Hi Bruno and Richard, 

I prefer not to refer to consciousness other than
it simply being the action by the observer of perception, 
true or not. God or the One, who/which are at the end of the
chain of events. Consciousness is overtly like an eye looking into
a telescope or microscope. Firstness, raw perception.


[Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net]
12/12/2012 
"Forever is a long time, especially near the end." -Woody Allen

----- Receiving the following content ----- 
From: Bruno Marchal 
Receiver: everything-list 
Time: 2012-12-10, 11:42:13
Subject: Re: Avoiding the use of the word God


Richard,

On 10 Dec 2012, at 16:17, Richard Ruquist wrote:

> Roger Bruno,
> How is consciousness related to god?
> It seems like the beginning of an infinite god regression.

God = Truth (Plato). OK? With the CTM, arithmetical truth is enough 
(and a tiny provable part is enough for the ontology).

I would say that consciousness is a form of knowledge.
Knowledge intersects belief and truth. (It is a private undefinable 
notion, with CTM).
The knower in you is the "inner God", which is God restricted by the 
universal window of your brain/body.

I don't know if God (truth) is conscious, but without God (truth) I 
doubt I could be conscious, even if most of the content of my 
consciousness is wrong (except on the indubitable fixed point, and 
perhaops the sharablke oart of math, arithmetic, perhaps).

I have no certainties, and that is why I use the arithmetical 
translation of Plotinus in such conversation, with
God = Arithmetical Truth
Believable = (sigma_1) provable = universal (L?ian) machine
Knowable = the same, but true (unlike proved) = the inner god = the 
universal soul
intelligible matter = the same as 'believable", but together with 
consistence
sensible matter = the same as intelligible matter, but as true

That gives eight modalities, as they divided by incompleteness (except 
God and the Soul).

If G?el's incompleteness theorem was wrong, all those modalities 
would collapse. Despite the modalities extension is the same set of 
arithmetical propositions, the machine cannot knows that, and this 
change drastically the logic of the modalities.
Roughly speaking, "God" obeys classical logic, the "Universal Soul" 
obeys intuitionist logic, and the two matters obeys (different) 
quantum logics, perhaps even linear (with some luck!)

Bruno


> Richard
>
> On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 9:56 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> 
> wrote:
>>
>> On 10 Dec 2012, at 14:33, Roger Clough wrote:
>>
>> Hi Stephen P. King
>>
>> God is what/who is looking through the supreme monad,
>> not the supreme monad itself.
>>
>>
>> Nice!
>>
>> Even closer to CTM(*):
>>
>> God is what/who is looking through the supreme monads,
>> not any supreme monad itself.
>>
>> Bruno
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> (*) Alias comp, digital mechanism, .... CTM is for Computationalist 
>> Theory
>> of Mind, and the "yes doctor" + Church thesis is among the weakest
>> assumptions. CTM acronym might be better than "comp" to avoid 
>> confusion with
>> computationalist physicalism (digital physics, DP) which is sometimes
>> confused with comp. I have often explain why Digital Physics is
>> self-contradictory (or made us into zombie, eliminate consciousness 
>> and
>> first person).
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net]
>> 12/10/2012
>> "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." -Woody Allen
>>
>>
>> ----- Receiving the following content -----
>> From: Stephen P. King
>> Receiver: everything-list
>> Time: 2012-12-09, 13:05:26
>> Subject: Re: Avoiding the use of the word God
>>
>> On 12/9/2012 7:54 AM, Richard Ruquist wrote:
>>> Roger,
>>> The monads are collectively god
>>
>> Dear Roger and Richard,
>>
>> This is what I have come to believe about Monads as well. They 
>> are
>> collectively God, they do not have an absolute hierarchy. Their 
>> relation
>> is more like what we see in a neural network
>>
>>> That's is likely what Newton would believe
>>> and most likely what Liebnitz really believed in
>>> but was afraid to express.
>>> Richard
>>>
>>> On Sun, Dec 9, 2012 at 7:43 AM, Roger Clough <rclo...@verizon.net> 
>>> wrote:
>>>> Hi Richard Ruquist
>>>>
>>>> Newton believed in numbers but was still a christian.
>>>>
>>>> [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net]
>>>> 12/9/2012
>>>> "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." -Woody Allen
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Onward!
>>
>> Stephen
>>
>>
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