I happen to read the intro summary of the e-book (annonced on another list):
*Scientific Hinduism*: Bringing Science and Hinduism Closer via Extended Dual-Aspect Monism (Dvi-Pak?a Advaita) *By Ram Lakhan Pandey Vimal* (Vision Research Institute, 25 Rita Street, Lowell, MA 01854 and 428 Great Road, Suite 11, Acton, MA 01720 USA; Dristi Anusandhana Sansthana, A-60 Umed Park, Sola Road, Ahmedabad-61, Gujrat, India; Dristi Anusandhana Sansthana, c/o NiceTech Computer Education Institute, Pendra, Bilaspur, C.G. 495119, India; and Dristi Anusandhana Sansthana, Sai Niwas, East of Hanuman Mandir, Betiahata, Gorakhpur, U.P. 273001, India rlpvi...@yahoo.co.in; http://sites.google.com/site/rlpvimal/HomeScientificHinduism: Bringing Science and Hinduism Closer via Extended Dual- ua---Aspect Monism (the DAMv framework: Dvi Aspect Monism (the DAMv framework: Dvi Aspect Monism (the DAMv framework: Dvi----Pak PaPa Pak?a Advaita) a Advaita) RLP Vimal RLP Vimal) in which the Hindu belief system is portraited as th only religion and 'a' soul (mind) has its extra life (existnece) while in connection with the body: as a persona entity. Not far from *Bruno's "God created the natural numbers and said add and multiply..." *(* *indeed a pleonasm, since multiplication is a multiple form of addition) neglecting my* ignorance *about whom is he referring to. IMO with so much assumed not knowing about it is easy to devise (personal?) belief systems and complement them to worldviews (religions) including our conventional sciences. Materialism is a narrowed-down* idealism* of a world based on primitive physical observations of the past. Idealism proper is a free fantasy. Hinduism and more western religions are made-up from make-believe fundamentals according to the founder theories. (Many of them??) Whoever cannot live without a firm believe about the world should stick his head into the sand and be happy. I am not happy with agnosticism, but that is the most I can achieve. In - M Y - belief system I postulate lots of pertinent details we cannot have any idea about and take everything as conditional: "if they do not interfere with some newer info acquisition". Otherwise I am OK. John M On Thu, Jul 4, 2013 at 8:31 AM, <spudboy...@aol.com> wrote: > Interesting Dr. Marchal, > > Do you hold that Dr. Robert Lanza and Bob Berman, may be on to something > then? Lanza is a cell biologist, and Berman is an astronomer. They, > together, came up with the theory of biocentrism, as the trigger to make > probability real. That life, even at its simplest structures (bacteria) act > as an observer to sense the universe, out of a cloud of probabilities > swirling around us. That, life consciously, and unconsciously selects the > physical cosmos. They have called it the Biocentrsm Theory. Maybe life is > what causes the math to process as axioms, as programs (if you are a > Stephen Wolfram fan?) to emerge from the great probability 'cloud.' Or, am > I misunderstanding what you have intended? In both cases, yours, and > theirs, there is no specific, physical universe, because it chrystalizes > out of observation. > > In Charlie Stross's work of science fiction, Accelerondo, Stross posits > that the Big Bang was a statistical computation that ran over 14 billion > years ago, and we are the remnant of the statistical processing. > > Mitch > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> > To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> > Sent: Thu, Jul 4, 2013 3:22 am > Subject: Re: Materialism and Buddhism > > > On 03 Jul 2013, at 23:48, spudboy...@aol.com wrote: > > Dr. Marchal, > > Hello. > > It's not an opinion, but a question motivated by observation. It doesn't > make this point of view, axiomatically, correct. But, I do feel this issue > needs to be addressed at some point, via scientific measure. The question > is how? What would be our motivation to undertake this study-do > non-material things exist? Can non-material object exist. Or am I asking do > non-existing objects exist? Or, do non-material things exist elsewhere in > our universe, but a difficult to ordinarily detect? > > > You seem to assume that there is a physical universe. I don't assume > that. > You seem to assume Aristotle idea that what exist = what we can see, or > observe, measure ... but the ancient dream argument already show that such > inference is not valid. > > God created the natural numbers and said add and multiply. All the rest > are dreams which exist due to the Turing universality of "add and multiply". > > You might have a difficulty to conceive that "physical existence" might > not be a primitive existence. Platonist have at the start doubt that the > physical reality is not a sort of illusion. Comp explains that oit might be > more rational to think so. > > Bruno > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> > To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> > Sent: Wed, Jul 3, 2013 3:59 pm > Subject: Re: Materialism and Buddhism > > > On 03 Jul 2013, at 20:46, spudboy...@aol.com wrote: > > Not to be a jerk, but can someone give us an example of non-materialism? > Even human thoughts is neurons and chemicals sizzling away in the skull. > > > This is your assumption. But Platonist believed that this view might be > wrong. And I argue that if we are machine, it ill be easier to explain the > illusion of matter to conscious number relations (like what computer > handled) than to expolain the illusion of consciousness to material things. > > > > > > > > > > > Is not Ontology a discussion on what exists? > > > > Yes, and with comp, you can consider that only 0 and its successor > exists, and that they obey to some laws (succession, addition, > multiplication: that's enough). Then you can prove in that theory that all > pieces of computations exist, and that matter appears, in the conscious > relative numbers as a stable illusion, obeying laws, etc. > > > > > > (Epistemology is what is knowledge or what do we know? If I remember > right). > > > Yes. > > > > Can it then be said, via math that non-material objects exists? > > > They certainly exists in the logical sense: that we can prove that prime > number exists once we accept that 0 exist. > Does it really exist? But that is a new notion, and if you use it you have > to define it. > > > > If no intelligence is alive to perform the neuron actions sufficient to > comprehend or even search for the non-material, then perhaps it cannot > exist? > > > With comp we can more easily define intelligence in arithmetic than in > physical terms. > > Don't take this as true, but arithmetic gives an example of rational, > objective idealism, where matter apperance can emerge from infinities of > number relations. > > Other idealism exist by assuming that the fundamental reality is > consciousness, or God, or whatever considered as being outside the physical > realm. > > Bruno > > > > > > Mitch > -----Original Message----- > From: Pierz <pier...@gmail.com> > To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> > Sent: Wed, Jul 3, 2013 2:22 pm > Subject: Materialism and Buddhism > > I studied Mahajana Tibetan Buddhism in Dharamsala (home of the Dalai Lama in > exile) back in the day and I agree with Bruno and others that Buddhism is > closer > to idealism than materialism. However Buddhism ultimately rejects 'mind' too, > since what we think of as mind is closely related to the personal self. The > ultimate reality in Buddhism is nirvana or the void and all phenomena > including > mental phenomena are empty of inherent existence. It is 'a-theistic' in the > sense that this ultimate reality is not a being like a god with an identity > and > thoughts. However Tibetan Buddhism, like other forms, does believe in the idea > of god-like (and demon-like) beings in the phenomenal realms. To equate > Buddhism > with materialism on the basis of a few selected quotes would constitute a > highly > tendentious reading of the dharma and in my view is quite wrong. There is no > possibility of liberation in materialism and the phenomenal world is seen as > the > 'real world', the very antithesis of the Buddhist view. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email > to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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