Re: [Vo]:[Rossi] University RD has gone away?

2011-12-07 Thread peter . heckert
- Original Nachricht Von: Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Datum: 07.12.2011 08:36 Betreff: Re: [Vo]:[Rossi] University RD has gone away? Rossi has said the 1st customer is a US military research contractor and that the first plant is

Re: [Vo]:[Rossi] University RD has gone away?

2011-12-07 Thread Peter Gluck
This would be the worst scenario possible. It is of vital importance to create a strong reak competition to Rossi, tens of manufacturers of Ni-H LENR based energy generators. Actually Chemically Assisted and Transition Metals based LENR- many technical solutions. On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 9:43 AM,

Re: [Vo]:[Rossi] University RD has gone away?

2011-12-07 Thread peter . heckert
- Original Nachricht Von: Aussie Guy E-Cat aussieguy.e...@gmail.com An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Datum: 07.12.2011 08:57 Betreff: Re: [Vo]:[Rossi] University RD has gone away? It is about which nation controls LENR as it has the capability to reshape the world. As for living

Re: [Vo]:Domestic LENR steam/electricity front end

2011-12-07 Thread Alain dit le Cycliste
You have good arguments. anyway, using the grid, or local grid, to average the production capacity, might be interesting. because most of the cost of e-cat/hyperion is not in fuel, or even refueling, but in building the plant. so reducing the total capacity, will reduce the cost. anyway the grid

Re: [Vo]:[Rossi] University RD has gone away?

2011-12-07 Thread Aussie Guy E-Cat
Technically Rossi and the US has a working LENR reactor. They have a BIG head start. But you may be right and in 12 months there may be 50,000 scientists and engineers working to bring LENR devices to market. That is my hope. On 12/7/2011 6:41 PM, peter.heck...@arcor.de wrote: -

[Vo]:Giant Casimir Effect Is Predicted

2011-12-07 Thread francis
Axil, Welcome aboard! To go even one step further consider that this ability to bend light may actually be more not than just simulating the bending of space time, that it actually is bending space time! Jan Naudt's paper that the hydrino is relativistic is a big clue that Casimir effect is the

Re: [Vo]:Room-temperature superconductivity

2011-12-07 Thread Alain dit le Cycliste
this is a scam. this is totally impossible to have superconduction at high temperature. no cooper pair can survive at that temperature. I'm sure the scientist that make those experiments either make mistakes or fraud. we should look at the video of their experiment. their ampmeter are tricked.

Re: [Vo]:Brian Ahern Will Not Be Presenting on December 7, 2011

2011-12-07 Thread Akira Shirakawa
On 2011-12-07 01:43, Akira Shirakawa wrote: From NextBigFuture: http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/12/brian-ahern-will-not-be-presenting-on.html This is unexpected. Does anybody know why Dr. Brian Ahern won't be presenting his findings on LENR tomorrow as originally planned? The organizer

[Vo]:E-cat paper on the Blog Ego Out

2011-12-07 Thread Peter Gluck
Dear Friends, I have just published a most positive possible opinion paper about Rossi and his E-cat: http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com/2011/12/e-cat-problem.html Asking your help for the UAQ list! Peter -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com

[Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Berke Durak
On Mon, Dec 5, 2011 at 1:52 PM, Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: Remember that guy who measured a gamma spike while Rossi was adjusting a reactor in the other room? I don't.  Is there a link or citation? (thanks) Now there is: see my transcript of the LENR documentary:

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread peter . heckert
Probably Rossi used some duct tape to repair the reactor. This makes Gamma rays ;-) Honestly, after all was happened, better: NOT happened, such a singular observation is without worth. Of course there might be a strange mechanism producing gamma rays, possibly a welding apparatus or another

Re: [Vo]:[Rossi] University RD has gone away?

2011-12-07 Thread Berke Durak
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:52 AM, Peter Gluck peter.gl...@gmail.com wrote: OK, dear Berke- can you suggest how it is done, provided that it does not multiply the cost of Ni. How can Rossi do this enrichment in practice? Please give some literature. I'm gonna quote Jones Beene's Nov. 4th message

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Berke Durak
Francesco Celani is a professor at the Italian National Institute of Nuclear Physics. He performed measurements on the Rossi device. Sergio Focardi, emeritus professor physics, confirms what Celani said: there were gamma emissions during the functioning of the device. --- 00:23:37 | Focardi

