I am sure that not every zoo is wonderful. But there are also zoos that work hard at breeding species that are nearly extinct. As far as small zoos go the two that I have been to, here in Des Moines and the one in Grand Rapids are run very well. My point is that I don't think the people who run these zoos are bad and in general have the animals best interests at heart.
Killings monkeys? What do you expect from a bunch of Cheeseheads. The two companies that I know off personally that do animal testing recieve the animals from breeders. It is sad that the animals at the zoo were killed and I think the people responsible should face stiff fines and penalties. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin Graeme" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2002 9:03 AM Subject: Zoos (was RE: omg, VOMIT jellybeans??) > Kevin, > > I'm glad that the zoos you've visited seem respectable. I know the Minnesota > zoo is generally excellent except for the sea mammal tank. It used to be > Beluga whales, but last I saw it was dolphins. Either way, it's unacceptable > considering the volume of water. > > I don't know the conditions at all the zoos you mention, but I can tell you > that the National zoo in D.C. and the Brooklyn zoo both have unacceptably > small concrete pens for the pachyderms. And those are fairly major zoos. > There are hundreds, if not thousands, of small zoos that have even worse > conditions. > > Keep in mind that most animals in zoos naturally have ranging habitats of > miles and miles. Any enclosure smaller than several thousand square feet is > conducive of insanity and physical decay. > > As for your skepticism regarding researchers taking animals from zoos, > here's just one example: > http://www.uwosh.edu/organizations/alag/TCT_Arc.html > > I'm no fan of PETA either, and I know most people working at zoos want to do > good. Many of them do or think they are. Unfortunately, good practices are a > moving target as we learn more about animal physiology and psychology, and > the good practices are slow to take hold among people who've "always done it > this way" and they are always expensive to fund, especially considering that > most zoos can barely afford to stay open and feed the animals. > > -Kevin Graeme > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Kevin Schmidt [mailto:schmidt@;hungrycow.com] > > Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 10:26 PM > > To: CF-Community > > Subject: Re: omg, VOMIT jellybeans?? > > > > > > I have never been to a zoo that was like this and I have been to zoos in > > Michigan, Indiana, Iowa, Omaha, Ohio, Minnesota, Tennessee, Georgia and > > Florida. Albeit that's not all zoo's but I have never heard or seen of a > > zoo treating animals this way. I highly doubt researches would > > take monkeys > > from a zoo, too many unknows, any animal research I have seen done, the > > animals have been bred specifically for that purpose. > > > > I have seen pet store that resemble what you speak off and I have > > made sure, > > as much as I don't like PETA, to alert them to these specific stores. The > > only reason I do that is because I care about the treatment of > > animals and I > > know that PETA is crazy enough to do things that I wouldn't advocate. I > > always complain to the pet store management and make sure they know my > > intentions. I have been thrown out of more than 1 pet store in my time. > > > > ...Stepping of my soap box for now. > > > > Kevin > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Kevin Graeme" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 10:21 PM > > Subject: RE: omg, VOMIT jellybeans?? > > > > > > > It really, really depends upon the zoo. Some meet all of your > > parameters. > > > Many follow this model: > > > > > > well cared for = questionable > > > fed = true > > > tiny cages = true > > > wounded for profit = questionable > > > > > > I've been to many, many zoos where the cages were so small that the > > animals > > > could barely turn around. They were licking up their own urine > > and eating > > > their own feces. I have seen elephants and rhinos shackled to the floor > > and > > > poked with goads. And then there were the monkeys that were just biding > > > their time until the local researchers needed another one for > > experiments. > > > > > > Are all zoos like this? No, but too many are. > > > > > > -Kevin Graeme > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Kevin Schmidt [mailto:schmidt@;hungrycow.com] > > > > Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 8:27 PM > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > Subject: Re: omg, VOMIT jellybeans?? > > > > > > > > > > > > I disagree, in a zoo the animals are well cared for and they are > > > > fed. They > > > > aren't put in tiny cages they can't stand up in and aren't > > intentionally > > > > wounded for profit. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Phoeun Pha" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 1:30 PM > > > > Subject: RE: omg, VOMIT jellybeans?? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yeah it's bad. And it's nothing different from a zoo either. > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Kevin Schmidt [mailto:schmidt@;hungrycow.com] > > > > > Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 1:31 PM > > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > > Subject: Re: omg, VOMIT jellybeans?? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's really sad. I am very much against animal cruelty and > > > > it makes me > > > > > sick to see animals treated that way. > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Phoeun Pha" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 1:09 PM > > > > > Subject: RE: omg, VOMIT jellybeans?? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SO that's where all the <A > > > > > > > > > > > > HREF="http://www.wspa-international.org/news/news-09.html";>BEAR BILE</a> > > > > > > goes! > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > From: Jim Davis [mailto:jim@;depressedpress.com] > > > > > > Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 9:37 AM > > > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > > > Subject: RE: omg, VOMIT jellybeans?? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I tried these. I went to the JellyBelly warehouse that is > > > > > > > near my house, > > > > > > > and they give free samples within the store. When the woman > > > > > > > handed them > > > > > > > to me, I assumed that they just had disgusting names, but > > > > would taste > > > > > > > fine. I was WRONG! I tried half a bite of the vomit one and > > > > > > > spent the > > > > > > > next 10 minutes trying to get the taste out of my mouth. > > > > > > > After that, I > > > > > > > couldn't bring myself to try the booger one, or any of the > > > > > > > other flavors. > > > > > > > =( > > > > > > > > > > > > But remember - there's some poor group deep inside the JellyBelly > > > > > > factory that usually gets assignments like "make sure > > this tastes of > > > > > > cherry". For weeks they had to write reports on how close to > > > > > > vomit-flavored test jelly beans had become... > > > > > > > > > > > > "Test Number 142, Batch number 6,405: Closest yet, although > > > > it still has > > > > > > a marked rotten apple aftertaste. Suggest more digestive > > > > acid and less > > > > > > fructose. Please kill me." > > > > > > > > > > > > I think that they earned there pensions right there. And to > > > > think, some > > > > > > of them probbly complained when "pina colada" was being tested... > > > > > > > > > > > > Jim Davis > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=5 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribe&forumid=5 Signup for the Fusion Authority news alert and keep up with the latest news in ColdFusion and related topics. http://www.fusionauthority.com/signup.cfm
