Rose raises some good points. When I teach git to students who have no exposure to version control, I find that students are more successful if they understand: git is a tool (or software application) GitHub is a service (similar to Google Docs or Dropbox) a concrete understanding of remotes: local (their laptop or system), origin (their account at GitHub or another service), upstream (another project's account on GitHub) See this talk as an example: https://www.slideshare.net/willingc/yes-you-can-git <https://www.slideshare.net/willingc/yes-you-can-git>
Elizabeth Wickes (UIUC) has used the GitHub GUI with online students in the past with great success. She may be a good resource for incorporating into teaching and why). I was pair programming with someone who uses Microsoft Visual Studio Code (which has git/GitHub integration), and I found the interface well done and fairly intuitive. > On Jul 8, 2017, at 6:45 PM, Rosario Robinson <[email protected]> > wrote: > > Here’s another perspective I want to add to the conversation… > > > > I’m mentoring a young woman who will be entering her second year in August at > a top tier university majoring in Computer Science. Her church pitched in to > buy her a laptop for school before she left. Before then, she never used > Google docs or dropbox. But she picked it up very quickly at school. > > > > I helped out last year at Spelman college training and the students were > phenomenal and went pretty fast on their assignments. However, there were > other biologists from other labs in the city that were in attendance. One of > the men I helped, his response was, “I’m just trying to do every step they > say to keep up.” At this point, we've already lost this student. > > > > I’ve been afforded great opportunities in tech industry as we all are. We > have access to hardware, software, communities that will help us through > anything. I work with a lot of SW students who are incredibly capable, but > the challenge is that they don’t have access to many of the current > technologies so they are behind right off the bat. > > > > I understand Andela’s point that maybe starting from a GUI where some are > used to being then creating/teaching the concept from there, will help them > through some of the Git lessons. It’s second nature for many of us who are > used to version control and those who have used other software like Google > docs or Dropbox. > > > > If we really want to provide learning opportunities to all levels, it > wouldn’t hurt to explore this alternative. Maybe it will provide a greater > understanding of how lessons are interpreted from many levels so there can be > continuous improvement on lessons that have a better long term impact. > > > > Great thread and thanks for engaging in this discussion. > > > > > Sincerely, > Rose > > > > > On Sat, Jul 8, 2017 at 6:13 PM, Azalee Bostroem <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > Hi Anelda, > > I find almost all learners are familiar with the idea of version control > because of the “track changes” option in word, the history option in google > docs, and something similar in dropbox. The idea of wanting to record what > you did and possibly go back to a previous version can be applied to a > variety of tasks that are often part of the scientific process e.g. paper > writing, coding, exploring data. > > I like to teach both git and github because I see them as a progression. Git > is the basic barebones minimum: track changes on your computer. Setting it up > takes very little time and you’re ready to go. I do find that the add+commit > process can be scary for learners - I was personally afraid I would mess > something up that I couldn’t undo - so my teaching philosophy is add and > commit as many times as possible, together and on their own so that that > process is not scary. I haven’t used any desktop clients, which may bias my > experience of them. When my collaborators have I’ve found that they are fine > until something breaks, and then don’t have a great mental model of what is > happening when they push the buttons. My preference is to teach with the > command line which I think allows users to switch to a desktop client fairly > easily. However, I can imagine cases where the mental load of command lint + > git is too much and you may want to use some kind of GUI interface. I then > teach GitHub as a way to collaborate either with yourself across computers or > with others and as a way to back up your work at a source outside your > workstation. > > I use slides throughout the lesson, alternating between telling them what > we’re going to do and doing it. I also believe in very frequent exercises, > which we go over after they’ve attempted them. The GitHub lesson is almost > entirely them working with a partner. Here are my slides if you’re > interested: http://slides.com/abostroem/local_version_control > <http://slides.com/abostroem/local_version_control> and > http://slides.com/abostroem/deck-5 <http://slides.com/abostroem/deck-5>. I > like the Dracula/Wolfman story line because its easy for students to make up > facts and play along with the story without having to think too hard about > what they should write in the code or the commit message. I think this allows > them to focus on understanding Git/GitHub. I can see teaching git followed by > Python and using git throughout the Python to track the files you’re > creating. > > All of that being said - its possible that what we’re primarily doing with > git/GitHub are different. I don’t teach forking and pull requests although if > you were more focused on collaboration via GitHub, you might want to. > > Azalee > > > > >> On Jul 8, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Inigo Aldazabal Mensa <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >> >> On Sat, 8 Jul 2017 09:43:58 +0200 >> Anelda van der Walt <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >> >>> Hi Simon, all, >>> >>> Apologies if I've created confusion by making it sound as if git and >>> GitHub is interchangeable. I realise