situation on the ground. If that is the case, I'd strongly advocate removing that tagging; access=destination *may* be correct, but since we don't know that

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

There are many opinions about driveway access tags in OSM, some (conflicting ones) even expressed here, if briefly. Plus, such semantics can be slippery and blur among regions. I believe it correct that access=private tag be removed from highway=service + service=driveway, as "private" seems

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

There were several threads in talk-us during July that discussed the problems of access=private on driveways: https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-us/2020-July/thread.html - [Talk-us] access=private on driveways (was: Deleting tiger:reviewed=no/addr:street for routes)

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Another thing I just thought of over breakfast, in New Hampshire by default private land has public access, and landowners have to post that trespassing is not allowed. It could be that that's a quirk of this part of the world, and other places don't have a posting requirement, which is why

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

> I don't map in USA, but when I map driveways in Ireland, I add > `access=private`. I'm always in favor of tags meaning the same thing everywhere, so maybe we need to come up with a new access or way to map houses that don't allow unannounced visitors. Maybe something like

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Don’t recall if it was on talk-us or tagging, but yes there was a recent discussion on this. If I recall correctly it seemed access=destination was preferred if you were going to tag an access value. But since a significant number of driveways (nearly all?) are not physically through roads

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

I don't map in USA, but when I map driveways in Ireland, I add `access=private`. So I agree they should be there. However, is the data that Amazon added accurate & reliable? If it's of very poor standard, then deleting the tag would make OSM better & more reliable. On 17/08/2020 05:33,

Re: [Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Was there a previous discussion about this that I can catch up on? Driveways seem like access=private is appropriate across the board, not just when there is explicit signage. If you drive onto someone's house's driveway without permission, you are trespassing on their property. --

[Talk-us] Potential Mechanical Edit to remove access=private from Amazon Logistics driveways in NH

Hello all, I'm planning a mechanical edit to remove the access=private tag that Amazon Logistics mappers added in New Hampshire. They originally added the tag without using street-level imagery to look for no trespassing signs, and they made so, so many mistakes. The group has finally yielded