|
Tony.
Who says that you must get the oil temperature to 180
degrees???
Green arc is from 70 to 225 (I guess) . 165 degrees is just
fine.
The reason the number 180 came into play is that at that
temperature the water in the oil boils off.
Water is a by-product of the combustion process and gets mixed
into the oil.
However, have in mind that the oil temp probe sits in a cold
spot, right after the oil is pumped out of the tank - that is
before it did any work. When the oil is being distributed to
the crank and cylinders, it will be significantly warmer , since
part of the duty of engine oil is cooling.
So at any chance your oil might pass above 180 degrees then ,
if you insist.
But changing oil in a shorter interval is the best solution
for this "problem". Some people cover the hole under the prop in winter. That
also will bring the temps up.
Hartmut N3330H
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 11:10
AM
Subject: [COUPERS-TECH] Re: Digest list:
Ercoupe Technical Discussion (moderated)
|
Can anyone help me. I have a 1947-CD with a C-85. This
is my first winter with my Ercoupe and I am having problems getting the
oil temp to 180 degrees. I have tried to cover the oil tank and can get
it to 165 degrees. What else can I do? Wisconsin stays cold for a few
months and I do want to fly every chance I can.
Tony
N94670
-------Original
Message-------
Date: Sunday,
December 21, 2003 2:03:14 AM
Subject: Digest list:
Ercoupe Technical Discussion (moderated)
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm
before following any advice in this forum.]----
Message list:
1. Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect
Installation of Wing Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810 2. [COUPERS-TECH] RE:
Digest list: Ercoupe Technical Discussion (moderated) 3.
[COUPERS-TECH] Voltage regulators 4. [COUPERS-TECH] Lean Idle
Mixture 5. Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Voltage regulators 6. Re:
[COUPERS-TECH] Lean Idle Mixture
Messages:
From: "Wayne"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
"Percy Wood" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "COUPERS -
TECH" <[email protected]> Reply-To:
"Wayne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation of Wing
Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810
God Morning Everyone::
If there is
anything we do with Ercoupes on a more continual basis than have them
fueled by ridiculously stupid line "Jocks," I don't know what it
is!
I recall once flying into Childress Texas in August. Hotter
than a country boy's cap pistol, and the fuel Guy comes popping out
of the Office, ready to "assist." I walk over to the Office to get
some heat relief, and I spotted the business card of an old
acquaintance on the wall, which I began to take the phone data from.
In comes the fuel guy, ringing wet with sweat and says, "5 gallons at
a dollar thirty one, is six fifty five!" "Hey wait a minute!" says I,
"It will take a lot more than that. Did you fuel both
tanks?" "Mister. I filled er' right to the top, dammit! come on I'll
show you!" says he, bounding out the door into the intense heat, all
pissed off at me about questioning his fueling abilities. He's taking
strides about 10 feet apart, and leaning forward to increase his over
the ground speed, all the while mumbling about them "Dumb assed
Californians, why do they come down here anyways!!" We get to the
plane and he unscrews a wing cap and without looking he say's " I
filled this here one right to the top!" Well, the fuel had equalized
by then, and he turned and looked into the tank, and there was little
fuel to be seen. "What did you do with it!" says he, with smoke
coming out of both ears! I'm trying, without much success, to explain
to him that he had only filled one of two tanks, and that the fuel
had equalized between the tanks, and that now he would have to fill
both wing tanks to the top to make sure I had enough fuel to get to
Plainview, with a stop at Quiteque International. I met with utter
furor! There was no way this guy was going to believe that I had not
stolen 5 gallons of gas from the City of Childress, Texas! He
was looking inside the cockpit for a hidden tank, or something to
satisfy his mind that I truly was a slippery character, came out here
with the express purpose of relieving the taxpayers of Childress,
Texas, of some of their hard earned tax money! After great
deliberation, I finally got him to fill the remaining tanks to the
top and I paid him for the total amount of fuel he put into the
airplane, but this mathematical genius was convinced, some how, I had
gotten away with some of his fuel! He finally let me taxi out
of there and I left Childress behind me, with a resolution that I
would stick around, regardless of the discomfort, any time the
airplane was fueled.
