On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 1:40 PM, Ben Goertzel <b...@goertzel.org> wrote: > > IMHO, Mike Tintner is not often rude, and is not exactly a "troll" because I > feel he is genuinely trying to understand the deeper issues related to AGI, > rather than mainly trying to stir up trouble or cause irritation
Well, I guess my English is not good enough to tell the subtle difference in tones, but his comments often sound that "You AGIers are so obviously wrong that I don't even bother to understand what you are saying ... Now let me tell you ...". I don't enjoy this tone. Pei > However, I find conversing with him generally frustrating because he > combines > > A) > extremely strong intuitive opinions about AGI topics > > with > > B) > almost utter ignorance of the details of AGI (or standard AI), or the > background knowledge needed to appreciate these details when compactly > communicated > > > This means that discussions with Mike never seem to get anywhere... and, > frankly, I usually regret getting into them > > I would find it more rewarding by far to engage in discussion with someone > who had Mike's same philosophy and ideas (which I disagree strongly with), > but had enough technical background to actually debate the details of AGI in > a meaningful way > > For example, Selmer Bringjord (an AI expert, not on this list) seems to > share a fair number of Mike's ideas, but discussions with him are less > frustrating because rather than wasting time on misunderstandings, basics > and terminology, one cuts VERY QUICKLY to the deep points of conceptual > disagreement > > ben g > > > > On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 1:19 PM, Pei Wang <mail.peiw...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> BillK, >> >> Thanks for the reminder. I didn't reply to him, but still got involved. >> :-( >> >> I certainty don't want to encourage bad behaviors in this mailing >> list. Here "bad behaviors" are not in the conclusions or arguments, >> but in the way they are presented, as well as in the >> politeness/rudeness toward other people. >> >> Pei >> >> On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 11:38 AM, BillK <pha...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 3:55 PM, Mike Tintner wrote: >> >> >> >> (On the contrary, Pei, you can't get more narrow-minded than rational >> >> thinking. That's its strength and its weakness). >> >> >> > >> > >> > Pei >> > >> > In case you haven't noticed, you won't gain anything from trying to >> > engage with the troll. >> > >> > Mike does not discuss anything. He states his opinions in many >> > different ways, pretending to respond to those that waste their time >> > talking to him. But no matter what points are raised in discussion >> > with him, they will only be used as an excuse to produce yet another >> > variation of his unchanged opinions. He doesn't have any technical >> > programming or AI background, so he can't understand that type of >> > argument. >> > >> > He is against the whole basis of AGI research. He believes that >> > rationality is a dead end, a dying culture, so deep-down, rational >> > arguments mean little to him. >> > >> > Don't feed the troll! >> > (Unless you really, really, think he might say something useful to you >> > instead of just wasting your time). >> > >> > >> > BillK >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------------------- >> > agi >> > Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now >> > RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ >> > Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; >> > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com >> > >> >> >> ------------------------------------------- >> agi >> Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now >> RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ >> Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; >> Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > > > > -- > Ben Goertzel, PhD > CEO, Novamente LLC and Biomind LLC > Director of Research, SIAI > b...@goertzel.org > > "I intend to live forever, or die trying." > -- Groucho Marx > > ________________________________ > agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription ------------------------------------------- agi Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=8660244&id_secret=123753653-47f84b Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
