On Wed, Aug 8, 2012 at 11:57 PM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote:

>  On 8/8/2012 2:31 PM, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote:
>  So, according to you, we're always wrong to deny the existence of
>> anything because to do so brings it into existence.  We can't even have a
>> clear conception of it without affirming its existence.  I suppose that
>> will find adherents on something called the "Everything" list, but think
>> it's just intellectual mush.
> No, on your first statement. I clearly stated in the last post, that it's
> tricky navigating between tendencies to believe/entrance/enthrall ourselves
> and denial/amnesia. Because of this, a clear conception that you rightfully
> demand, cannot be sacrificed: what happened in so called "fascist"
> governments? What is happening "war on drugs, prohibition etc."? I consider
> these to be highly fruitful questions in the sense of studying a paradox,
> but I refuse to position myself relative to their obvious absurdity in a
> "are you for or against" sense.
> Sure, they exist and of course we should study them. But in so doing we
> invariably have to navigate tricky terrain between our capacity to entrance
> ourselves/reification and denial, because we will believe or disbelieve to
> some degree in order for a clearer conception to emerge. For any observer
> after observation nothing's void of belief to some degree. People tend to
> call them, using evasive maneuver, "working hypothesis" in their papers,
> dissertations etc. but this denial of belief implies the same spectrum.
> Otherwise belief has to be subject to time constraints, which is of course
> nonsense.
> OK, so is there anything that *doesn't* exist?
> Brent

Both in absolute terms or in a bounded sense, there are the usual options:
Take your pick, and make Hawking wrong. I'm not here to convince you,
merely suggesting the possibility of our distance/involvement with beliefs
to have some bearing on their expression, which weakens somewhat the
absolute status of whether we affirm or deny.

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