24/7 access is probably our biggest thing, and is the main reason people would
become members. What else do members get that non-members don’t?
Imma just brainstorm a list of things members get:
-24/7 access (unsupervised)
-The vote
-Small amount of storage
-Bragging rights?
-Member-only events, explicitly. (I don’t think we’ve had any?)
-Generally speaking, the food ingredients on the kitchen shelves
I can’t really think about anything else.
The following are available to anyone who shows at up at the space when it’s
open, or with another member:
-Conditional access to the space
-The community
-The usual talks or events, hackathons
-Food, sometimes.
If we disallowed free food, and charged non-members enough to break even, that
would be a great way to A) save money on those events, and B) give value to an
extremely-cheap kind of membership, so I agree with it. There’s really no other
way a half-membership would be better than the regular public.
We wouldn’t want to make events, access to the space, the talks, or the
community itself (the mailing list or wiki or IRC) members-only.
Meanwhile, getting a sort of half-membership to save a couple dollars a month
on food and to feel like more of a part of SkullSpace would encourage people to
eventually move to a full membership.
From: chris kluka
Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 6:37 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [SkullSpace-Discuss] Fwd: Skullspace student/casual memberships
I think that a $40+(optional pledge) or $10 for students option would be good.
$10 gets you in the door, gets you a vote; but does not get you keys and you
need to be a student (by claim only, not by documentation). Students would need
to throw in like $5 in the drink machine to show up for any particular event
outside the regular meetings.
If a student needs a key (fob), they could buy one for a one-time $20 payment
to cover the administrative work of setting up a key fob / paying for the FOB
itself.
$40 (or more if you want to) gets you current membership privileges.
Just a thought.
On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 4:58 PM, Ron <[email protected]> wrote:
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Hash: SHA1
More numbers:
"Freeside is $80/month for regulars, and $40 for "starving hackers"/students."
"Makers Local 256 has a "pledge" model. You pledge whatever you want
your monthly amount to be. I love this model but it's difficult to
convince others to try it."
"we are working on amending/changing Quelab's but for the last 2 years
we have been pretty much one main level, ($35 a month), and visitors, $5
per visit. we are working at having some prepaid visit "punch cards",
and some family membership pricing, and also probably upping our pricing
just a bit, to offset paypal and banking/insurance fees."
I'll post more as they come. If anybody wants to make a summary on the
wiki or something, that'd be greatly appreciated!
Ron
On 2012-10-15 15:26, Jay Smith wrote:
> Totalitarian Treasurer checking in.
>
> Reduction for non-student/cash-strapped members:
> I will not support a membership fee reduction for non-students. We are
> already strapped for cash and we are not in the business of becoming a
> hostel. Non-student members who can not pay $40.00/month will be given two
> weeks warning to pay their dues or have their memberships and access
> revoked. I do follow the hackerspace patterns as close as possible and the
> line about being a "Totalitarian Treasurer" is near and dear to what was
> once my heart :-)
>
> If you are unable to pay fees, your best bet is to cancel your membership
> until such a time that you can pay. You're always welcome to reapply when
> you are able.
>
> Student Memberships:
> I have no strong opinion on the idea of student memberships. It's not much
> extra work and it does seem to be an accepted practice for most
> hacker-spaces I've looked into. If anybody can compile a current collection
> of fee structures from across Canada and the US for tomorrow's meeting, it
> would make for great research. I'm particularly interested in seeing:
>
> - % of hackerspaces with student membership options
> - Average student membership cost
> - Average full membership cost for all hackerspaces
> - Average full membership cost for hackerspaces that offer student discounts
> - Average full membership cost for hackerspaces that do no offer student
> discounts
>
> I'd do it myself, but I have to admit that I simply don't have time to
> compile even more data tonight.
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 2:47 PM, Ron <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > I think that's great advice.
> >
> > I've tried to follow the design patterns from hackerspaces.org as often
> > as it's possible and as often as it makes sense for us. It doesn't
> > always make sense, of course, but more often than not they're pretty
> > good.
> >
> > I'm not saying we should make policy decisions based entirely on the
> > pattern, just that if the patterns say it's a good idea, it might
> > actually be a good idea.
> >
> > Ron
> >
> > On 2012-10-15 14:38, Justin Lacko wrote:
> > > And FWIW the hackerspaces.org model has a few things that operate on
> > > the "paranoia" such as this one:
> > > http://hackerspaces.org/wiki/The_Sponsoring_Anti-Pattern so I wouldn't
> > > take that site as gospel. But what do I know?