Wayne Woollard ----- Original Message
----- From: "Percy Wood" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
"COUPERS - TECH" <[email protected]> Sent:
Friday, December 19, 2003 9:20 PM Subject: Re: [COUPERS-TECH]
Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation of Wing Tank Fuel Cap;
ATA 2810
> ----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm
before following any advice in this
forum.]---- > > > At 08:51 PM 12/19/03 -0800, William
R. Bayne wrote: > > >Thanks for passing this on,
Bob! > > Agreed. We all need to be reminded from time to
time. > <<Much good verbiage deleted for
brevity>> > > > >An Ercoupe pilot should
remove and verify fuel and caps personally in each > >tank
before a cross country departure or other such extended
flight. > > More Correct = All Ercoupe Pilots should
personally remove both wind tank > capss and verify fuel for All
Flights. The header "gage" > should be activated to see that it
goes up and down, and "floats" as though > something is there.
Said gage should be marked > and scrutinized often in
flight. > > > Marking cap fronts with paint allows
in-flight verification of proper > >
orientation, > > Not a bad idea, but much better to check
before departure - see above. > > > >I believe the
computer term "GIGO" is applicable...garbage in,
garbage out. > > Like all accident reports, a grain of
salt is needed. Thinking about what > happend (Thank You, Bill and
Bob) does us all good. > > "Been there, done that, got the
t-shirt." I flew with Opal Walker to the > 2001 Ercoupe Owners
Club annual meeting in Terrell, > Texas. Our last fuel stop was
Grandbury. When we were well on our way to > Terrell, I asked Opal
"Does your fuel usually > ride that low?" "Nope..." Oooopies.
Spent a good fifteen munutes looking > desperatly for Terrell
and watching the gage descend. > On the ground, we found the fuel
cap had been put half back on! Them's > expensive varments to
loose. No other problems > identified. > > We went
back to Roswell, New Mexico, the same way. This time, the guy at >
Grandbury got that cap on completely backwards! > This time,
Once-burned-twice-shy Wood here, spotted it. Opal took the >
opportunity to "educate" the attendent, and we made it > back
without incident. > > Moral: A safe flight is More Than no
accident. Learn from each one. > > Percy in
Portland > > > ============================================================================ == >
To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm >
Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers-tech/ > > >
---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----
> >
--- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by
AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >
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---------------------------- From: Pete
Thomson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
'Ercoupe Technical Discussion ' <[email protected]> Reply-To:
Pete Thomson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
[COUPERS-TECH] RE: Digest list: Ercoupe Technical Discussion
(moderated)
Right on the money WRB. I keep two fuel sticks in the
plane and a fuel log. I check all tanks and write down the amount and
the hobbs reading in the log. Then I transfer the data to the
kneeboard where I write down ATIS data. I do this for every flight, I
do not trust the gauges, and it makes me drain some fuel out of the
wing tanks and gascolator, simply because I am right there anyway. I
sense another useless AD coming out in 2004, what are we averaging?
one or two AD's a year now, this is crazy and completely unecessary,
as your well written synopsis points out. Pete
-----Original
Message----- From: Ercoupe Technical Discussion To: Ercoupe
Technical Discussion Sent: 12/19/03 11:00 PM Subject: Digest list:
Ercoupe Technical Discussion (moderated)
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm
before following any advice in this forum.]----
Message
list:
1. [COUPERS-TECH] Wing spars 2. Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Wing
spars 3. [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation
of Wing Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810 4. Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe;
Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation of Wing Tank Fuel Cap; ATA
2810 5. Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect
Installation of Wing Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810
Messages:
From: "Bill Stevick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
<[email protected]> Reply-To:
"Bill Stevick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
[COUPERS-TECH] Wing spars
Does anyone know if an Alon front spar
will fit in a 1946 Ercoupe
415-C
---------------------------- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [email protected] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re:
[COUPERS-TECH] Wing spars
Bill; I would use the entire Alon
center section. Lynn
Nelsen
---------------------------- From: "Robert Q.
Steinman, PhD" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Talk"
<[email protected]> Reply-To:
"Robert Q. Steinman, PhD" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
[COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation of Wing
Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810
AMTe
Ercoupe; Model 415-C;
Incorrect Installation of Wing Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810 The
following information was supplied as a joint effort of the
Aircraft Certification Office (ACO) and Flight Standards District
Office (FSDO) of Wichita, Kansas, Paul Pendleton, Aerospace
Engineer, and Verle Engel, Aviation Safety Inspector, respectively.