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread peter . heckert
- Original Nachricht Von: Berke Durak berke.du...@gmail.com An: vortex-l@eskimo.com Datum: 07.12.2011 14:48 Betreff: Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor Francesco Celani is a professor at the Italian National Institute of Nuclear Physics. He

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
peter.heck...@arcor.de wrote: Focardi said also not much above environment. Possibly there was a dentist or internist doctor or a antique colortv in neighbourhood. As I reported here, Celani said the burst was so intense both of his meters went off the scale. - Jed

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Robert Leguillon robert.leguil...@hotmail.com wrote: You cite the temperature as evidence, but the temperature actually contradicts full vaporization. All of this has been explained succinctly ad nauseum, so please do not ask for any details on it I do not need any details. As I mentioned,

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Alain dit le Cycliste
since we don't know the theory of operation of the reactor, and especially because the absence of gamma in nuclear reaction seems strange, we cannot rule out some change of regime, especially when temperature get abnormal... eg: if you play with U235 in big pots, sometimes, given enough quantity

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Berke Durak
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 9:24 AM, peter.heck...@arcor.de wrote: Focardi said also not much above environment. Possibly there was a dentist or internist doctor or a antique colortv in neighbourhood. Possibly there where suneruptions. Solar flares, really? Read again. I have capitalized the

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 8:43 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Robert Leguillon robert.leguil...@hotmail.com wrote: You cite the temperature as evidence, but the temperature actually contradicts full vaporization. All of this has been explained succinctly ad nauseum, so please do

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Here is another comment from Mats Lewan Hi Mary (Jed’s in CC again), What I saw inside the Ecat is more or less what I published and what my photos from the inside showed – a block covered with flanges of heat exchanger type, I believe I said approximately 30x30x30 cm. There’s a photo from above

[Vo]:Mesauremtn of gamma without shielding

2011-12-07 Thread Mattia Rizzi
There’s a fact that somebody don’t get, or don’t want to get. In January experiemnt, the shielding was cutted (for Villa’s detector). Bianchi used a gamma detector with 20keV – some MeV range. He placed it close to the shielding hole. No gamma radiation was measured over background. If inside

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 8:39 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: peter.heck...@arcor.de wrote: Focardi said also not much above environment. Possibly there was a dentist or internist doctor or a antique colortv in neighbourhood. As I reported here, Celani said the burst was so

Re: [Vo]:Domestic LENR steam/electricity front end

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Aussie Guy E-Cat wrote: Aussie FITs require the grid to be fed via a grid connect inverter and the inverter fed by a Renewable energy source. I doubt LENR would qualify. A few years after the introduction of cold fusion, no one will be talking about renewable energy anymore. All the laws

Re: [Vo]:Mesauremtn of gamma without shielding

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mattia Rizzi wrote: No gamma radiation was measured over background. If inside the reactor there was a 10kW gamma source, with a hole in shielding, everybody had died. All these data is inside the Bianchini report, in January. I do not think that contradicts Celani's findings. Celani

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 8:45 AM, Berke Durak berke.du...@gmail.com wrote: THE MINI GEIGER HAD HIT THE TOP OF THE SCALE, Means nothing. What scale was it on? Did a hyperthyroid patient (treated with I-131) walk past? It takes very little to put some meters off-scale. And yes, some (older)

[Vo]:Re: Mesauremtn of gamma without shielding

2011-12-07 Thread Mattia Rizzi
This fact contradicts those peole that are saying that there is a gamma activity inside the reactor which is responsable of heat. There isn’t constant gamma activity, with or without shielding. From: Jed Rothwell Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2011 4:03 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re:

[Vo]:Re: a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mattia Rizzi
As I mentioned, every expert in steam I have consulted with says this is bullshit. Yours “experts” are the same that measure dryness fraction with RH probes? From: Jed Rothwell Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2011 3:43 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly

Re: [Vo]:Domestic LENR steam/electricity front end

2011-12-07 Thread Alain Sepeda
I support your vision , extending it according to my It experience. PC were really a great progress for IT in enterprises, but also a hell, because it was hard to collaborate. reliability, backup, sharing was very complicated and expensive. networking start to exist, then be reliable, then easy

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 8:50 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Here is another comment from Mats Lewan As for energy storing I believe that has been clearly shown not to be a possible explanation in itself.You simply would need an additional heat source inside to have water

RE: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Robert Leguillon
God, I hate to address this, but you either: 1) fundamentally misunderstand, 2) are asking the wrong question 3) are willfully ignoring clarification If you don not understand the arguments, you need to look back to the early E-Cats, where the question first arose. The steam experts were

