I agree that we should not list the default set of wiki pages. 2016-03-14 9:59 GMT+01:00 Vincent Massol <[email protected]>:
> > > On 09 Mar 2016, at 18:46, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > Iteration 2: > > > http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Proposal/XWikiOrgDownload2Layout#HIteration2 > > > > Changes: > > - Separated in 'Demo Installation' and 'Production Installation' > > - Listing separated 'Installation notes' and 'Download' button for each > > option > > > > Regarding 'Demo'/'Production' terms, Eduard mentioned also: > > - 'Small Installation' - 'Larger Production Installation' > > - 'Ready to use bundle' > > > > Let me know what you think. > > > Sounds good. Some comments (I already gave most of them already in the > past FTR): > > * WAR file for Container —> WAR file for Servlet Container > * A database also needs to be set up and configured -> A database and a > Servlet Container need to be set up and configured > * Graphical installer —> Graphical Installer for All Platforms > * Graphical Windows native installer —> Graphical Installer for Windows > * Standalone package -> ZIP Package (we’re now calling them Demo > packagings) > * “use the ZIP distribution” —> “use the ZIP packaging” > * “includes a Jetty container” —> “includes a Jetty Servlet Container” or > “Jetty Server” > * The 3 demo packagings ALL include a Jetty server + HSQLDB database. The > way it’s described make it sound like only the ZIP packaging does. This > needs to be fixed. > * The reason for the ZIP package is not exactly what is mentioned; it’s > for users who don’t want/need to use a Graphical Installer. > * The explanation below that starts “If you’re a first time…” is wrong. It > should just say: “These Demo packages are not supposed to be used in > production, since the embedded database does not support large wikis > efficiently and is not tuned for a production usage.” > * “Default set of wiki pages”. Should be removed since we don’t want to > encourage this now (we offer a DW). Instead we should have a link for > “other packagings” and point to the various tutorials + yaourt-, and > include the wiki pages there in case someone needs them. > * The text below Production install should also be modified to remove the > mention of wiki pages. > > Thanks > -Vincent > > > > Thanks, > > Caty > > > > > > On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 11:23 AM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > >> I prefer "Demo" > >> > >> Thanks, > >> Caty > >> > >> On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 11:22 AM, [email protected] < > [email protected]> > >> wrote: > >> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 22 Feb 2016 at 15:27:04, [email protected] ([email protected] > >>> (mailto:[email protected])) wrote: > >>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On 19 Feb 2016 at 15:20:09, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) ( > >>> [email protected](mailto:[email protected])) wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Hi Vincent, > >>>>> > >>>>> On Wed, Feb 17, 2016 at 10:19 PM, [email protected] > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> Hi Caty, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On 17 Feb 2016 at 17:44:56, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) ( > >>> [email protected] > >>>>>> (mailto:[email protected])) wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> Fixed the links > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 17, 2016 at 6:35 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) < > >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Hi, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> This proposal wants to improve the current download page layout > >>> found > >>>>>> at > >>>>>>>> http://enterprise.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Main/Download > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> The proposal is here: > >>>>>>>> http://design.xwiki.org/xwiki/ > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> bin/view/Proposal/ > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> XWikiOrgDownload2Layout > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> The proposal splits the current information into multiple pages > >>>>>> (version, > >>>>>>>> type). Make sure you read the "Changes" section from the > >>> proposal. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Let me know what you think. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> I really like the new Download page (LTS, Stable, Dev). Much nicer > >>> and > >>>>>> cleaner than the current version! :) > >>>>>> > >>>>>> However I’m not sure about the second download page with the Local, > >>>>>> Server, Debian boxes. There are several issues for me: > >>>>>> * The Local packagings can be used on a server > >>>>>> * The server packagings can be used locally > >>>>>> * The Debian packaging can be used both locally and on a server > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> So currently the documentation pages use terms like "Standalone > >>>>> distribution" and "WAR package". For me these naming are not > >>> user-friendly > >>>>> and I might not know what the acronym stands for or what standalone > >>> means. > >>>>> That's why I suggested Local and Server, since they are more > >>> simplistic but > >>>>> yes maybe they are not truly correct. Maybe we can iterate more on > the > >>>>> naming but we need an improvement here since we want to encourage > >>> "local" > >>>>> testing even for not so technical users/administrators. > >>>> > >>>> I understand what you wanted but indeed I find the new terms even more > >>> confusing :) > >>>> > >>>> For me we should think in term of “Using XWiki”. To use XWiki the user > >>> has 2 choices: > >>>> > >>>> A) Download and install it locally (wherever he’s installing the > >>> download from, could be a laptop, could be a server machine, etc). > This is > >>> usually referred as “on premises” by comparison to using it as a > service > >>> (cloud, saas, etc). > >>>> > >>>> B) Use it as a service. > >>>> > >>>> For A) the options we have are: > >>>> * Demo packagings: those are the options from > >>> > http://platform.