Charles,

Now I have heard everything.  Basing the road repairs on actual vehicle weight when talking about bicycles.  Weather, expansion-contraction etc., are the primary determinants on most roads.  Certainly if they are not constructed for the weight, weight limits must be posted like on blacktop feeder roads. 

But I am talking about all the special paths, lanes, snow removal--etc., which makes Madison different from other cities--such as mine. (village).  Bikes and pedestrians use these exclusively in greater Madison.  Bikes should pay for them or put the entire matter to a public vote.  After all, that is what government and voting is for.  When government acts alone it is to exert the "will of the few on the many."  When a referendum is taken, --the "will of the many on the few."  As for the 44% you claim comes from the likes of property taxes--well ask the property owners if they will pay for exclusive infrastructure which excludes automobiles and horses.  I have posted the explanation of your Madison current licensing fee which seems to be just a collection to support a Madison office of bike licensing--nothing more.  If your bike is stolen and the robber leaves the plate attached, you might get it returned?

If the bike community really wants respect that they pay their way?--license for the same fees a cars or something special since I would expect it would only be for the Madison vicinity where there is exclusive bike infrastructure.  There is no need for a State-wide fee.  You are correct that "out my way" the bike wear and tear is negligible.

Eric

STRAWSER, Charles wrote:

Eric, you are so woefully misinformed about the money. Let me help paint a clearer picture:

 

1.The City of Madison bicycle registration fee costs $10/four years, or $2.50/year. My ~3000 lb car’s registration fee is $75 annually. So, since one purpose of the registration fee is to pay for building and maintaining roads, and the weight of the vehicle and the miles traveled on the road are some of the biggest determinants of the costs of maintenance, then a “comparable” bicycle license fee, based on the weight of the vehicle, would be roughly 30 lbs/3000 lbs x $75 annually, or 75 cents/year. In other words, bikes are ALREADY required to pay more than three times a proportionally “comparable” license fee.

 

2. As I have previously posted to this list, a study commissioned by WisDOT in the 1990s concluded that fuel taxes and vehicle registration fees accounted for 56% of the costs of public roads. 44% of the cost of roads is paid for with something other than fuel taxes and vehicle registration, aka user fees. In Wisconsin this means primarily property taxes, which everyone pays directly or indirectly. “Program funding” for motor vehicles is therefore NOT tied to vehicle registration fees, or even registration fees plus fuel taxes. So why should bicycles be held to a different standard?

 

Because motor vehicle user fees pay for 56% of the cost of roads, I suggest we dedicate 56% of the space on roadways to the EXCLUSIVE use of motor vehicles – no bikes or pedestrians allowed on that 56% of the space. The rest of the space, 44% of the roadway, should be divided more or less equally between all road users (yes, including motor vehicles would be fair), since everyone pays for that 44% through property taxes.

 

Until the fact that public roads have to be subsidized (at approximately the same rate as public transit), any talk about bicycles (or pedestrians) not paying their share of the roads is simply ignorance of the facts.

 

Chuck

From: Eric Westhagen [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2009 12:44 PM
To: STRAWSER, Charles ; BikiesSubmissions
Subject: Re: [Bikies] Bicycle Counts (was Question on bicycle traffic counts)

 

 Dear Group,


For the past week this debate and list of suggestions about bike counts and direction of spending for bike infrastructure avoids the real question of payments.  I have not commented before on your local  Madison  bike issues and advocacy groups have made   Madison   into one of the few "biking cities" in the country.  Yet there is a constant theme that "auto drivers" don't like bicyclists?  And why might that be?  Certainly most rode some type of bikes as children.  They are pedestrians part of their current lives--so just why?  They feel it is "us or they?"  Certainly that is the general opinion expressed in this listserv--"us or they"--"us or those big bad SUVs."



And all sorts of hockus-pokus can be put forth to show why bikes deserve all the spending they have gotten in the greater   Madison   area.  Nevertheless--the bikes are a minority--an elite, if you will.  So, why not have a real money raising license fee?  Then bikes can put their heads up high and declare to autos that they are really on equal footing in the payments department.  Why not an annual fee with fines for non compliance?  There is still no gas tax money--but a comparable annual bike license fee would go along way toward making a case for bike infrastructure.  



>From the Web at the close of '07 was this:----  "[In Wisconsin, state law prohibits officials from collecting more in bike registration fees than it costs to run the registration program, said Arthur Ross, pedestrian-bike coordinator for the city of Madison. The best-known pay-off of that city's mandatory registration is also enabling police to return stolen bikes, Ross said. 



"Certainly, I would not want to see program funding tied to bike registration," Ross added. "We need a whole lot more money than were ever going to raise through bicycle registration." 



In   Madison  , about 20,000 bikes have valid registrations, said John Rider, bicycle registration coordinator. The $10 registration lasts four years. The program helps transportation planners, "get a handle on how many bicycles we have in the city so we can have some more say in trying to have bicycle facilities," Rider said. "It gives us a voice." 



It was pressure from cycling advocates that eventually led   Minnesota   lawmakers to repeal that state's registration program several years ago, said Anderson, the bicycle and pedestrian coordinator. ]" ----------. . . .--------



Eric



   

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