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 9:41 AM, Robert Leguillon robert.leguil...@hotmail.com wrote: The steam experts were right in the INITIAL steam discussions. I agree with you. But they were being asked about steam quality, not water overflow. Krivit raised his questions on steam quality which were,

Re: [Vo]:Domestic LENR steam/electricity front end

2011-12-07 Thread Terry Blanton
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 10:01 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: I grew up using slide rules, and programming mainframe computers and minicomputers, but I felt no loyalty toward that technology. I have a bamboo Post Versalog leather cased slide rule in my office. Our intern engineers

Re: [Vo]:Mesauremtn of gamma without shielding

2011-12-07 Thread Peter Heckert
Am 07.12.2011 16:03, schrieb Jed Rothwell: Mattia Rizzi wrote: No gamma radiation was measured over background. If inside the reactor there was a 10kW gamma source, with a hole in shielding, everybody had died. All these data is inside the Bianchini report, in January. I do not think that

RE: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Robert Leguillon
Agreed. The picture is an over-simplification; it is dumbed-down to illustrate the very basic tenet of the argument. I think that it is an exceptional illustration to get the basic points across (think Neils Bohr). You're right that it's more than likely gurgling and sputtering, as opposed

[Vo]:Attenuation of decay rate in E-Cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jones Beene
We have to agree with the comments that the prior testing clearly indicates that there is no significant radioactivity detected during operation of E-Cat. One unanswered question relates to startup. Not just startup, but a possible method after startup of attenuation of the decay rate to levels

[Vo]:learn physics watch Walter

2011-12-07 Thread fznidarsic
* ONE HUNDRED AND THREE LECTURES * You can watch 103 of my lectures (with great demos) on the web, 95 on OpenCourseWare (OCW) and 7 on MITWorld and 1 given at the Tecnical University (TU) in Delft, the Netherlands. Most can also be viewed on YouTube,

Re: [Vo]:Brian Ahern Will Not Be Presenting on December 7, 2011

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:38 AM, Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.comwrote: On 2011-12-07 01:43, Akira Shirakawa wrote: From NextBigFuture: http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/**12/brian-ahern-will-not-be-**

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Axil Axil
In an experimental series performed by Piantelli, he observed the production of either heat or gamma radiation but not both at the same time, if memory serves. From the demo of the first one liter Rossi reactor during the time at startup when the lattice was cold, a massive radiation burst

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread David Roberson
I feel that the description of my analysis of the October 6, 2011 test as the work of a Rossi fan boy requires that I respond. Mr. Cude, you should read my analysis before coming to such a conclusion since you seem to think of yourself as open minded and honest in your assessment of the

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Berke Durak
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 10:07 AM, Joshua Cude joshua.c...@gmail.com wrote: Means nothing. What scale was it on? Did a hyperthyroid patient (treated with I-131) walk past? It takes very little to put some meters off-scale. And yes, some (older) welding rods can easily do it. Many old glazed

Re: [Vo]:Domestic LENR steam/electricity front end

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
I wrote: Despite rapid improvements wind and solar are still cheaper than fossil fuel, so they will go bankrupt before fossil fuel does. I mean they are still nominally *more expensive* than fossil fuel, because we do not take into account the cost of pollution or global warming. Terry

Re: [Vo]:Attenuation of decay rate in E-Cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Jones Beene wrote: We have to agree with the comments . . . Who's we? You? As Mark Twain put it: Only kings, presidents, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to use the editorial 'we.' that the prior testing clearly indicates that there is no significant radioactivity

Re: [Vo]:Mesauremtn of gamma without shielding

2011-12-07 Thread Ahsoka Tano
Your sense of morality is not to talk about possible gamma radiation that could kill the observers? All of whom were assured by Rossi that it was safe? On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 11:09 AM, Peter Heckert peter.heck...@arcor.dewrote: Am 07.12.2011 16:03, schrieb Jed Rothwell: Mattia Rizzi wrote:

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Robert Leguillon wrote: This is the same thing that may be happening in the Ottoman E-Cat: water gurgling out, and some steam. The assumption of complete vaporization cannot be relied upon, and is actually contradicted by the measurements. This is why your Method 2 for the October 6th test

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
*This also will be posted to Vortex - Hi Mats, *In theory I suppose he could have removed the flanges and the shielding to show the reactors, but that would probably have taken some time. *Rossi's demos have always emphasized saving time over

