Everyone must do it their own way. I just thought it might be useful to share the way I do it. I know that I can cut a berak up like I describe in soundforge quicker than most people can do the same and check all the looppoints in re-cycle so the time issue becomes null and void for me.
Whatever works, do it..... ************************************** Get your FREE Web based email at http://www.m4jungle.com ************************************** Streetbeats, Noir, Pi, Z-no http://www.streetbeats.co.uk http://www.m4jungle.com http://www.noir-recordings.com http://www.pi-recordings.com http://www.z-no.co.uk ************************************** -----Original Message----- From: Jurgen Baute [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 18 December 2001 23:31 To: Drum & Bass Arena Discussion List Subject: [dnb-prod] RE: Breaks Programming -How? Hidden Secret..... Don't want to start an argument here, but I see Recycle as a tool to skip all the tedious manual cutting you do in SoundForge. In 99% of the cases Recycle gets it right, and if it doesn't it's just a matter of adjusting the "looppoint", and of course, as you stated, it's a good idea to use hits that are in the same "loop", or closer together, to keep that magical flow in there. I'm glad a tool like Recycle exists, so I can spend more time with the more fun bits of programming a tune. Oh and btw, good post!! :) ------------------------ On 18 Dec 2001, at 17:51, Scope - Streetbeats wrote: > It's the same way most (breaks oriented) producers do it now. I always > cut up breaks in soundforge myself. > 1) its more accurate and MOST importantly > 2) I don't just take the hits. > > An explanation > > I'll take a drum loop, say two bars in length, and once I've done all > the Direct X/VST plugin magic in soundforge and wavelab......and once > ive got it at the right temp.......then in soundforge I'll send the > whole loop to sample number 1 say. Then I'll cut that first beat off, > and so the loop is now shorter than the full two bars, and will now > begin from say a hat inbetween the first kick and snare. I'll send > that to sample number 2. Then I'll cut it from the snare onwards, and > send this section to sample 3. > Until I get to the end of the loop, the last sample I send over should > just be an individual hit, the last one in the loop. > > Why do this you ask? Well sure it takes more memory in my sampler, but > memory is cheap, and if you know how to use a sampler well then you > make efficient use of that memory. > > The main reason for doing this, is that all of the feeling in a break > and the movement in it, the groove if you like is held in the bits > inbetween the main hits. Sometimes people refer to these as ghost > hits, and if its not ghost hits then the feeling often just comes from > things like the decay characteristic of the hits. > So the way I use breaks, I have any individual hit I want to hand, > keymapped. The difference being, if I hold the key down, I get more than > just that hit, but a part of the loop too..... > > Now back in the very first instance, at or before the conception of > hardcore and d&b, drum loops would be taken in there entireity, time > stretched and laid down straight. Then as time progressed you could > see these loops maybe being split into a couple of sections etc, and > slightly rearranged. And b4 you know it you have producers like source > direct and photek cutting these breaks up as I described above to give > you ultimate flexibility and re-arranging power. > > So by laying down these various sections of breaks, in different > length segments or whatever - there are no rules - you can very > quickly build up different grooves. > > Once you have that groove, you may want to clean it up a little by > deconstructing any longer sections of loop you are playing on a single > note into smaller sections, or even individual hits. When doing this, > the envelope and filter settings in your sampler become crucial in > obtaining the same feel as you had whilst just playing a section of > the loop on that one key. > > This step is also very important for achieving a fat sound, because > you should have kicks, snares and hats on different channels on the > desk, so you want the hist to be as granular as possible whilst > retaing a real groove. > > Its hard to describe, but quite a simple concept. > A lot of producers I run into who are just getting going will be using > recycle or whatever and programming these individual hits, and the > result often sounds staccato and interupted. That's what you've got to > avoid. > > Note that the whole above ranting, is only one part of it, having the > right sound on your breaks is awhole other consideration. > > Hope this helps someone. > > > ************************************** > Get your FREE Web based email at > http://www.m4jungle.com > ************************************** > Streetbeats, Noir, Pi, Z-no > http://www.streetbeats.co.uk > http://www.m4jungle.com > http://www.noir-recordings.com > http://www.pi-recordings.com > http://www.z-no.co.uk > ************************************** > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Carr, Timm [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: 18 December 2001 17:26 > To: Drum & Bass Arena Discussion List > Subject: [dnb-prod] RE: Breaks Programming -How? Hidden Secret..... > > > recycle really does help with the cutting up of sampled breaks. > > > ---------- > > From: Daniel Norman > > Reply To: Drum & Bass Arena Discussion List > > Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2001 11:34 AM > > To: Drum & Bass Arena Discussion List > > Subject: [dnb-prod] Breaks Programming -How? Hidden Secret..... > > > > Hi, > > > > After all the stuff about PC conflicts and nastiness, I've got a > > question on good old beats production. > > > > Since peeps here can cast their minds back to stunning tunes like > > Source Direct / Oblivion on Streetbeats and basically all the Photek > > Productions, DeeJay Recordings (Pete Parsons - genius), deep stuff > > etc, etc - i was just wondering if anyone here had ever managed to > > approach their kind of breaks programming. How the f*ck do they do it? > > > > I only really bought my studio kit to try to make intricate breaks > > for > > > myself like i had always heard from those guys and after 2 yrs i > > know > > what i'm doing, but i can't get my breaks to sound like they used to > > in 95.... > > > > Basically, I haven't got Recycle for the A3000v2 sampler yet and i'm > > thinking this is where i'm missing out. Can you generally use Recycle > > to make to beats like on the tunes above. I have processed a ton of > > breaks in Cool Edit Pro, but its during the tune that i can't quite > > get them to cut up properly and still sound runnin' > > > > I'm using a PII 450, Logic Silver and the Yamaha A3000, whereas I'm > > guessing peeps used to use Ataris and early Macs with Akai S3000 > > samplers - i know the timing of PCs, Logic and the Yam sampler might > > not be so good as the Atari and Akai, but surely thats not the whole > > story? > > > > I'm thinking that Recycle/SCSI card might be the ultimate > > solution..... > > > > Any help would be cool, > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > Dan > > > > > > > > DISCLAIMER: The Information in this message is confidential and may > > be > > > legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access > > to > > > this message by anyone else is unauthorised. 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