> > >
> > > On 15 October 2012 14:35, Justin Lacko <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > > What kind of reduction are we looking at here? Is, say $10 a month
> > > > really the deciding factor for anybody for not becoming a member?
> > > >
> > > > I think $40 is already as cheap as we can go. If anything I'd say make
> > > > $40 the student rate and re-jigger (Mak's word) the regular member
> > > > rate. $40 is incredibly cheap for ~4200 sq. ft. of 24/7 access to a
> > > > space with tools, computers, a lounge, a budding arcade, and
> > > > developing electrical.
> > > >
> > > > On 15 October 2012 14:28, Ron <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > > >> Hash: SHA1
> > > >>
> > > >> Hey guys,
> > > >>
> > > >> I'm forwarding along a suggestion from David Stewart, who's not
> > > >> currently a member but is interested in SkullSpace. Based on what he
> > > >> says, and some reading I've done, I think we should re-visit the idea
> > of
> > > >> student memberships.
> > > >>
> > > >> I was traditionally against it, but I'm starting to come around. It
> > > >> helps that I re-read the hackerspace design patterns and it includes
> > > >> this one: http://hackerspaces.org/wiki/The_Membership_Fees_Pattern
> > > >>
> > > >> Which includes the text, "Collect fees regularly. Make no exceptions,
> > > >> ever. Choose an appropriate amount. Have discounts for students. Have
> > at
> > > >> least three months of rent on your account, all the time, no
> > exceptions.
> > > >> Elect a totalitarian treasurer."
> > > >>
> > > >> The issues I've had in the past with it - keeping everybody equal,
> > etc -
> > > >> I think we can set aside for the purposes of getting more members /
> > more
> > > >> interest / more events / etc. Another issue was how we manage it -
> > and I
> > > >> think honour system is fine. If you're going to school full-time, and
> > > >> you tell us you are, that's good enough. If we don't believe you,
then
> > > >> you probably shouldn't be a member anwyays.
> > > >>
> > > >> It would create extra work for Jay - to switch members from student
to
> > > >> regular when necessary - so he definitely has a say in this.
> > > >>
> > > >> Students could, of course, choose to pay the full amount, if they'd
> > > >> like. :)
> > > >>
> > > >> Thoughts?
> > > >>
> > > >> Ron
> > > >>
> > > >> - ----- Forwarded message from David Stewart <
> > [email protected]> -----
> > > >>
> > > >> Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 14:15:37 -0500
> > > >> From: David Stewart <[email protected]>
> > > >> To: [email protected]
> > > >> Subject: Skullspace student/casual memberships
> > > >>
> > > >> Hello Ron,
> > > >>
> > > >> Over the past year I have sporadically attended various events at
> > > >> Skullspace (Most notably Mak's C course) and while I would like to
> > become a
> > > >> full member, there has always been a few things that have held me
back
> > > >> (mostly due to lack of time). Compounding my existing lack of time
> > problem
> > > >> is that since have I started school full time at the U of M, the
> > amount of
> > > >> free time I have has taken a dive off a cliff. Furthermore, being a
> > full
> > > >> time student, has rendered me more or less broke.
> > > >>
> > > >> I would like to contribute to the success of Skullspace, but $40
a
> > > >> month is beyond my reach financially for now, and quite frankly with
> > my
> > > >> dwindling free time I could hardly spend any time at all at the space
> > > >> anyways.
> > > >>
> > > >> I'm sure you see where I am going with this, but I will ask the
> > > >> question directly.... Has there ever been discussion about
> > memberships for
> > > >> student/casual members? - Perhaps key less if need be, and/or based
on
> > > >> hours at the space per month, non-voting (or 1/2 of a vote), without
a
> > > >> dedicated storage spot etc. ? I realize that this has the potential
> > to be
> > > >> a slippery slope of "special treatment", but could a fair system be
> > hashed
> > > >> out? To me it seems that this could help to open up membership to a
> > wider
> > > >> audience and increase the amount of membership dues collected each
> > month
> > > >> without causing a significant increase in operating
> > > >> costs.......Additionally, this could help to make Skullspace a more
> > > >> inclusive community. (Not that it is particularly exclusionary at
the
> > > >> moment!)
> > > >>
> > > >> Anyways it's just a thought, I'll leave it to you and the Skullspace
> > group
> > > >> to make the decisions on this, but feel free to ask me questions and
> > I'll
> > > >> do my best to get back to you asap.
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards,
> > > >>
> > > >> David Stewart
> > > >>
> > > >> - ----- End forwarded message -----
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> > > >> P+oAn0uoAcEd3CF8plbHAAwB5h0jbcPe
> > > >> =ju56
> > > >> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
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