On Jan 26, 12:16 am, John Clark <johnkcl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2012  Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > My chasing you with an ax would be no different than colon cancer or
> > heart disease chasing you. You would not project criminality on the cancer
> Yes exactly, I want any cancer in my body to die and I want the guy
> chasing me with a bloody ax to die, and I don't care one bit if either
> of them is a criminal or had bad genes or had a bad childhood,
> and I don't care if the cancer or the ax-man has free will or not
> whatever the hell that term is supposed to mean.

Of course you would care. If cancer had free will then you could make
a deal with it. If people had no free will we would would not bother
with imprisonment, we would just exterminate them.

>  > Once we understand that computers are never going to become conscious in
> > any non-trivial way, that frees us up to turn our efforts into making
> > outstanding digital servants to toil away forever for us.
> That just ain't going to happen. Having a slave that is a thousand
> times smarter than you and can think a million times faster than
> you is not a stable situation, its like balancing a pencil on its point.

They aren't smarter than us, they just do what we tell them to do
faster than people would. They have no awareness that they are slaves.

> > Logic 101 is reductionist theory. It's not reality. [...]  Maybe' is not
> > yes and it is not not-yes.
> It is my understanding that in a debate both parties try to advance
> logical reasons to support their position, but if we can't even agree
> that logical analysis is preferable to silliness and magical thinking
> then I fear there is nothing more to say.

The universe is not completely logical, just as the color blue is not
logical. It must be experienced first hand. It is not a functional
process which you can stand aloof from - we are fully immersed in the
universe, as is logic. The reality of the universe does not have to
fit in with logic, logic helps us understand but it is ultimately
limited when dealing with ultimate questions about consciousness.


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