On 9/10/2012 7:57 AM, benjayk wrote:

Bruno Marchal wrote:

On 08 Sep 2012, at 16:08, benjayk wrote:

Bruno Marchal wrote:

On 07 Sep 2012, at 14:22, benjayk wrote:

Bruno Marchal wrote:

On 06 Sep 2012, at 13:31, benjayk wrote:

Quantum effects beyond individual brains (suggested by psi)
can't be
computed as well: No matter what I compute in my brain, this
entangle it with other brains since computation is classical.
The UD emulates all quantum computer, as they do not violate Church
I am not talking about quantum computers, which are not entangled
with their
I am talking about systems that are entangled to other systems.
This is just lowering the comp level of substitution. It does not
change the reasoning, thanks to the use of the notion of "generalized
It does, because you can't simulate indefinite entanglement. No
matter how
many entangled systems you simulate, you are always missing the
of this combined system to another (which may be as crucial as the
itself, because it may lead to a very different unfoldment of events).
To use this argument, you need to postulate that the physical universe
exists and is describe by a quantum garden of Eden, that is a infinite
quantum pattern, and that *you* are that pattern.
In that case, you are just working in a different theory than the comp
theory, and are out of the scope of my expertize. But then develop
your theory.
Nope. I am not saying that is the case (though I do believe that such
entanglement exists), I am just saying that COMP does not exclude that
possibility. Whether or not some digital substitution exists, what is
required to correctly implement it (which also is part of yourself) may
itself be not be emulable in the sense that your reasoning requires.
I remind you, COMP does not say "we are digital", it says that a correctly
implemented digital substitution may substitute my current brain/body. It
does not say that this can't require some non-digital component (you are
still getting an artificial brain/body).

I think this is why Bruno sometimes allows that the level of substitution may not only be low (molecular, quantum,...) but also extensive: local Earth envrionment, galaxy, universe,... But when you consider extensive 'substitution' it just turns into saying the universe is computable.


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