On Tuesday, January 21, 2014 11:08:45 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote: > > On 22 January 2014 15:04, Craig Weinberg <[email protected] <javascript:> > > wrote: > >> Computation is the nested, recursive enumeration of uniform symbolic >> bodies. The effectiveness of computation derives from its metaphorical >> application to material bodies, which can, through physical properties, be >> manipulated to deliver results which satisfy our expectations. >> > > Sorry to be dense but what *is* "the nested, recursive enumeration of > uniform symbolic bodies" ? > >> >> Computation is not consciousness or sensation. It has no qualities of its >> own, and a computer would be just as happy producing Mandelbrot sets as >> noise, just as abacus beads are just as happy in a pattern that we might >> find meaningful versus one which seems random. >> > > I'm not sure if you are trying to imply something about the nature of the > brain and consciousness here, or not. Presumably brain cells "would be just > as happy" recognising granny or solving equations - that is, brain cells > take in signals from other brain cells, and if the sum of these exceeds > some threshold, they send out a signal of their own. This seems fairly > similar to what NAND gates do inside a computer. (Or what the cogs in a > difference engine do, or the floating weights in the Olympia computer do, > etc.) > > So one could equally well say, "what brain cells do is not consciousness > or sensation". >
Yes, although what we think brain cells are is based only on the measurements and descriptions that we have derived from our body's view of other instrument's views. > Yes presumably brain cells, when lumped together into a brain, manage to > *produce* consciousness and sensation, and apparently they do this > through a process that is at least somewhat similar to what the logic gates > inside computers do. > I would not presume that. Brain cells are never lumped together into a brain, they reproduce themselves from a single zygote splitting apart. They don't produce consciousness, they already are consciousness on the microbiotic scale (relative to our own). I don't think that consciousness is not produced, it is attenuated from the Totality. > > So, to clarify, are you claiming that consciousness *cannot be produced > by* computation, > Yes. > or just making the observation that the process of computation is not the > same thing as consciousness or sensation, much as my brain isn't the same > thing as my thoughts? > Consciousness uses computation to offload that which is too monotonous to find meaningful any longer. That is the function of computation, automation, and mechanism in all cases: To remove or displace the necessity for consciousness. What is the opposite of automatic? Manual. What is manual? By hand - intentional, personal, aware. See what I mean? Thanks, Craig -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
