I don't see how a list of numbers could, by itself, contain any meaningful 
information.  Sure, a list of numbers could be an executable program, but 
there has to be an executive program to execute the executable program.

The multiverse has to therefore consist of more than a matrix of numbers 
which amount to an executable program.

Where could the executive program have come from?   Perhaps one could call 
it "God."  I can think of no possibility other than  "It was always there," 
and eternal existence is a concept I can't imagine.  Are there any other 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Hal Ruhl" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, March 13, 2006 5:29 PM
Subject: Re: Numbers

Hi Quentin:

While numbers may contain the ability to have a discourse about themselves 
such as via Godel numbering it seems to me a substantial leap to say that 
they can have any discourse about anything else let alone a discourse to a 
degree that brings these other things into some level of existence.  This is 
because as I see it meaning beyond the self reference to other numbers is 
assigned to numbers by mechanisms external to numbers.

How could numbers "mean" my list?  Since I could arbitrarily shuffle the 
list as often as I pleased then all counting numbers would wind up mapped to 
each item on the list.  This seems a complete suppression [except for the 
self reference just mentioned] of meaning => number and/or number => meaning 
to me.  Similar to what Peter said each number would mean "red", "green", 
"mammal", etc., and each meaning would be tagged to each number.

The simplest approach IMO is to allow that my list generates numbers as 
needed [and mathematics for that matter] in various universes and assigns 
numbers meaning in those universes as and if required via the dynamic 
generated by its various divisions [see my other posts on my model].

This does not preclude the generation of sets of universes - some out of an 
infinite number of sets of universes - in which numbers act as the seed and 
thus support Bruno's machine introspection etc.  The approach seems more 
universal in its scope of allowed universes and ease of their generation.

Hal Ruhl 

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