(This article is published as it was received.) Recently an
Ercoupe Model 415-C airplane experienced an accident as the result of
fuel exhaustion of the main fuel tank. The pilot had
recently purchased the airplane involved in the accident and was
unfamiliar with the aircraft fuel system. Investigation of the
aircraft fuel system revealed that at least one of the fuel caps
on the wing tanks was installed backwards. On Ercoupe
aircraft the position of the cap is critical to fuel venting and
can have a negative affect on fuel distribution. The pilot owner's
manual contains a caution statement about this problem. Early serial
number aircraft fuel caps could be installed backwards very
easily. Later serial model aircraft fuel caps have a larger tab on
one side to prevent inadvertent reversal of the cap. However, it
has also come to our attention that some of the fuel cap tabs have
become worn from years of service and can also be
installed backwards. The accident aircraft still had at least five
gallons of fuel remaining in the wing tanks that did not get
transferred to the main center header tank for distribution to the
engine. Pilots flying these aircraft need to be reminded to perform a
thorough preflight inspection, to pay special attention to the
direction of fuel cap installation, and to become totally familiar
with the aircraft fuel system. Also, mechanics need to be reminded
to replace any worn fuel caps and seals while performing
inspections and
maintenance.
.......................................................................end.. ............................................................................ .........................
Robert
Q. Steinman
N3620H 1946 415 C/D
_____
<< ella for Spam Control >> has removed 3690 Spam
messages and set aside 211 Newsletters for me You can use it
too - and it's FREE! www.ellaforspam.com
---------------------------- From: "William R. Bayne"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
COUPERS - TECH <[email protected]> Reply-To:
"William R. Bayne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation of
Wing Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810
Thanks for passing this on,
Bob!
Anyone seeking useful knowledge from accident reports must
not accept them at face value. The gentlemen authoring this
"information" show little better "command" of how works the Ercoupe
fuel system than the "recent purchaser" in this "accident".
1.
The "main" fuel tanks, by virtue of overall volume and by
being plumbed so as to empty together first, are the wing tanks.
The nose tank is best described as a "reserve".
"Fuel exhaustion" of the "main tank" is not a cause of an accident.
An unexpected "Fuel exhaustion" of the engine(s) may initiate an
unexpected descent under adverse circumstances, but that's
merely an inevitable result once one or more actual causes
have occurred and been ignored.
2. How much fuel was on board
at takeoff? We don't know. Did our birdman know there was a nose
tank to fill? We don't know. Is it possible the takeoff was made
with low nose tank fuel (drained through a leaky carb, not shut
off post-flight), none indicated AND a bad fuel pump? We don't
know. The difference between genius and stupidity is that
genius has its limitations. On the other hand, when we maintain
things so they work as Fred Weick intended, with the engine
running a low nose tank will fill automatically.
3. The
engine's fuel gets there by gravity, but fuel transfer
from the wings into the nose tank requires pumping. Failures
are not rare, so the pilot must periodically verify
proper transfer. Few other airplanes give you one-half
to three-quarters of an hour endurance following fuel pump
failure and the descent of the nose tank float from "full". Did
these authors investigate fuel pump failure as the primary cause of
the accident, which provided information suggests strongly? We
don't know.
4. A pilot's apparent failure to check fuel gauges
during a flight of at least an hour (presuming a full nose
tank at takeoff) during which up to nineteen gallons of fuel
may have been burned (and/or lost) would necessarily preceed
the unexpected and sudden descent seemingly implied. How long was
the flight? We don't know.
5. If his pump failed, then, yes, a
pilot unfamiliar with the coupe might mindlessly drone on toward a
distant destination without comprehension of
events already unfolding. Was a primary cause of the accident
Pilot Error in commencing a (solo?) flight and leaving the airport
landing pattern without an instructor (?) in an unfamliar aircraft
with an unfamiliar fuel system and an unknown quantity of fuel? They
don't say so!
4. The Ercoupe fuel system design and maintenance
seem to get closer than warranted scrutiny. If the feds really
believe the accident was caused by sudden and
mysterious disappearance of known fuel, what facts led them to
this theoretical speculation? Before establishing his/her
destination heading, did the pilot visually check wing tank caps
for siphoning fuel? We don't know. Some line people are
real professionals, and others seem to evidence that somewhere a
village is without their rightful idiot.