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Axil Axil wrote: In an experimental series performed by Piantelli, he observed the production of either heat or gamma radiation but not both at the same time, if memory serves. I do not recall that, but that is a very interesting observation. In other words, a burst of gamma rays may be

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 10:38 AM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: Are you convinced that the only way for the system to release 470 kW would be for LENR action to be taking place? Is that your hang-up? Where are the skeptics that claim that energy is stored for long enough and intense

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: There is no need to postulate energy storage in the megawatt plant demonstration. It is only necessary to consider that Rossi's client may be fictitious and that the engineer may work for Rossi, perhaps for quite a very large fee or share. In other

Re: [Vo]:Mesauremtn of gamma without shielding

2011-12-07 Thread Peter Heckert
Am 07.12.2011 19:59, schrieb Ahsoka Tano: Your sense of morality is not to talk about possible gamma radiation that could kill the observers? All of whom were assured by Rossi that it was safe? Of course it is safe. Look at Rossi his coworkers. They look healthy. Why discuss something that

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 11:12 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: There is no need to postulate energy storage in the megawatt plant demonstration. It is only necessary to consider that Rossi's client may be fictitious and that the engineer may

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread David Roberson
Mary, you are clearly suggesting that this is a scam. Are you that convinced? Where is the possibility that it might be honest? Dave -Original Message- From: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Wed, Dec 7, 2011 2:08 pm Subject: Re: [Vo]:a long paper

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I suspect you will take wild notions like mine more seriously if much more time passes without any absolutely definitive determination of Rossi's veracity. I consider the Oct. 6 test definitive. The chance of fraud is so low I do not take that seriously.

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I suspect you will take wild notions like mine more seriously if much more time passes without any absolutely definitive determination of Rossi's veracity. I consider the Oct. 6

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 11:25 AM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: Mary, you are clearly suggesting that this is a scam. Let me correct the wording -- I am suggesting strongly that it *may be* a scam. I am cautious to allow for the small probability that it is not one and simply looks

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 11:30 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I suspect you will take wild notions like mine more seriously if much more time passes without any absolutely definitive determination of Rossi's veracity. I consider the Oct.

Re: [Vo]:Attenuation of decay rate in E-Cat

2011-12-07 Thread Axil Axil
I speculate… When a compound or transition metal has a high degree of quantum mechanical(QM) proton coherence; large numbers of cooper pairs of protons, radiation reduction will be observed when this coherence is momentarily broken by a trigger event. In a variant of the quantum Zeno effect in

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I have no idea of the probability that Rossi is honest. I hope he is. He is not, I assure you. He often dissembles about personal matters. If the truth or falsity of this claim is predicated on his personal honesty, we must dismiss it. Fortunately, it is

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I consider the Oct. 6 test definitive. Many capable scientists and engineers do not agree. I have not heard from any yet. There has to be a time limit for these things. As Melich and I wrote regarding cold fusion in general: . . . [S]keptics have had

Re: [Vo]:Attenuation of decay rate in E-Cat

2011-12-07 Thread fznidarsic
The ONLY way that nuclear transactions can proceed smoothly with out producing radiation is under a condition where the range of the strong nuclear force exceeds the range of the coulombic. The static forces are conserved and immutable. The dynamic magnetic components are not conserved

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: And I always have to remind you that there are probably many potential methods to cheat we may not have thought of. You do not have to remind me of that. I have to remind *you* that is a violation of the scientific method. It is proposition that cannot be

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:38 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: I have always maintained that I will follow the evidence and have been faithful to that end. That is not consistent with your frequently expressed absolute certainty that LENR is occurring. Why should we assume that

[Vo]:Bill Gates to build a new nuclear reactor -- with China

2011-12-07 Thread Alan J Fletcher
http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/12/07/bill-gates-to-build-next-gen-nuclear-reactors-with-china/ BEIJING – Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates confirmed Wednesday he is in discussions with China to jointly develop a new and safer kind of nuclear reactor. The idea is to be very low cost, very

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:01 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: I agree there may have been some liquid flowing through at times, but Lewan performed Method 2 after a very large burst of heat, and he found the flow rate was much lower than the flow rate going into the reactor.

Re: [Vo]:Attenuation of decay rate in E-Cat

2011-12-07 Thread Axil Axil
If you remember this from the Kim paper: *http://www.physics.purdue.edu/people/faculty/yekim/BECNF-Ni-Hydrogen.pdf* ...local magnetic field is very weak in the surface regions, providing a suitable environment in which two neighboring protons can couple their spins anti-parallel to form

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:12 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: There is no need to postulate energy storage in the megawatt plant demonstration. It is only necessary to consider that Rossi's client may be fictitious and that the engineer may

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I consider the Oct. 6 test definitive. Many capable scientists and engineers do not agree. I have not heard from any yet. You've heard here and elsewhere on the internet.

