On 10 Feb 2013, at 22:01, Craig Weinberg wrote:

On Sunday, February 10, 2013 10:41:23 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote:

On 09 Feb 2013, at 15:14, Craig Weinberg wrote:

On Saturday, February 9, 2013 8:15:21 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote:

On 08 Feb 2013, at 21:38, meekerdb wrote:

On 2/8/2013 12:31 AM, Kim Jones wrote:

Which is a profound problem that we can lay right at the door of LANGUAGE. Language is indeed a self-serving thing. A description of something is a dance of language, not a dance of PERCEPTION. Perception is often throttled by the processes of language. We need to move beyond words. This is the importance of math and music (which is audible math IMO.)

That seems contradictory. Mathematics is very restricted language - declaratory sentences, logically consistent.

Mathematics is not a language at all. You might be confusing mathematics and the theories used to put some light on some mathematical reality.

Then Spanish and French and Italian aren't languages either. People might confuse them with the linguistic theories used to put some light on some semiotic reality.

Not at all. Spanish and French and Italian are languages. They define strings of symbols, having meaning, which can be on some subject matter, but they are different from the subject matter.

Only non-mathematician confuse the mathematical language (that exists too) and the mathematic subject matter (number, geometrical shapes, algebras, mathematical structures, etc.).

That just makes a straw man of non-mathematical language. The romance language subject matter (description, instruction, nouns, articles, adjectives, literary structures, etc) are also not limited to their immediate syntax. I never said that math referred only to it's own expression, but neither does any language.

Good, that's my point. Math is not language, it is the object of study of mathematicians, which of course will use some languages to talk about their subject matter.


Also most mathematicians don't care so much about logical consistency. That notion is studied by logicians, but with few incidence on the doing of mathematicians. Logic is just another branch of math, with its own purpose. It can have application in math, or not.

What branches of math contain no logic?

What branches of anything does not contain logic?

Color, flavor, pain, pleasure, love, imagination, feeling, intuition, etc.

That are no branches. And those notions can involve this or that logics, depending on the theories we assume.

Everyday life is full of logic.

But it isn't necessarily full of math (as tribes like the Pirahã reveal).

The tribes of pirahã have no problem with math. They use the math they need, as everyone else.



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