On Wednesday, March 20, 2013 2:39:40 PM UTC, Craig Weinberg wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, March 20, 2013 12:44:02 AM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: >> >> On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 2:17 PM, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]>wrote: >> >> > Correlation, even 100% correlation, does not equal causation. >> >> >> BULLSHIT! If when X is changed there is ALWAYS a change in Y in the same >> direction, and when Y changes you can ALWAYS find a change in X that >> preceded it, then X causes Y. IT'S WHAT THE WORD "CAUSES" MEANS! >> > > Two flowers bloom at sunrise every day without fail. Does one cause the > other to bloom? Do the flowers cause the sun to rise? > > Instead of two flowers, think of one flower that blooms at sunrise, and > something else that happens at sunrise that is completely unlike a flower - > like a particular song plays. If we apply this metaphorically to > consciousness, then the flower and the music are two perpendicular, > correlated expressions of the sunrise. Our subjective consciousness is the > music, and it is part of a history of music going back to the dawn of time, > and the flower is what the music looks like from the outside, and it has a > separate history of plants going back to the dawn of botany or matter. > > Hello, sorry to want to get involved ;-) I always hear an audible click very shortly after I see the light switch on. There is no direct causation, but the two phenomena are both related via the action of my finger, which if I am technologically unsophisticated may not be obvious (think of cargo cults.) Are you suggesting it might be a similar mistake to say that neural events cause qualia? i.e. there could be an as yet hidden cause for both.
>> > Two unrelated systems can both be related to a third, >>> >> >> If they are both related to the same thing then they are not unrelated. >> > > They can be unrelated except for their mutual relation to the third thing > though, obviously. > > Craig > > >> >> John K Clark >> >> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