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:03 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: And I always have to remind you that there are probably many potential methods to cheat we may not have thought of. You do not have to remind me of that. I have to remind *you*

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: Everyday experience with boiling water in poorly insulated pots proves you are wrong. You should think about the evidence and basic physics and stop repeating absurdities. What seems absurd to you is not to other capable people. A person who thinks it

Re: [Vo]:Bill Gates to build a new nuclear reactor -- with China

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:10 PM, Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com wrote: http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/12/07/bill-gates-to-build-next-gen-nuclear-reactors-with-china/ OK .. start with the MS Blue pool of death etc jokes Q: What is the most common cause of death of laboratory

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Fortunately, it is predicated on immutable laws of physics and first principle observations made by dozens of people who I know to be honest. No. The laws of physics and ordinary chemistry can explain all the

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: As I have pointed out before, that is an invalid argument. Rossi can invalidate the entire line of thought simply by giving an E-cat to a university, Your statement applies to Rossi, not your own argument. *Your argument* has to be falsifiable. It is

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: I consider the Oct. 6 test definitive. Many capable scientists and engineers do not agree. I have not heard from any yet. How to break this to you? They don't care about you.

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:33 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: As I have pointed out before, that is an invalid argument. Rossi can invalidate the entire line of thought simply by giving an E-cat to a university, Your statement applies to

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 2:03 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: And I always have to remind you that there are probably many potential methods to cheat we may not have thought of. You do not have to remind me of that. I have to remind *you*

Re: [Vo]:Bill Gates to build a new nuclear reactor -- with China

2011-12-07 Thread OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson
From Alan, http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/12/07/bill-gates-to-build-next-gen-nuclear-reactors-with-china/ BEIJING –  Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates confirmed Wednesday he is in discussions with China to jointly develop a new and safer kind of nuclear reactor. The idea is to be very

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Mary Yugo wrote: My statement has to be falsifiable and it is: simply by Rossi submitting his device to proper independent verification. I meant your first statement, which is that there are probably potential methods of stage magic or faking kilowatt levels of heat. Probably potential

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 2:30 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: A person who thinks it is possible to keep water at boiling temperatures for four hours at a poorly insulated vessel is not capable, by definition. By any method? In a 100 kg

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 2:33 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com wrote: As I have pointed out before, that is an invalid argument. Rossi can invalidate the entire line of thought simply by giving an E-cat to a university, Your statement applies to

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread David Roberson
Dear Josh, at least you are consistent. Always claiming that someone or something is not as it appears. MY realizes she might be in error and I respect her for some honesty. Now, do you sincerely think that the large generator was supplying the heat energy to vaporize the water? If all of

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 11-12-07 04:01 PM, David Roberson wrote: Dear Josh, at least you are consistent. Always claiming that someone or something is not as it appears. MY realizes she might be in error and I respect her for some honesty. Now, do you sincerely think that the large generator was supplying the

Re: [Vo]:Bill Gates to build a new nuclear reactor -- with China

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: I believe others have made the observation that BG's success has always revolved around exploiting technologies that have already been reasonably tested and vetted. Right. That's what he does. He has never developed an original

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 3:01 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: Now, do you sincerely think that the large generator was supplying the heat energy to vaporize the water? I don't have sincere thoughts about anything on this subject. It could be, and that weakens Rossi's case. Those

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Stephen A. Lawrence sa...@pobox.com wrote: If by steam engine you mean steam locomotive engine, then they actually incorporated steam driers specifically to dry the steam after it left the boiler and, IIRC, before it entered the superheater. That's what at least some of those funny domes on

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread David Roberson
Of course you are making a good point that they did use extra equipment to ensure that the steam was very dry. The question is what is the dryness of the steam before it entered those devices? Do you have any reference to this information? Are we talking about only 5% at this point?

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Mary Yugo
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 12:52 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote: You are welcome to have the last word if you please. No, thank you. LOL.

Re: [Vo]:Bill Gates to build a new nuclear reactor -- with China

2011-12-07 Thread OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson
From Jed: It has been a conservative business strategy that has worked very well for BG. Nevertheless, I lament the fact that BG appears to have rarely shown much backbone towards exploring and subsequently exploiting  unproven/cutting edge technologies such as those purported from Rossi. . .