An Ercoupe pilot
should remove and verify fuel and caps personally in each tank
before a cross country departure or other such extended
flight. Marking cap fronts with paint allows in-flight verification
of proper orientation, but only careful monitoring of fuel
consumption and transfer can suggest a cap gasket losing its seal,
or a system venting problem early on.
If someone without
thorough Ercoupe knowledge memorizes this report, I fail to see
how they are better equipped avoid the exact same result,
given how little we really know of the situation from the
information provided. Nonetheless, note how strong and credible their
opinions sound at first reading.
I believe the computer term
"GIGO" is applicable...garbage in,
garbage out.
Regards,
WRB
------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----
on
12/19/03 3:34 PM, Robert Q. Steinman, PhD at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation of Wing Tank
Fuel Cap; ATA 2810
The following information was supplied as a
joint effort of the Aircraft Certification Office (ACO) and Flight
Standards District Office (FSDO) of Wichita, Kansas, Paul
Pendleton, Aerospace Engineer, and Verle Engel, Aviation Safety
Inspector, respectively. (This article is published as it was
received.)
Recently an Ercoupe Model 415-C airplane experienced
an accident as the result of fuel exhaustion of the main fuel tank.
The pilot had recently purchased the airplane involved in the
accident and was unfamiliar with the aircraft fuel
system.
Investigation of the aircraft fuel system revealed that
at least one of the fuel caps on the wing tanks was installed
backwards. On Ercoupe aircraft the position of the cap is critical
to fuel venting and can have a negative affect on fuel distribution.
The pilot owner's manual contains a caution statement about this
problem. Early serial number aircraft fuel caps could be installed
backwards very easily. Later serial model aircraft fuel caps have
a larger tab on one side to prevent inadvertent reversal of
the cap. However, it has also come to our attention that some of
the fuel cap tabs have become worn from years of service and can
also be installed backwards. The accident aircraft still had at
least five gallons of fuel remaining in the wing tanks that did
not get transferred to the main center header tank for
distribution to the engine.
Pilots flying these aircraft need to
be reminded to perform a thorough preflight inspection, to pay
special attention to the direction of fuel cap installation, and
to become totally familiar with the aircraft fuel system. Also,
mechanics need to be reminded to replace any worn fuel caps
and seals while performing inspections and maintenance.
---------------------------- From: Percy Wood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
COUPERS - TECH <[email protected]> Reply-To:
Percy Wood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe; Model 415-C; Incorrect Installation of
Wing Tank Fuel Cap; ATA 2810
At 08:51 PM 12/19/03 -0800, William
R. Bayne wrote:
>Thanks for passing this on,
Bob!
Agreed. We all need to be reminded from time to
time. <<Much good verbiage deleted for
brevity>>
>An Ercoupe pilot should remove and verify
fuel and caps personally in each >tank before a cross country
departure or other such extended flight.
More Correct = All
Ercoupe Pilots should personally remove both wind tank capss and
verify fuel for All Flights. The header "gage" should be activated to
see that it goes up and down, and "floats" as though something is
there. Said gage should be marked and scrutinized often in
flight.
> Marking cap fronts with paint allows in-flight
verification of proper
> orientation,
Not a bad idea,
but much better to check before departure - see above.
>I
believe the computer term "GIGO" is applicable...garbage in,
garbage out.
Like all accident reports, a grain of salt is
needed. Thinking about what happend (Thank You, Bill and Bob)
does us all good.
"Been there, done that, got the t-shirt." I
flew with Opal Walker to the 2001 Ercoupe Owners Club annual
meeting in Terrell, Texas. Our last fuel stop was Grandbury. When we
were well on our way to Terrell, I asked Opal "Does your fuel
usually ride that low?" "Nope..." Oooopies. Spent a good fifteen
munutes looking desperatly for Terrell and watching the gage
descend. On the ground, we found the fuel cap had been put half back
on! Them's expensive varments to loose. No other
problems identified.
We went back to Roswell, New Mexico, the
same way. This time, the guy at Grandbury got that cap on
completely backwards! This time, Once-burned-twice-shy Wood here,
spotted it. Opal took the opportunity to "educate" the attendent,
and we made it back without incident.
