On Tuesday, February 4, 2014 12:19:42 AM UTC, Liz R wrote: > > On 4 February 2014 12:44, Edgar L. Owen <[email protected] <javascript:>>wrote: > >> Liz, >> >> You keep repeating your UNSUBSTANTIATED claim that both Newton and >> Einstein believed in block time. >> > > It isn't a question of belief. Newtonian and Einsteinian machanics both > imply the existence of a block universe. > > I've repeatedly asked you to substantiate this claim with some actual >> quotes from them but you have been unable to do so. >> > Please provide quotes substantiating this or withdraw the claim. That's >> only fair... >> > > Obviously Newton didn't use that phrase. Equally obviously it's implied by > his equations, as Laplace realised. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laplace%27s_demon > > We may regard the present state of the universe as the effect of its past > and the cause of its future. An intellect which at a certain moment would > know all forces that set nature in motion, and all positions of all items > of which nature is composed, if this intellect were also vast enough to > submit these data to analysis, it would embrace in a single formula the > movements of the greatest bodies of the universe and those of the tiniest > atom; for such an intellect nothing would be uncertain and the future just > like the past would be present before its eyes. > —Pierre Simon Laplace, *A Philosophical Essay on > Probabilities*[3]<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laplace%27s_demon#cite_note-Truscott-3> > > Einstein's equations shows that space-time is a 4D manifold, as Minkowski > pointed out. His "canonical" quote on this is: > > The views of space and time which I wish to lay before you have sprung >> from the soil of experimental physics, and therein lies their strength. >> They are radical. Henceforth space by itself, and time by itself, are >> doomed to fade away into mere shadows, and only a kind of union of the two >> will preserve an independent reality. >> > > >> — Hermann Minkowski >> > > Otherwise, just read papers on the subject of SR. It isn't a secret that > SR treats space-time as a 4D manifold. > > Here is an introduction to the subject: > > http://www.phy.syr.edu/courses/modules/LIGHTCONE/minkowski.html > Liz - I was just thinking. If Newton's world predicted a variant of blocktime. What is that saying, given Newton's world wasn't correct? Or was it based some aspect that is correct? But is the sense that blocktime comes out of newton's world, compatible with relativity? Are both legitimate equivalent representations of the same consistent thing? Or is the Newton in fact no longer thought correct. What does it mean if something that isn't correct gets blocktime? Is that strengthening the case for blocktime or raising a doubt that it is objectively real, given it arises as an artefact of the same kind of interpretative activity on an edge of a theory? Just wondering.
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