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread David Roberson
OK, I think I understand your position now. You have a gut feeling that Rossi is attempting a scam, but you could actually be convinced it is a real system under the proper circumstances. You will get no argument from me regarding your statements needed for proof as I am quite unhappy about

RE: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Robert Leguillon
A lot of responses have already been kicked up by JC and MY, but I'd like to continue, if I may, to Jed. This is a long reply, and was in discussion of using the primary of the October 6th test in any considerations as to test validity. I completely understand your argument of rising

Re: [Vo]:Celani: gamma spike during ignition of Rossi reactor

2011-12-07 Thread pagnucco
Axil, Interesting comment. Maybe it's worth noting that the Zeno-effect (decay deceleration) and the anti-Zeno effect (decay acceleration) can coexist and see-saw in some some systems. See: Observation of the Quantum Zeno and Anti-Zeno effects in an unstable system

[Vo]:Discussion of saturated steam locomotive versus superheated from Railroad Age Gazette

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
See Railway age gazette, Volume 53, No. 24, 1912, p. 1148. I kid you not. http://books.google.com/books?id=QrElMAAJpg=PA1148lpg=PA1148 This document says superheating is safe and effective for switching engines. I read somewhere else they tended to explode, so they stopped putting

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 3:21 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: Of course you are making a good point that they did use extra equipment to ensure that the steam was very dry. The question is what is the dryness of the steam before it entered those devices? Do you have any reference

Re: [Vo]:Discussion of saturated steam locomotive versus superheated from Railroad Age Gazette

2011-12-07 Thread David Roberson
That is an interesting article isn't it? I guess those guys knew how to make good steam engines in the old days. I noticed that the superheated steam is at a temperature a bit higher than the direct steam generated in the boiler. The pressure must be established within the boiler so I guess

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread David Roberson
Of course you are correct if water is being forced out of the ECAT. I see no reason to believe that that is the situation since an attempt was made to measure the water and some was captured. It should also be noted that Rossi and company had the input power set to 180 kWatts during the

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
Robert Leguillon robert.leguil...@hotmail.com wrote: We do not have the incoming flow rate, and all we have for the outgoing rate are the two from Lewan (one while it was running, and one during purging). Rossi stated the incoming flow rate was 15 L per hour. I think it was, because it took

[Vo]:Will tests surface mounted thermocouples on pipe

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
I wrote: Try placing at thermocouple on a hot pipe, in various spots, under various covers. You will find the differences are insignificant. I did this years ago, working at Hydrodynamics. I happen to have a nice dual input thermocouple, with a T1 - T2 mode, so I will try it again with a

Re: [Vo]:Bill Gates to build a new nuclear reactor -- with China

2011-12-07 Thread Terry Blanton
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 3:50 PM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: One would think that Microsoft certainly has the financial resources to explore pie-in-the-sky matters. I must admit that I am disappointed to see MS's absence from this customer list:

Re: [Vo]:Discussion of saturated steam locomotive versus superheated from Railroad Age Gazette

2011-12-07 Thread Joshua Cude
On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 4:38 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: The pressure must be established within the boiler so I guess the hotter steam does not make its way back to the boiler. Is it likely that some form of check valve is used at the throttle? If that were possible, then

Re: [Vo]:Discussion of saturated steam locomotive versus superheated from Railroad Age Gazette

2011-12-07 Thread Jed Rothwell
David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote: I hope these steam locomotives are not bombs looking for a chance to explode! They often did explode, unfortunately, even in the 1930s, at the pinnacle of the technology. Maybe a single pipe explosion or an accident was more common than a boiler failure

[Vo]:New Larsen paper on Large Hadron Collider UFO Dust

2011-12-07 Thread pagnucco
Lewis Larsen (Widom-Larsen) just posted a paper entitled: Are LENRs causing some of the 'UFO' dust observed in the Large Hadron Collider? Maybe somebody should look. http://dev2.slideshare.com/lewisglarsen/lattice-energy-llccould-lenrs-be-producing-ufos-in-large-hadron-colliderdec-7-2011 An

Re: [Vo]:a long paper about and mainly against the E-cat

2011-12-07 Thread Robert Lynn
On 7 December 2011 21:51, Robert Leguillon robert.leguil...@hotmail.comwrote: A lot of responses have already been kicked up by JC and MY, but I'd like to continue, if I may, to Jed. This is a long reply, and was in discussion of using the primary of the October 6th test in any

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