Moral: A safe flight is
More Than no accident. Learn from each one.
Percy in
Portland
--- Outgoing mail is certified Virus
Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version:
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======================================================================== ====== To
leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search
the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers-tech/
---------------------------- From:
"roger anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Reply-To:
"roger anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
[COUPERS-TECH] Voltage regulators
Is there an Delco Remy
automotive voltage regulator number that is the same function as the
aircraft #1118259? Does anyone know if the automotive #1118070 would
match? Thanks.
---------------------------- From: "roger
anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Reply-To:
"roger anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
[COUPERS-TECH] Lean Idle Mixture
As long as I'm asking, let me
ask another question. With a Stromberg and a C85, with this sudden
really cold weather, I seem to have a lean idle mixture issue. With
carb heat out she's smooth in taking throttle and does a smooth mag
check. With carb heat in, stumbles, very rough and large mag drop,
and will even quit at low rpm. I opened the idle mixture screw a
full turn without any noticeable improvement. Could this be a float
issue. This 'Coupe is new to me, being an Aeronca guy also with an
A65 Chief. Thanks
again...Roger
---------------------------- From: "Desert
Eagle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "roger
anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[email protected]> Reply-To:
"Desert Eagle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re:
[COUPERS-TECH] Voltage regulators
Let me look in my stock, I may
have the Actual one you need. Das Desert Eagle Jimi, Owner Desert
Eagle Aviation www.hdc-nm.com/jimi Lakewood,
NM IHA #6 & EAA Member A&P, Pilot / Aerial
Photographer Contract Aircraft Builder
Is there an Delco Remy
automotive voltage regulator number that is the same function as the
aircraft #1118259? Does anyone know if the automotive #1118070 would
match?
Thanks.
============================================================================ == To
leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search
the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers-tech/
---------------------------- From:
"Hartmut Beil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Reply-To:
"Hartmut Beil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject:
Re: [COUPERS-TECH] Lean Idle Mixture
Roger. I am no Stromberg
Carb specialist, but from what you describe it appears NOT to be a idle
mixture problem you have. It is more that the mixture is too lean in
general. Providing it was not too lean just a while ago I would suspect
dirt or water in the gas. One thing I noticed recently is that if you
have some water in the gas and it makes it to the carb, it can have that
effect you describe. ( I just had that too) It take a lot of running up
& flying to get all the water out of the fuel system. Second
thing can be that you have a leak at the mixture control or bowl gasket
that allows atmospheric pressure into the carburetor bowl. The bowl is
normally vented into the carburetor throat. A air leak alters the
mixture causing a rich or lean mixture. Which brings me to the third
possibility . It happened to me and was not visible at all. An
Induction air leak at one of the following locations: Hoses, Cracked
intake pipes, loose flange bolts, loose plugs in intake port, loose
intake tubes in Lycoming engines, punctured flex tubing connecting the
carburetor to air ducting. Slight air leak in induction system you are
usually able to adjust initial idle but rough in 1,000-1,500 rpm range.
Large leaks into induction system, usually unable to throttle engine
down below 800-900 rpm. The info above is Courtesy of Sacramento
Skyranch).
I hope this gives you an idea on how to troubleshoot.
By the way, The A65 is using the same Carburetor as the C85, just
different jets are used.
Good luck - Hartmut
-----
Original Message ----- From: "roger anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent:
Saturday, December 20, 2003 6:51 PM Subject: [COUPERS-TECH] Lean Idle
Mixture
> ----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm
before following any advice in this forum.]---- > >
> As long as I'm asking, let me ask another question. With a
Stromberg and a > C85, with this sudden really cold weather, I
seem to have a lean idle > mixture issue. With carb heat out she's
smooth in taking throttle and does > a smooth mag check. With carb
heat in, stumbles, very rough and large mag > drop, and will even
quit at low rpm. I opened the idle mixture screw a full > turn
without any noticeable improvement. Could this be a float issue. >
This 'Coupe is new to me, being an Aeronca guy also with an A65
Chief. > Thanks again...Roger > >
============================================================================== >
To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm >
Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers-tech/ >
> >
----------------------------
============================================================================== To
leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search
the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers-tech/
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