they are different, but I >>> generally don't see that we get adoption of git or even a twinkle in >>> people's eye after the git lesson when they have no prior exposure to >>> version control and associated concepts. >> >> ? By what I see, and the feedback learners provide, I usually get people >> really excited about version control / git, even though they don't have >> any previous experience, i.e. they just know that "it exists". May it >> depend a lot on the community? Mainly physicists and biologists here. >> >>> I've been wondering if there is something that can come before the >>> git-novice lesson to help the target audience of our workshops >>> understand the value of version control and tools like GitHub. Any >>> pointers to something that is even more foundational to help build >>> mental models and create a interest to learn version control would be >>> very welcome. >> >> I use some motivational slides (~8 slides, 15 min.) prior to starting >> typing. But I usually do this for all the lessons I instruct. I don't >> have them online, but I wouldn't have any problem putting them up if >> you're interested. They won't blow up your mind with git light beams, >> but they work for me :-) >> >> Inigo >> >> >>> >>> Kind regards, >>> >>> Anelda >>> >>> On Sat, Jul 8, 2017 at 8:41 AM, Waldman, Simon <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >>>> Surely these are two different things, doing two different jobs? Git >>>> (either command line or through a GUI) on the local machine, and >>>> Github for the remote repo? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Or is there a local GUI that also goes by the name of Github? If >>>> so, I recommend **great** care in describing this; if I’m confused >>>> by reading it on the discuss list, I can only imagine that learners >>>> will be too! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *From:* Discuss >>>> [mailto:[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>] *On Behalf Of >>>> *Anelda van der Walt *Sent:* 08 July 2017 06:33 >>>> *To:* Bond, Steve (NIH/NHGRI) [F] >>>> *Cc:* Software Carpentry Discussion; John Poole; Bryan Johnston >>>> *Subject:* Re: [Discuss] Git lesson alternative >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi Steve, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Thanks very much for sharing! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I've been wondering how we can simultaneously give a broader >>>> exposure to GitHub GUI as I (since I'm not a software developer but >>>> often collaborate with others on GitHub) mostly use GitHub and >>>> haven't had to use git command line probably for a year now because >>>> I could do everything I needed in the GUI. Not that I am promoting >>>> not teaching the command line way of using git, but for people >>>> who've never ever encountered version control it might be more >>>> accessible to first build a mental model by learning GitHub and >>>> then going to the next step of learning the command line tool. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Kind regards, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Anelda >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 7, 2017 at 6:49 PM, Bond, Steve (NIH/NHGRI) [F] < >>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi Anelda, >>>> >>>> We have stripped out the entire Dracula example from our workshop >>>> at the NIH, switching to a conversions script example (dollars to >>>> cents, feet to meters, etc). We have also chosen to focus heavily >>>> on the GitHub UI, instead of some of the terminal commands that >>>> GitHub otherwise hides. >>>> >>>> https://github.com/biologyguy/git-novice >>>> <https://github.com/biologyguy/git-novice> >>>> >>>> So it doesn’t tie in with gap minder, but we do have our attendees >>>> writing little programs. >>>> >>>> There are still some significant kinks though, particularly when we >>>> get to the collaboration and conflict resolution sections. The last >>>> time we ran the workshop a significant gap developed between the >>>> faster and slower paced learners that was difficult to accommodate >>>> as instructors. >>>> >>>> -Steve >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *From: *Anelda van der Walt <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>>> *Date: *Friday, July 7, 2017 at 12:07 PM >>>> *To: *Software Carpentry Discussion >>>> <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> *Cc: *John Poole >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>, Bryan Johnston >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>>>> >>>> *Subject: *[Discuss] Git lesson alternative >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> We'll be running a Software Carpentry workshop later this month and >>>> was discussing the git-novice lesson again today... We would really >>>> like to show people how real code can be put under version control >>>> in git/GitHub as opposed to showing the Dracula story. I know this >>>> conversation has come up several times, and some instructors have >>>> started to teach git on the morning of day 2 so that in the >>>> afternoon, when they continue with the Python lesson, they can show >>>> how it can be used with git. Does anyone have an edited version of >>>> the git lesson that allows for integration with the Python >>>> gapminder lesson perhaps? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Thanks! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Anelda >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------ >>>> >>>> Founded in 1821, Heriot-Watt is a leader in ideas and solutions. >>>> With campuses and students across the entire globe we span the >>>> world, delivering innovation and educational excellence in >>>> business, engineering, design and the physical, social and life >>>> sciences. >>>> >>>> This email is generated from the Heriot-Watt University Group, which >>>> includes: >>>> >>>> 1. Heriot-Watt University, a Scottish charity registered under >>>> number SC000278 >>>> 2. 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