Ahhh, the old "own the hardware but only lease the software" catch, hence the "right to repair movement" and the farmers who can't fix their John Deere tractors themselves.
https://www.wired.com/story/john-deere-farmers-right-to-repair/ https://www.wired.com/story/right-to-repair-elizabeth-warren-farmers/ -----Original Message----- From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> On Behalf Of Robert Andrews Sent: Friday, November 22, 2019 5:27 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cybertruck & unfortunately, you cannot decide to wait till version 2 comes out, if they decide to release a 1.1test, you get it... At least that's what my buddy was telling (whining) me... On 11/22/2019 03:22 PM, Bill Prince wrote: > You have to be aware of the firmware version when talking about a Tesla. > The firmware is more important than the model year because they are > updating it fairly often. > > > bp > <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> > > On 11/22/2019 1:02 PM, Robert Andrews wrote: >> They have that ability and do it. BUT the programming has had some >> serious errors for different conditions. When the X first came out >> there were a bunch of people stuck at Tahoe with them. Now, a bunch >> of them came up with tires very much not suited for the conditions >> and no amount of slippage control would fix that, but there were >> complaints from people who actually had snow tires on. I also heard >> that situation is much improved.. Even with the much lower S. >> >> On 11/22/2019 11:02 AM, Mike Hammett wrote: >>> Supposedly, their computer can manage the slippage on a per-wheel >>> basis to get any traction that might be available instead of blind >>> power. Supposedly. >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> Mike Hammett >>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL><https://plus.google.com/+Intelligen >>> tComputingSolutionsDeKalb><https://www.linkedin.com/company/intellig >>> ent-computing-solutions><https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >>> >>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix><https://www.linkedin.com/company >>> /midwest-internet-exchange><https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >>> >>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> >>> >>> >>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> ---- >>> *From: *"Ken Hohhof" <af...@kwisp.com> >>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" <af@af.afmug.com> >>> *Sent: *Friday, November 22, 2019 12:49:37 PM >>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Cybertruck >>> >>> With the torque of electric motors, probably no snow tires in the >>> world would be enough, maybe convert to tracks. >>> >>> *From:*AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Robert >>> *Sent:* Friday, November 22, 2019 10:59 AM >>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com >>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cybertruck >>> >>> It's up on their website now. A winch, my life for a winch. But >>> that with 500 mile range for 60K and I could replace the power wagon >>> with it... Specially with and additional 6 inches of clearance and >>> nothing to block snow under the body, so it would slide on top >>> easier. It might just make a pretty good snow machine! >>> >>> On 11/22/19 7:49 AM, Bill Prince wrote: >>> >>> The range(s) were listed as 200-500 depending on battery pack. The >>> extra motors add power, but don't make a significant impact on >>> mileage (or as much as you might think). You can see this in the >>> various models S, X, and Y; more motors doesn't really impact range >>> all that much. I think this is because just because you have more >>> power, it still takes about the same amount of power to go X miles >>> per hour. >>> >>> The metric for efficiency is MPGe. The EPA has decreed that >>> ~~33.5KWh is approximately equal energy-wise to 1 gallon of gas. So, >>> for example, the latest firmware version of the Model 3 with a 60KWh >>> battery goes ~~ 250 miles. That nets out to ~~ 140 MPGe >>> (250/(60/33.5)). >>> >>> We don't have enough information for the cybertruck yet to do that >>> calculation (or do we?). ICE trucks (half tons anyway) are doing >>> good to get 20 MPG these days. The diesel variety can get into the >>> high 20s (26-28 zone). >>> >>> I was surprised to see the towing capacity with a unibody. There >>> would have to be some serious reinforcement going on to attach a >>> weight distribution hitch with that kind of weight. >>> >>> bp >>> >>> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> >>> >>> >>> On 11/22/2019 7:33 AM, Mike Hammett wrote: >>> >>> To be consistent with my feelings on their semi truck, as long >>> as the performance, specifications, reliability, utility are as >>> promised, I care much less about how it appears. >>> >>> That $40k price point is nice, though I'd want at least the $50k >>> to have AWD. >>> >>> I've seen people say stuff like, "OMG, that too much money for a >>> truck." Clearly they have no idea what trucks cost. I haven't >>> seen what the electric ATV costs. >>> >>> I also wonder what else changes between the tiers. Adding more >>> motors shouldn't add to the range of the vehicle, so what's >>> happening with the battery, weight, etc. Adding more batteries >>> shouldn't make it faster, so what's up with the extra motors? >>> >>> I'm more willing to admit I don't need to pull a house with my >>> daily driver because I can always get something from the farm. I >>> just want it to be big enough to handle most things. Hell, even >>> the 14k towing would be enough for our Bobcat and trailer. >>> >>> I wonder how trailers work with the EVs... how easy is it to >>> add (or get the option for) gooseneck, fifth wheel, etc. >>> >>> I do like the hard, lockable tonneau cover. Maybe Rivian had it >>> available and I just forgot. Nice place to store a bunch of >>> tools for a work truck, though no place to add a ladder rack. >>> >>> I was annoyed they didn't have battery specs, but I suppose that >>> could still be fuzzy. Maybe they don't know if they need 100 or >>> 110 kw to meet their advertised performance numbers. >>> >>> Weight would be nice to know as well. >>> >>> I'm not surprised on the design. All else equal, I'd probably >>> prefer the Rivian, but let's see how things actually bare out. >>> What's the "mpg" compared to Rivian? I guess it'd be MPkWh? >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> Mike Hammett >>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL><https://plus.google.com/+Intelligen >>> tComputingSolutionsDeKalb><https://www.linkedin.com/company/intellig >>> ent-computing-solutions><https://twitter.com/ICSIL> >>> >>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix><https://www.linkedin.com/company >>> /midwest-internet-exchange><https://twitter.com/mdwestix> >>> >>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/> >>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp> >>> >>> >>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> ---- >>> >>> *From: *"Ken Hohhof" <af...@kwisp.com> <mailto:af...@kwisp.com> >>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" <af@af.afmug.com> >>> <mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >>> *Sent: *Friday, November 22, 2019 9:25:31 AM >>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Cybertruck >>> >>> I was expecting to see some comments from this crowd. Was >>> everyone suitably underwhelmed? Or running out to place your >>> pre-orders? >>> >>> I think I saw one comment that it looked like a cross between an >>> El Camino and a Pontiac Aztec. It certainly was not what I >>> expected when I heard Tesla was going to bring out an electric >>> truck. It sounds like the 3 motor version will indeed be fast, >>> but how big a market is there for a fast, expensive, ugly >>> truck? Maybe more than I realize. >>> >>> >>> -- AF mailing list >>> AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> AF mailing list >>> AF@af.afmug.com >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> >>> >>> >> > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