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/AdminGuide/InstallationStandalone > . > >>> They include a pre-installed HSQLDB Database and a Jetty container > >>> Specifically the following installers/packagings: > >>>> ** the EXE packaging, > >>>> ** the ZIP packaging, > >>>> ** the JAR packaging > >>> > >>> FWIW Denis suggested the name “Personal packagings”. So we have 2 > options > >>> so far: > >>> - Demo packagings (clearly shows they not for production) > >>> - Personal packagings (hints that they are for personal use only, ie > >>> single user wiki) > >>> > >>> I think I prefer Demo. WDYT? > >>> > >>> Thanks > >>> -Vincent > >>> > >>>> * Production-level packagings: > >>>> ** Debian packaging (all in one installation that includes MySQL and > >>> Tomcat) > >>>> ** The WAR (the user needs to install both a Servlet Container and a > >>> Database and deploy the WAR in the Servlet Container) > >>>> * Other packagings/setup that are not supported by the XWiki Core Dev > >>> Team: > >>>> ** tutorials > >>>> ** yaourt packaging > >>>> > >>>> For B) the options we have are: > >>>> * Demo on playground.xwiki.org(http://playground.xwiki.org) > >>>> * myxwiki.org(http://myxwiki.org) for non-profit organizations and > >>> individuals. Free but no warranties in term of uptime or support. Used > as a > >>> real-world test platform by the XWiki Core Dev Team to test the latest > >>> versions of XWiki. > >>>> * Cloud and Hosting offers from companies helping develop the XWiki > >>> open source project (the companies listed at > >>> http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Main/Support#HProfessionalSupport > >>> and defined by the xwiki.org(http://xwiki.org) governance at > >>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Community/Governance): > >>>> ** From XWiki SAS: XCS (http://info.xwiki.com/xcs-demo-request.html) > >>> or dedicated hosting (http://www.xwiki.com/en/services/hosting) > >>>> ** From Softec or EsPresto AG: link to their web sites > >>>> > >>>> It would be nice that a user wants to use XWiki he lands on a page > >>> showing the 2 options: install on premises and hosting/cloud solutions. > >>> Then he can drill down and if he wants to install on premises, be able > to > >>> select from the various download options. > >>>> > >>>> WDYT? > >>>> > >>>> Thanks > >>>> -Vincent > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>> * Server is not a good differentiator since XWiki is a Server app > >>> even if > >>>>>> you install it locally ;) > >>>>>> * BTW it’s misising the other tutorials and other packagings (the > >>> yaourt > >>>>>> one for example) > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> To be honest I didn't know what you were referring to until I found > >>>>> > >>> > http://platform.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/AdminGuide/Installation#HUsingyaourtonArchLinux > >>>>> When I did the re-design I took the information from the Download > >>> page and > >>>>> the "yaourt" one is missing. > >>>>> In order to fix this we could modify the third column called now > >>> "Debian > >>>>> Installation" into a other operating systems ways of installing ( or > >>>>> another name ) and list there links towards the Debian and Arch Linux > >>>>> install documentation. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> * And even more important it’s also missing Cloud solutions. I’d > >>> really > >>>>>> like if we could list the various cloud solutions offered by > >>> companies > >>>>>> participating to the xwiki development (and possibly list > >>> myxwiki.org too > >>>>>> but if we list it, we need to put visible disclaimer since it’s a > >>> test farm > >>>>>> with no warranties and for non-business/personal projects only). > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> IMO this should be a total different page, let's call it "Test Drive > >>> XWiki" > >>>>> or "Try XWiki" or "Evaluate XWiki" that could showcase Playground, > >>> MyXWiki > >>>>> and other Cloud solutions, but this should be part of a different > >>> proposal > >>>>> than the Download page (which lists versions and install methods). > >>>>> Currently I didn't tackled this proposal yet. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> So maybe we shouldn’t discriminate between Local, Server, Debian > >>> but maybe > >>>>>> instead between “On-Premises” and “Cloud”, WDYT? > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> I'm not sure what "On Premises" means although I know it's an used > >>> term, > >>>>> but I don't find it very clear and not sure if it describes well the > >>> zip, > >>>>> war, etc. options. > >>>>> > >>>>> The problem is that we list the "Local, Server, Debian" install > >>> options > >>>>> after you selected the version you want to download. So I find it a > >>> bit odd > >>>>> for an user to be convinced that he wants to download XWiki, select > >>> his > >>>>> version and then be presented with the Cloud Solutions. Cloud > >>> solutions > >>>>> should be part of an evaluation step, before and independent of the > >>>>> download step. > >>>>> > >>>>> Thanks, > >>>>> Caty > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> Thanks > >>>>>> -Vincent > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Thanks, > >>>>>>>> Caty > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> devs mailing list > >>> [email protected] > >>> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > >>> > >> > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > devs mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > _______________________________________________ > devs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > -- Guillaume Delhumeau ([email protected]) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
